Talk:Flying Thunder God Technique/Archive 1

Time/space
Ok, this reffers to the Flying Thunder God Technique as a high speed movement. However, Kakashi Hatake makes a refrence to this jutsu when talking about Madara Uchiha's (tobi) Space/Time Ninjutsu which allows him to "vanish" So I think this means that it is not a quick movement like Kawarimi no Jutsu, but a space time ninjutsu, which is a perfect reason why Byakugan and Sharingan cant follow it. Kajowwojak 20:37, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Hey, but is it possible that this is a Kekkai Genkai?

But it would still not be a high speed movement, which is the point of my argument.Kajowwojak 22:53, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

However, maybe there is a switch off, like with substitution, and he is switching with the seal he place in that area. Possibility: An advanced version of substitution.

I don't get how this is Space/Time. Doesn't Minato just teleport to where his seal is? If so, then this is just teleportation, which is just high speed movement76.106.146.190 (talk) 12:38, September 29, 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't think you understand the concept of teleportation. —ShounenSuki (talk 13:09, September 29, 2011 (UTC)

Teleportation is just high speed movement right? That's what Shino said.76.106.146.190 (talk) 13:25, September 29, 2011 (UTC)
 * When did Shino say something like that? I hope I can explain this properly: Minato uses the seals as "markers" when he teleports he doesn't stay in the same 'dimension' you can probably see the effects best when uses the Space–Time Barrier. But high speed movement is what Lee does, teleportation is a completely different thing.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 13:36, September 29, 2011 (UTC)

Chapter 395 page 9. It says the same thing on every site I have checked (I've checked a lot) also says the same thing in the anime for that episode so I highly doubt all of these would be wrong. But, I get how it's a Space/Time now. Thanks.76.106.146.190 (talk) 13:47, September 29, 2011 (UTC)
 * I think Sakura was talking about the Body Flicker Technique which is high-speed movement. It would make more sense given what Kakashi says afterwards. Shounensuki should be able to translate it directly if he has a raw of the chapter.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 14:03, September 29, 2011 (UTC)
 * In that chapter and episode they were actually talking about the Body Flicker technique, which is actually high-speed movement. Some have often translated it as the Teleportation technique.--Deva 27 14:04, September 29, 2011 (UTC)

Pic
I dont think this is the pic For Flying thunder God.....This was Him being naturally fast....If u remember, afterwards he says "He marked"....--AlienGamer--Talk-- 12:22, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * It's debatable, I'll admit. i must say two things, though:


 * 1) The second databook shows that exact image in its entry for the Flying Thunder God Technique;
 * 2) Kakashi had that kunai with the tag on it with him, meaning it is possible it was the Flying Thunder God Technique.
 * --ShounenSuki (talk 12:48, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes...True...but if u look carefully, u'll see Minato's hand is on the exact same foot as where he planted the seal..To me it seem's he planted the seal then...And to add a bit more weight to my argument, he says, "He's Marked" right after he does this....Oh, and kakashi didn't use the kunai here, so i dont think thats it either...--AlienGamer--Talk-- 12:52, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I didn't mean to argue that he didn't tag the Iwa-nin at that moment. On the contrary, that was literally stated in the second databook, not to mention the fact that it's obvious. all I'm saying is that it is fully possible, likely even, that he did use the Flying Thunder God Technique there. --ShounenSuki (talk 12:57, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh, and it doesn't matter that Kakashi didn't use the kunai. It's not about the kunai, after all, but about the tag. As long as there's a tag, Minato can jump to it. --ShounenSuki (talk 12:58, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I said "add weight to my argument", cause of a lack of a better way to put it....Well ya i guess....But now that i think about it, It might have been put in the databook, cause he marked his opponent here....But well, your right that kakashi had the Kunai, so this pic might be a double....--AlienGamer--Talk-- 13:06, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * In chapter 244 page 16 Minato says that the seal on the kunai is activated when it flies. Jacce | Talk 13:28, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh yeah, forgot about that...And the fact that Rin says "Sensai's technique is so fast" when he goes after the Iwa-nin, but didn't make a mention of it when Minato saved Kakashi. I still think that this pic represents him placing the marker, and maybe thats y it was put in the databook...--AlienGamer--Talk-- 13:35, 4 August 2009 (UTC)
 * As I said, it's debatable. He definitely didn't use the Flying Thunder God Technique when returning with Kakashi. Also, the clouds around him would indicate a regular Body Flicker Technique and not this one. The Flying Thunder God Technique doesn't appear to cause smoke.
 * About that quote, it's a mistranslation. Minato says . --ShounenSuki (talk 15:08, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Granted I always thought it was a regular body flicker as well, but there aren't many pics that express motion, and even fewer that reflect motion with him. Besides, considering he is also planting the seal here it works regardless.

