Talk:Susanoo

Can Sasuke use Susanoo/Tsukuyomi
There is another mistranslation going round and hopefully I can correct it here. According to some people, Madara tells Sasuke that Itachi planted all his eye techniques in him. This has been mistranslated.

In chapter 397, on page 11, Madara tells Sasuke:. Translated to English, this would become: "At last... For your sake he injected his own eye power inside you". He never says "all eye powers," which means it's still unknown whether or not Sasuke can actually use any of Itachi's other jutsu, besides Amaterasu. In fact, it's also unknown if that Amaterasu was anything more then a one-time thing.

Just for reference, if Madara had said "all eye powers," he would have used .--ShounenSuki 19:05, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * But by that same token, "injected his own eye power" could presumably add Tsukuyomi and Susano'o. Which is why both of those techniques have Sasuke labled as (Presumably).--TheUltimate3 19:09, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * True, it's about 50/50 in my opinion. However, I don't think we should add such speculation to the article. Sasuke never used Tsukuyomi and Susanoo, there is no clear evidence he can use those techniques, so we shouldn't say he can. Even if we add presumably, since it's just as presumable that he can't use them. --ShounenSuki 19:38, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * To revive this in regards to the page's protection, Sasuke should not be listed as a user, presumed or otherwise. The translation suggesting he can use it is outdated, open to interpretation, and Sasuke himself has yet to use anything other than Amaterasu. To that end, a wiki should present information that is accurate, not information that might be. ~SnapperTo 21:06, 11 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree with SnapperTo. In retrospect, especially considering the information gained from the third databook, it's obvious Madara referred only to the Amaterasu Itachi sealed into Sasuke's Sharingan with his Transcription Seal: Amaterasu. There is no way to tell if Sasuke can use Tsukuyomi or Susanoo until we've seen him use it. We can't just assume he'll be able to use them just because Itachi could. --ShounenSuki 21:31, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

Third databook
I was able to find a scan of Susanoo's article in the third databook (thanks to whoever uploaded it). If you want to see it, go here. I'll add some of the details. --ShounenSuki 20:02, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Susanoo
wouldn't this be classified as both a ninjutsu and genjutsu?


 * Its a Kekkai Genkai...Please sign u'r comments..AlienGamer | Talk 20:12, 26 May 2009 (UTC)

Why would it be classified as Genjutsu?Kracel (talk) 21:15, December 30, 2009 (UTC)

madara
shouldn't we put Madara as a user, because Itachi said that Madar could use all four Mangekyo techniques?

No becouse it was never shown if it is shown we will put it.Kyuubinaruto123 (talk) 20:24, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Itachi said Madara's flawless mangekyo sharingan gave birth to a new eye technique, which doesn't necessarily mean a 4th jutsu.Wreiad (talk) 22:39, October 5, 2009 (UTC)

madara himself also stated that for a sharingan user to activate the susanoo is an extremely rare ocasion. from what we know and seen madara may have the ability to use the tsukuyomi. he says that when he's explaining the moon's eye plan to the kages. that he was going to use the 10 tails and magnify the power of his eyes and cast a tsukuyomi. but to use susanoo he also requires amaterasu. he has not made any statementes of having it or susanoo. so i'd say he has tsukuyomi and a super developed version of kamui.

Yata no Kagami
A spiritual shield that does not possess a physical form. It has all the "Seishitsu Henka" (Element modifying ability) capabilities and can nullify all jutsu by changing its own elemental nature accordingly.
 * or

Yata no Kagami (Sword of Yata) - An incorporeal shield. It possesses all the chakra qualities (elements) and is able to render any attack vain by changing its own quality accordingly

Is that true? I mean, is it confirm in the Databook 3 Page 274-275?
 * Yes it's been confirmed; you can read Shounensuki's translations.

http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45246 Wreiad (talk) 04:58, October 3, 2009 (UTC)

Double Sharingan?
I know Sasuke has the Double sharingan and he said that only those who can control the double sharingan can summon susanoo but why did Itachi have susanoo he didn't have a double sharingan. Kyuubinaruto123 (talk) 17:05, September 17, 2009 (UTC)


 * You misunderstand. Using Susanoo requires mastering the Mangekyo Sharingan one has in each eye. Itachi did that, and now so has Sasuke. ~SnapperTo 17:31, September 17, 2009 (UTC)


 * Oh ok that makes sense i was confused by that.Kyuubinaruto123 (talk) 17:34, September 17, 2009 (UTC)

