Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-30966312-20180413200754/@comment-33959444-20180525033828

Kurama wasn't referring to strength. He was referring to Sasuke being good at combining all Tailed Beast Chakras to one in order to absorb it into Perfect Susano'o. Later, he says also, "But he's doing the exact opposite of the old man..." which further proves he was talking about how well Sasuke was absorbing Chakra rather than overall power. Makes no sense that Sasuke is stronger than Hagoromo at this stage.

Okay, neither was used against Kaguya, but I still doubt they'd defeat her by themselves with it, but I guess it's debatable. If one of them is ever trapped in another dimension, it's over. Kaguya can easily do that without worrying about DMS Kakashi, Obito, and Sakura.

My point with Juubi had to do with what you said about Kyuubi being close to Juubi in power. Kyuubi is powerful, but I don't think it can hold a candle to Juubi in my opinion. As for SPSM, Naruto can definitely defeat the Juubi, but one thing many people miss out when bringing the fact Naruto was stomping Juubidara was that Juubidara was already heavily weakened from fighting Guy. He almost died. He also had no intel on how Naruto gained SPSM. He didn't know that, so he was fighting him as if he was like how he fought him before he gained SPSM, which caused him to underestimate him. That's why he was surprised that Naruto didn't disappear after touching the TSO and was surprised he dodged Limbo. Also, Naruto did use Kyuubi Cloak to amp up his arm after punching Madara. And finally, even though Naruto was beating him up pretty badly, the result remained inconclusive. Madara never died or full-on lost the battle. Naruto retreated to recoup. Madara was busy absorbing the Shinju.

When did Naruto trade blow for blow with Eighty Gods Vacuum? In the ice dimension or lava dimension? I don't recall.

Yeah, Naruto and Sasuke got a lot stronger as adults. But what feats are there that make them better than Hagoromo?

We never actually saw prime Kaguya fight. Prime Kaguya would be the Kaguya right after eating the Chakra Fruit, so she'd have all the Chakra on Earth.

You make sense, but is it ever stated that being a reincarnation would actually give them power, or does being a reincarnation mean they're destined for power? It's sort of like Itachi saying that you must be acknowledged to become Hokage. I don't think that being a reincarnation means you'll get more power. I think that being one means you're destined to get more power, which for Naruto was Uzumaki reserves, Bijuu, and SPSM as well as SM.

Hagoromo and Hamura didn't have to be close to her power to match her together. They just have to be half each. The other can take care for the other.

And by the way, by this analogy, would it mean that Chakra gets multiplied or divided? Because as the series goes, it makes it seem like there is a total amount of Chakra on the Earth. But by your logic of how Chakra works, Hagoromo and Hamura would each have half of Kaguya's Chakra. So, either Kaguya would lose half of her Chakra to give Hagoromo and Hamura half of her power, or she would not and Chakra would multiply, which doesn't make sense since it would mean Earth has unlimited Chakra. Doesn't really make sense if Chakra multiplied. I think it's Chakra dividing as newer generations came.

I still don't think Momoshiki or Fused Momoshiki are stronger than Kaguya. Yes, it was stated they'd be greater threats, but Sasuke could have misinterpreted that as the whole Ootsutsuki clan being a greater threat rather than just the two or it could just be a wrong statement. Remember it was stated 14 year old Obito was a greater threat than Kurama. Yes, Obito was strong, but in terms of overall power, could he do more destruction than Kurama? Definitely no. Imo, statements need feats to support them. I personally don't think that Fused Momoshiki has feats to support him being stronger than Kaguya.

I don't think it was ever stated Hagoromo or Hamura had their own Chakra. Kaguya referred to them as, "Oh my children, whom I shared my Chakra with."

No, having both halves of Kurama doesn't multiply his power. You're forgetting SPSM and SM. SM and SPSM are unrelated to Kyuubi, so the Kyuubi wouldn't enhance those forms by two times, although it would enhance them.

No, BM is after befriending Kurama. Most notably, in the War Arc, Naruto had a cape with BM. Later, the design is changed. He doesn't have to be in Kurama Avatar for BM. He's shown using it without it.

And the fact the other half of Kurama went Kurama Avatar means it was BM.

He released half the Kyuubi to fight the Hamura Golem, not the whole Kyuubi. If that were the case, he would not have Kyuubi Chakra with him.

Nah, just because they had the same Dojutsu doesn't mean they're same strength. I don't think Toneri was Hamura level.

Momoshiki was immortal to time, not immortal to damage. Kaguya was actually shown to be immortal by damage. Rinnegan Sasuke flat-out stated that ONLY his Yin and Naruto's Yang could seal her.

I agree adult Naruto is stronger than War Arc, but I disagree with him being as strong as you think, so I don't think it's worth discussing adult Naruto. That's why I'm talking about vs Kaguya Naruto.

@Starscream Don't remember Naruto using Senjutsu on Kaguya. Even IF Kaguya couldn't absorb it, she could summon the Divine Tree which is proven to absorb it.