Romanization
The Kanji on the info box 飛雷神の術 directly romanizes to hi raijin no jutsu, now I don't know or need to know how they say it where you may come from and no offense intended from me but I changed to "hi raijin no jutsu" cos that's the direct romanization the Kanji pertains.--Artist of Flash (talk) 15:07, January 2, 2010 (UTC)

An interesting thing...
I found that the jutsu-shiki starts with 忍, translated as "nin", possibly part of "ninja" (忍者 ) or "ninjutsu" (忍術) and translating as either "endure", "bear", "suffer" or "forbear".

Does no one want to try translating the rest of the "jutsu-shiki"? --Reikson (talk) 03:21, February 12, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm confused. Jutsu-Shiki is 術式,which translates into jutsu formula. Where are you getting...all of that?--TheUltimate3 (talk) 03:29, February 12, 2010 (UTC)

File:Seal_For_The_Flying_Thunder_God_Technique.PNG
 * The image that depicts the "jutsu shiki" on the right; there are kanji marks on Mahiru's foot that can clearly be seen. The first symbol is 忍, as I mentioned in my first post on this topic. --Reikson (talk) 05:56, February 12, 2010 (UTC)

No Chakra
It is stated in this page that the technique doesn't use up any chakra. Can someone post a source or a more thorough explanation? I just want some kind of proof. ReaperX24 (talk) 18:37, July 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * In regards to that and the rest that was removed, at least some of it seems to be derived from this translation. Viz's translation doesn't say anything like that and neither does the lone databook translation that I found. ~SnapperTo 20:11, July 14, 2010 (UTC)

I expected as much, as I searched pretty intensely and never found anything that supported the claim. Thanks. ReaperX24 (talk) 20:52, July 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm not 100% sure, but I do remember Minato saying that he could sense when the kunai was thrown. I just wish I could remember whether it was in the manga or the anime. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 21:19, July 14, 2010 (UTC)


 * *cough*link I gave*cough* ~SnapperTo 21:34, July 14, 2010 (UTC)

About the so-called Hiraishin Level 2
I don't have access to a raw yet, but judging by the spoilers, I have to say "Hiraishin level 2" is a mistranslation.

If the spoilers are correct, Minato says 『飛雷神二の段だよ』, which I would translate as "Hiraishin has two steps!"


 * 1) Throw a special kunai.
 * 2) Teleport towards it.

There is no level two. --ShounenSuki (talk 22:54, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * The chapter's out. There IS a Hirashin Level 2. --SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 23:30, July 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * I know the chapter is out. I'm saying there has been a mistranslation. --ShounenSuki (talk 23:34, July 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Perhaps you guys should wait to add the entry until you have further confirmation. If there is a level 2, then I'm sure at some point we'll see a level 3. At that time we can submit the entry for level 2 and 3.Daleadil (talk) 21:47, July 16, 2010 (UTC)


 * But what does he mean by 'has two step!' ? Thomas Finlayson (talk) 19:30, July 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * It will probably be explained in chapter 503. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:32, July 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * If my interpretation is correct, the second step is teleporting to a kunai, the first step being the throwing of said kunai. --ShounenSuki (talk 19:53, July 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * No offense, but that does not sound like something to brag to a (apparently, it looks like that now, but I think we can all guess not) defeated foe. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 23:02, July 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * 2 things: First, in manga and anime, people say "what?" or "how?" whenever they dont know what just happened. People also have to explain what just happened (the author's way of making sure the audience understands).  There two things can happen, even when you'd think there isn't time (saying a whole word in the infintesimal amount of time between Minato using the Hiraishin and striking Madara?  This is a jutsu that killed hundreds of Iwagakure ninja in a second, before any of them could react).  Second, to Daleadil and SuperSaiyaMan, even if there WAS a Hiraishin Level 2, doesn't mean that there HAS to be a Hiraishin Level 3.  That's like saying Orochimaru's curse mark must have a third and fourth stage, just because it has a first and a second.