Actually i can explain what Sauske meant. As stated many times, both Itachi and Sauske have Amaterasu in one eye and Tsukuyomi in the other eye. Logically, if a user focuses on only one of these techniques, he wouldn't be skilled in the other(Meaning he'd only be skilled in one of his eyes) However, once a user of the Mangekyo Sharingan masters both of these eye techniques, it means that he has mastered both of his eyes, making him able to use a third technique: Susanoo

Also, i studied it a bit more, and, Amaterasu is put down as a Ninjutsu, where Tsukuyomi is labeled a Genjutsu. Many times have i heard people refer to Susanoo as a Ninjutsu/Genjutsu. Where I'm getting at is that by mastering the Mangekyo's 2 eye's, one of ninjutsu and one of genjutsu, you unlock a third jutsu which is classified as Ninjutsu/Genjutsu. If you read my comment above, then this is all i have to say, so ya, this is what Sauske meant

Third Mystical weapon?
Uchiha Itachi had 2 of the three Mystical weapons (Mirror of Yata and Totsuka Blade) but I looked up the third and it is said to be a jeweled necklace made of a jade ston the brings out Amaterasu. Could this necklace be Naruto's Necklace?
 * Firstly, even the possible existence of a third "mystical weapon" is pure speculation at the moment. Secondly, if there was such an object, the necklace worn by the Sage of the Six Paths fits the description much more closely. Thirdly, if you look up all the "mystical weapons," or the Three Treasures as they are called in real life, you'll find that the Totsuka sword isn't one of them. They are the Yata Mirror, the Kusanagi Sword, and the Yasakani Jewel. --ShounenSuki (talk 19:36, September 21, 2009 (UTC)

Then what is sasuke's susanoo's new bow?

Sasuke's Susanoo
Are you sure Sasuke's Susanoo is using the legendary Totsuka no Tsurugi? Shouldn't the sword 'comes' out from a sake jar held by a third hand? I don't think Sasuke's Susanoo is using the legendary sword.
 * The jar may have been there, but out of focus. No one can say for sure at the moment.Wreiad (talk) 04:50, October 3, 2009 (UTC)

6 fingers on one hand
check here: http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/465/01/ ;it shows susanoo having 6 fingers on his left hand... and has 5 fingers on his right hand.. that's a bit weird http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/465/06/ -llVIU

I think so too. Sasuke haven't used it yet.So we'll see.Itachi could have transfered that Jutsu too

I don't think so. Why would he? His main concern at that point was to protect Sasuke from Madara, so he gave him Amaterasu. As for the 6 fingers, you're right. It's shown on the first page, and I doubt it's an artist's error. TomServo101 (talk) 14:34, September 29, 2009 (UTC)


 * what the hell are you talking about.. sasuke used susano it shows in the last chapters and sasuke says that it's susano and he has no reason to lie -llVIU


 * Thats his own Mangekyo..not Itachi's..--AlienGamer--Talk (contribs)-- 14:08, October 3, 2009 (UTC)

actually....... sasuke's susanoo has 6 fingers in all hands.

Flaws
Sasuke’s Susano is still inprefect; Raikage could snap a bone and Mizukage’s Boil Release could melt them.
 * I don't understand that reasoning based on what you use to back it up. Susanoo was not armored and also equipped with his shield, which is what makes it "invincible". Keep in mind that the kages where able to damage mere ribcages, not the same whole skeletal structure that withstood 4 attacks in chapter 464. That's not a good reason as to why it's "imperfect". The only real flaw of Susanoo would be the fact that it drains the user's lifeforce and has a significant impact on their physical abilities (Taijutsu etc).Wreiad (talk) 19:41, October 21, 2009 (UTC)

We know that his susanoo is not complete, but you are not correct, like he said, it was just ribs that he cracked, a mere part of susanoo not even close to its full power --Sauske-Blaze (talk) 02:07, October 26, 2009 (UTC)Sauske-Blaze

Totsuka no Tsurugi
Wikipedia states that the sword Susanoo used was called Worochi no Ara-masa, and they have a good source for it. Though the Kojiki version does mention a "ten-grasp sabre". Why are there 2 different swords?
 * Many gods and objects have many, many different names. A different name doesn't imply a different object., , ; they are all just different names for the same object. Totsuka-no-Tsurugi is simply the most commenly used name. juts like how Amaterasu-Ōmikami can also be called or how the Kusanagi-no-Tsurugi can also be called the , the , or the . --ShounenSuki (talk 00:18, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

Life Energy
"To sustain Susanoo, the user must act as a medium for the spirit, allowing it to consume their life force energy. ", "Prolonged use will lead to the user's death." Ok then if life force energy is chakra, how is that any different from using/overusing any other jutsu? Simant (talk) 19:20, November 10, 2009 (UTC)


 * Sasuke's body isn't a medium for Chidori? ~SnapperTo 20:26, November 10, 2009 (UTC)
 * Well doesn't that assume that Susanoo is a summon or alive on its own, is it not the same kind of ninjutsu as Dead Demon Consuming Seal, that uses the death god, which is not a medium, but in fact the jutsu. Simant (talk) 20:42, November 10, 2009 (UTC)

I would not say that susanoo is a summon, at the end of manga chapter 391, itachi states that susanoo is the last weapon in 'his' arsenal key word being his. Summons are independent beings who, and have been shown, arent always corporative in helpin the summoner in a battle. I would say that susanoo is just a jutsu that only can be used with the sharingan, and not a summon

sry, this message and the one above are by me--> --Sauske-Blaze (talk) 03:01, November 14, 2009 (UTC)Sauske-Blaze

Susanoo is not a summon. When using a summon, a ninja will use his chakra in order to call upon creatures existing in the physical world. Once the creature has been summoned, the technique does not require any more of the ninja's chakra. Susanoo, as I understand it, is a technique where the ninja will call upon an dark spirit and allow that spirit to feed on his soul in exchange for the spirit's power. If the ninja only uses a partial susanoo, the spirit consumes less of his soul than if he uses a complete susanoo. Since a person cannot live without a soul, it is easy to see how prolonged or repeated use of such a technique would result in death, as it did for Itachi. Although it has yet to be confirmed, I suspect that tsukuyomi, amaterasu, and susanoo are all spiritual techniques that involve opening hell and allowing a portion of the soul to be consumed. Tsukuyomi allows the ninja to show their enemy a glimpse into the reality of hell via genjutsu. Amaterasu allows the ninja to pull hell's flames into this dimension via ninjutsu. Susanoo allows the ninja to temporarily bring an entity from hell into our dimension. In the case of mangekyo sharingan, the eyes are, quite literally, the windows to the soul. As seen in itachi's case, once the ninja's soul has been completely consumed the eyes turn completely blank and the user dies.

Finally
I think now we can be sure that Sasuke's Susanoo is a lesser version of itachi. Since he can only summon the skeletal structure of the spirit. Hope someone more eloquent could correct the article. Neji uchiha (talk) 00:40, December 4, 2009 (UTC)

Sauskes is not yet complete it clearly says that in the manga

sry, this and that last note are by ---> --Sauske-Blaze (talk) 01:32, December 4, 2009 (UTC)Sauske-Blaze

yes its true that the initial versions of sasuke's susanoo were weaker than itachi's. he only completed it in the recent chapter 484.(and its very similar to itachi's) (Darksusanoo (talk) 23:53, March 2, 2010 (UTC))

Totsuka Sword
since the totsuka sword is capable of sealing anything it pierces, is there a way to release the objects sealed by it or are the objects sealed forever sealed? --75.2.217.57 (talk) 07:24, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

Zetsu has stated that the victim inside of totsuka sword is sealed in permanent genjutsu. Ttogafer (talk) 12:03, December 12, 2009 (UTC)

shield
does the yata shield change a jutsu's element to make it more suitable for defending against or wat because i find the shield's ability kind of cloudy. --75.2.217.57 (talk) 05:10, December 16, 2009 (UTC)
 * It changes its own nature to match the incoming technique's. In other words, if it had to defend against a Fire Release, it would change its own nature to Water. --ShounenSuki (talk 08:04, December 16, 2009 (UTC)

Two characters
If two characters were to simultaneously use Susanoo, what would happen because I don't think there are two of each of the treasures/weapons. --75.2.217.57 (talk) 01:45, December 17, 2009 (UTC)

As of what we know, Itachi was the only person that had them. Although Sasuke's version has also displayed a sword we don't know yet if it's the Totsuga Sword. Art-is-a-blast (talk) 18:21, December 18, 2009 (UTC)
 * The sword was very much implied in the databook entry that it's a trait of the jutsu itself and not the user.Wreiad (talk) 02:36, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Fuinjutsu
Shouldn't fuinjutsu be added to Susanoo's classification, because Susanoo can seal anything it's blade pierces in some genjutsu-like realm (I don't fully understand that)--Erik1310 (talk) 12:03, December 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * The third data book only classifies it as a ninjutsu and a kekkei genkai. ~SnapperTo 19:11, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

That was the sword's power only. Itachi's susanoo had the sword, and theres been no evidence sasuke has it. DemonFoxsCloak (talk) 21:14, January 14, 2010 (UTC)

Sasuke's version
Ugh, Sasuke doesn't use the Ribcage version anymore and upgraded it to the Dark Susano'o thing. The discription make it seems like Sasuke is still at the Ribcage stage and still uses that while the dark susano'o is just thrown there as an appearance description. --TekkenStorm (talk) 16:23, January 1, 2010 (UTC)
 * He still uses the ribcage. It kind of does sound like he mostly uses the ribcage, but there is certainly adequate mention of the more complete, "Dark Susano'o" version.--Enoki911 (talk) 05:26, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

possible link to Bijuu
both have red energy...