Minato wasn't bragging, he was explaining. Madara was surprised that Minato could jump to the kunai he just threw, on which Minato explained that Hiraishin has two steps (place/throw kunai, them jump), instead of just one (just jumping). At least, that is how I interpreted it. Maybe next chapter will clear it up. --ShounenSuki (talk 23:06, July 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * to make it simple how about just jumping to a moving kunai Fawcettp (talk) 03:32, July 18, 2010 (UTC)

Can't it be considered a combo technique? Much like the other techniques seen in the series. There's a technique in the Naruto games called Warp Rasengan that works similar.Ghidora (talk) 01:08, August 8, 2010 (UTC)


 * Jumping into an old conversation here, but the anime reminded me kick in my word. How I see this level 2 thing, is the same as ShounenSuki. He does throw the kunai, and then jumps to it and catches it. Very much how lightning is attracted to metal and such. The aspect of this level two could be the whole catching kunai/teleporting to it. Potentially the level one would be the seal part. Teleporting without the kunai. Kushina's seal, the fight against Tobi, the fight against A and Killer B for examples, of all teleporting without the kunai. --SharinganMike (talk) 16:22, February 10, 2012 (UTC)

Curious action and possible weakness.
When Minato was confronted by Madara and teleported out, he chose to take the closest transport kunai (outside), why? It would serve no purpose to be there, and may even be dangerous if Madara had backup outside. To go straight home would be logical and instinctual (home=safe place generally, especially if you are under pressure like he was (exploding tags and all).

So why take the closest one? The best I can think of (yes, part speculation) that more chakra is required for more distance and that more chakra takes milliseconds more time to use (and he was short on time). If so, then a weakness with the technique (which everyone is supposed to have) exists. Counter-arguments? Thomas Finlayson (talk) 22:57, July 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * What scene are you talking about exactly? --ShounenSuki (talk 23:19, July 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * The scene where Minato choose to teleport to some random field, when he dodged Madara's teleport jutsu, instead of teleporting home. But I'm going to be completely honest, there is no question here. Nothing that can/should be discussed here. He teleported outside, because he teleported outside. There is no big reason behind it, no secret. No weakness. No big mystery. He teleported outside, because he teleported outside.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 23:27, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * You mean in chapter 502, page 10? Because he did teleport to his home. --ShounenSuki (talk 23:37, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
 * @ShounenSuki, yes he did, but on his second hop.
 * @TheUltimate3, I apologize if my answer angers you, but he teleported just outside of the cave with the explosion and flying shrapnel and [splinters] behind him. Does that seem wise to you? Thomas Finlayson (talk) 00:12, July 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm not saying there was a special reason. I'm not saying there was logic involved. I'm saying something happened, simply because it happened. There doesn't always have to be some super massive explanation behind every little thing.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 00:22, July 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * Calm down. I am just trying to understand a decision that makes no logical sense to me. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 00:25, July 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * Maybe it's just easier for him to jump to a nearby kunai. --ShounenSuki (talk 00:30, July 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * That is exactly what I was trying to say. Easier implies faster to use, and he was in a very tense situation with very little time. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 00:55, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

I know this topic is well over a year old, but I'm just gonna add what I think anyway. Considering the situation, maybe he literally chose the first place he thought of. If we're talking about inside the cave (after he catches Naruto) then he had to unwrap the explosive tags from Naruto and then jump to his Kunai. I know Minato has extremely fast reflexes but even so, he had to make a decision before the tags killed him and Naruto. In this situation, a speedy situation was required over a logical one. Anyway, this is a dead topic, I know, so I'll leave it at this. Gojinn (talk) 12:26, September 22, 2011 (UTC)

Warping the Menacing Ball
Should we consider this as a different application of the technique or as an unnamed, derived technique? It's significantly different from every other use of FTG seen so far. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 01:54, July 16, 2010 (UTC)


 * I think treating it as a separate, but derived technique is the best option right now. --ShounenSuki (talk 02:13, July 16, 2010 (UTC)