So, we no that its not linked to the biju that wouldnt make sense, these arent forums, if you want to say things like that, please use the forums --Sauske-Blaze (talk) 23:46, January 9, 2010 (UTC)Sauske-Blaze

Sasuke's Susanoo and Itachi's Susanoo
I think that sasuke's susanoo is dark blue verry dark blue and its deferent from itachi's susanoo i think that is because of the sharingan you know that sasuke's MS is Black Red not like the other that are Red Black that might be the reason for the deferent colors of the susanoos --Petar93 (talk) 21:39, January 14, 2010 (UTC)

not quite. each MS shape is unique to the user. that does not afect the jutsu. what does make sasuke's susanoo diferent is that it's linked to sasuke's dark chakra and emotions.

sasuke's picture
please change the sasuke's picture to his completed susanoo --94.183.154.188 (talk) 09:06, January 15, 2010 (UTC)

thank U very much --94.183.154.89 (talk) 07:04, January 16, 2010 (UTC)

Request?
Could someone create a gallery of the Susanoo's stages? Thank you--- --84.250.189.106 (talk) 19:55, January 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * I really don't think there are any stages per say.Wreiad (talk) 21:25, January 16, 2010 (UTC)

yeah there aren't stages that before you saw was just an uncompleted version of susanoo --Petar93 (talk) 11:04, January 17, 2010 (UTC)

the ARROW or the TOTSUKA sword?
is the arrow that sasuke uses with his susanoo the same totsuka sword or is it another thing?if it is the same blade then state it in the article. --94.183.159.48 (talk) 11:07, January 21, 2010 (UTC)

Can't tell; I don't think it's ever hit Danzō, so if it's effect is the same, we have no way of knowing. Personally, I think not. TomServo101 11:12, January 21, 2010 (UTC)


 * The arrow seems to be a different weapon altogether. Any sword used by Susanoo was evident in it's left hand.Wreiad (talk) 12:56, January 21, 2010 (UTC)

Parent Jutsu
Since when was it stated that Susanoo was derived from Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi? All that is known is that one must awaken them before the can awaken Susanoo. It isn't really a combination of the two as Tsukuyomi requires a huge amount of chakra for the genjutsu to last temporarily while the genjutsu that the Totsuka sword gives Susanoo is permanent and doesn't require any chakra other than that sustaining Susanoo to use it and it's effects don't stop when Susanoo is out of use. And Amaterasu is black fire while Susanoo's fiery aura is red and the fact that the only time it burned anything that touched it was when Susanoo was combined with Amaterasu. As far as what has been stated Susanoo is it's own technique that wasn't derived from another, except for Mangekyo that is required to use it.WolfMaster (talk) 21:07, January 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Databook states that the user of Susanoo must have already used Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 23:45, January 23, 2010 (UTC)

That doesn't exactly mean that they are the parent jutsu it just means that they must be usable before Susanoo can be used. This seems more like a matter of skill than derivation, as both Amaterasu and Tsukyomi both require considerable skill to both use and master. Thus this increases the skill of the ninja who has used and mastered them enough to where they have enough skill to do this technique as it is more taxing on the users chakra and body.WolfMaster (talk) 23:55, January 23, 2010 (UTC)

They are a requirement. Read the databook and Sasuke's remark to Gaara during the Kage summit. Susanoo cannot be invoked without awakening the other 2 techniques. Wreiad (talk) 03:52, January 24, 2010 (UTC)

Unique to User?
Susanoo could possibly be different for each user, much like how each person's Mangekyou Sharingan differs in design. Do we want to add a note in the article stating that this could explain the difference in Itachi's and Sasuke's versions? The only problem I can see is that we wouldn't be able to confirm this untill another user, e.g. Madara, uses Susanoo. Lorddraknor9 (talk) 02:18, January 26, 2010 (UTC)

Raging God of Battle
Can somebody put that in kanji? Also, does it apply only to Itachi's version, or the technique in general? Yatanogarasu 19:43, February 24 2010 (UTC)

Version
There's no Sasuke's and Itachi's own version, just one susanoo in different levels, Itachi's was just the most development one we saw in the series.--187.131.30.163 (talk) 03:53, February 25, 2010 (UTC)
 * actually since Sasuke's uses a bow and has horns and jacket teets, while Itachi's uses the totsuka and Yata no Kagami i would and has no horns and flat teeths i would say they are different. --Gojita (talk) 16:53, February 25, 2010 (UTC)Gojita

Sasuke's already showed a Sword at the Kage Summit and the shield against Danzou. If we assume that Sasuke's regular MS Genjutsu is Tsukuyomi without any proof or anyone stating it in the manga other than the Databook hinting it, I see no reason why it shouldn't be the same for these.