 * It was a different jutsu but derived from this like all the rasengan variations. Shikaku called it the "Space-Time Barrier" Shock Dragoon Jul-15-10 10:40PM (ETZ)


 * Hand-signs were used, so it does seem like a jutsu. Moreover, if you look close, the ball disappeared in "front" of the kunai, like mid-to-long-range in front of him. Moreover, if it is made into a jutsu, I would like to state that it can count as an offensive jutsu based on where the attack is teleported, and since you could teleport a foe high in the air. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 20:48, July 16, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yeah i was thinking about this already stated this on Minato's talk page. The barrier seems like it should at least be a sited as a different jutsu since seals were used and Choza stated that it was a barrier technique --Cerez365 (talk) 21:08, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

About Hirashin Making Smoke
Ok so I just want to be clear by this, the Hirashin does not have a puff, smoke or sound to it, which allows Minato to appear behind a target unnoticed, it that wasn't the case he woudn't have been able to defeat Iwagakure's army all by himself. The so called smoke we saw in the manga is not smoke created by the Hirashin it self, it's dirt that gets swept away when he appears, like when the wind is really strong and sweeps away dirt...so yeah! please do edit the part about it making smoke. Peruzka (talk) 05:07, July 25, 2010 (UTC) Peruzka
 * Recent chapters (500 ~ 503) clearly show it making smoke. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:38, July 25, 2010 (UTC)
 * yeah it is basically a summoning technique, ergo the smoke...--Cerez365 (talk) 21:12, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

'Where was that mentioned?'
Third section above this. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 00:21, July 31, 2010 (UTC)

Why isnt Naruto isn't being added?
In the latest chapter it clearly displays Rikudou Naruto using flying thunder god technique. I don't know if it has its own article or what, but if it does then it needs to be added in the dirived jutsu. BHM1250 (talk) 05:03, August 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Because he didn't use it, Bee only compared his speed to the yellow flash, and you need a technique formula in order to use it.--Deva 27 (talk) 05:18, August 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Additionally Minato was called the Yellow/Golden Flash not the technique and that was just because of his speed. --Cerez365 (talk) 12:57, August 8, 2010 (UTC)
 * Bee didn't compare Naruto's speed to the Yellow Flash, because there's no indication he'd ever seen Minato in action. He said that he saw a yellow flash when Naruto apparently teleported across the room. A yellow flash is the known visual effect of the Hiraishin no Jutsu; that's why Minato came to be known as the Yellow Flash. The clear implication is that Naruto performed a similar technique, if not the same one. 75.76.213.106 (talk) 03:16, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Naruto never left a seal to teleport to so thats one fact that shows its not the hiraishin no jutsu...also, he would've had to learn how to create the seal how to place it, and also how to summon himself to the seal to preform the technique itself. The Yellow Flash is not a visual effect of the flying thunder god technique minato was so called because he was as quick as a flash and because he is blonde. one can also argue that he was so called the yellow flash not because of his Hiraishin no Jutsu but because he had astonishing raw speed. This is because the Jutsu itself should not produce any visual effects it is a form of teleportation and the user essentially does not change position. It is interesting to note that by your own arguement Naruto could not have seen Minato in action therefore he could not possibly have learned it

Translation
the literal translation has been written as the flying thunder god technique and it is true that 雷 can mean thunder but raishin (雷神) means god of lightening, so shouldn't it be flying lightening god technique? Also the homonym for hiraishin means lightening rod.Racoonone (talk) 15:20, January 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * 雷神 is the god of both thunder and lightning. 雷 can refer to both thunder and lightning as well. However, in English, God of Thunder or Thunder God is more commonly used than the lightning equivalents. Hence the translation used here. —ShounenSuki (talk 15:25, January 8, 2011 (UTC)

Related jutsu
Since we know and mention that this technique functions like a reverse summon, I think we should add the Summoning Technique to the related jutsu field. Thoughts? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 12:16, January 18, 2011 (UTC)

The Seal
Hey I'm sorry if this is already posted somewhere (I looked and didn't find it), but what does the seal say?Timeel39 (talk) 19:23, June 22, 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure it's supposed to say anything, I think it's just supposed to look like there's something written, similar to what appears in the Summoning Technique and other seals. I do see something that resembles the kanji from shinobi quite a bit. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 01:05, June 23, 2011 (UTC)