Appearance is barely a difference for a different sections, a mention should be enough.--TekkenStorm (talk) 20:57, February 25, 2010 (UTC)
 * The sword wasn't the same and the sheild doubles as a bow, and they look completly different.--Deva 27 (talk) 21:03, February 25, 2010 (UTC)

Same Susanoo, there are different levels as we know: First form - http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/463/07/ Second form - http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/464/16/ Third form - http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/478/08-09/ Fourth form (same as Itachi's) - http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/484/09/ --Thenewjericho (talk) 19:41, February 28, 2010 (UTC)

New Image for Sasuke's Susano'o
Sasuke's Susano'o image is outdated, we should update it with the recent and most complete Susano'o --TekkenStorm (talk) 16:05, February 25, 2010 (UTC)
 * I think we should use this picture, http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_7u9gMhrSm6Y/S4XHu70Y6PI/AAAAAAAAJ30/bV4UkgPyMOk/s1600-h/09.png it's brighter and clearly shows the hole thing.Art-is-a-blast (talk) 13:10, February 27, 2010 (UTC)

Well since no one seems to objecting, I will go ahead and change it. Still, is there an Image without the Blinktopia logo? Onemanga's one doesn't have a very clear picture, with the majority of the upper part being completely black. Perhaps someone has a raw? --TekkenStorm (talk) 23:22, March 1, 2010 (UTC)

Sasuke's mirror
I would like this information to be in the article, so I want people to really think. Look at Sasuke's Susanoo compared to Itachi's. http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pNWr1x9xUptmIA2AU2KI0mJOSn92qu_vOx8kdyB_A1ln186Si-C1n3affCQmpbcMXpwk2K_8ZN_hJaFJriwwZKw/Collage7.jpg

Doesn't that look like the mirror? Same fire and spiral? The bow wasn't on fire.Wreiad (talk) 16:23, February 27, 2010 (UTC)

Why Hasn't Anyone Put The Recent Pic Of Sasuke's Armored Susanoo?
Why Hasn't Anyone Put The Recent Pic Of Sasuke's Armored Susanoo? It is obviously the final version of Sasuke's Susanoo so I don't know why they are using the third form as his completed version. BlackGhost91 (talk) 14:40, March 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * Because as far as it was seen, it looks almost exactly like Itachi's final Susanoo. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 15:12, March 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * And because of that, a picture of the "third form" is more useful since it's not visible as part of the "complete form". ~SnapperTo 23:06, March 2, 2010 (UTC)

so? it does look like Itachi's Susanoo but it has a darker appearance, more jagged teeth and a dark orb on its right hand like it says in the article. that is obviously the complete version since Itachi's did have a third form that was similiar to Sasuke's though different in appearance. It still doesn't make any sense to me to be using the third form. I could put in a fourth form myself but I don't know how to and even if I did, you guys would probably delate it so it would be pointless. Just because it was seen briefly doesn't mean it isn't it final form, it says that Susanoo feeds on Sasuke's anger to grow stronger right? That happened at least 2 times and the second time, it evolved so it bascially means that it is its final form. and besides it would be helpful to compare the two armored forms instead of having a third form for Sasuke with a bow and arrow. BlackGhost91 (talk) 14:34, March 4, 2010 (UTC)


 * Part of me thinks it would be easier just to use Itachi's Susanoo from the anime and scrap Sasuke's Susanoo image from the infobox all together. All this "Sasuke's Susanoo can evolve" crap is just erupting into one large, unnecessary war over a picture, that has been seen only once.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 16:12, March 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree with this. Having one image, at least until we can see the 'absolute' final, of Sasuke's in the anime would be better.  ¥ S uper N ovice ↔ T alk 2 M e  ¥ 16:34, March 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Like I said, there's no picture of the "internal", arrow-shooting portion of Susanoo, which is apparently present when Itachi uses it too. I will agree that the ever-evolving Mangekyo is getting annoying. ~SnapperTo 17:40, March 4, 2010 (UTC)

well do what you guys want, I honestly don't care no-more lol. BlackGhost91 (talk) 14:28, March 5, 2010 (UTC)