Flying Thunder God Technique
Someone should put somewhere that there are several levels to this technique. Also, I suspect that this is an incomplete jutsu. I believe there's more to this technique than what we where originally lead to believe.
 * Any evidence that is not affected by this section? Jacce | Talk | Contributions 14:15, October 17, 2011 (UTC)
 * Ah that's the article I was looking for. If you look at it, what he does is really no different from how he usually uses it. Everything else you mentioned is just speculation on your part.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 14:37, October 17, 2011 (UTC)

Team?
In the event of the Hokage Special Bodyguards being kept as an article (I have yet to find a good reason to justify that article for the group as a team), I think that this should be considered a team technique, since they use it in their capacity of protecting the Hokage, the purpose of the group. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 21:30, November 2, 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree with listing it as a team technique. Since three of them are required to use it.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 21:38, November 2, 2011 (UTC)

Current picture sorting
Please revert the the last edit. Having the infobox shuffle between four images like that looks horrible. The one where he puffs in and saves kakashi is enough and then we can use the thumbs for the rest of the article to illustrate the remaining elements.

Beside, if the page is locked, we should leave such a matter to the talk page, like this, instead of just asking a syssop(or whoever still have access) and have them ad them when the majority of the community is unable to act against it if they feel like it, like i do!. --Gojita (talk) 12:29, November 3, 2011 (UTC)Gojita
 * I've always thought that the original image didn't showcase it well. The marking can be placed outside the infobox. The remaining three images showcase the speed better.--Deva 27 12:34, November 3, 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't have time know, but could you at least revert it, and then leave it be, at least until there is full access again and this have been discussed properly. That asside, yes i agree that it does not illustrate it verry well, but shuffling between three images is even worse in my eyes, especially when all they show is minato removing a back, then standing behind a guy and then the back on the ground. --Gojita (talk) 12:41, November 3, 2011 (UTC)Gojita
 * I always thought the one image wasn't doing it justice either but was going to wait until his encounter with A was animated since that'd show it best IMO. I think Deva's suggestion might be best. The article should be opened some time later today I believe.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 12:49, November 3, 2011 (UTC)
 * Although I agree that the one image wasn't doing the technique justice, this sequence doesn't do it either. At best, if a reader is already aware of what is occurring, the images work o.k. but for those who don't remember the details of this specific instance, it is considerably more confusing and difficult to piece together than the prior image. As Cerez365 suggests, I doubt that there is currently an example in which we are able to demonstrate the technique in 2 images or less, so I would support a revert to the previous single image until such a time that we can. Personally, I was hoping Minato's fight with Tobi would resolve this, without the need to wait as long as for his encounter with A. Blackstar1 (talk) 13:15, November 3, 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh! Depending on how the animate Minato's fight with Tobi that could be used as well.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 13:34, November 3, 2011 (UTC)

Lightning Rods....
umm.. that last trivia about the lightning rod.. Lightning rods dont attract lightning, their true purpose is to create a path leading to the ground... im talking about lightning rods on buildings... dont rly want to get into the mechanics of those.. and as for the tall lightning rod "towers", they dont attract lightning either... they send up positive 'streamers' that dissipate lightning... the probability of lighting rods being hit depends on the electric field generate from the clouds.... i guess the main point is just to say that lightning rods dont actually attract...but many ppl around the world believe that they do, so im not denying that Kishimoto-sama probably made the allusion to lightning rods attracting lightning... (Also all the knowledge presented comes from my junior year of high school, 3 years ago, so it's possible that i made some mistakes in the actual science behind it all, but overall my main point is still correct.. cheahh..) Kevin krash (talk) 17:14, November 3, 2011 (UTC)
 * lighting rods are made of some sort of highly conducting metal(can't remember which) and are placed in high places thus further increasing the possibility of them being hit by lightning instead of an antenna or fuse box, so in a way, they do attract lightning, fitting the description. --Gojita (talk) 17:54, November 3, 2011 (UTC)Gojita

Combination Technique
Shouldn't this technique be listed as a combination technique for Genma, Raido and the unnamed shinobi in their infoboxes [ex. for Raido Namiashi: Flying Thunder God Technique (in combination with Genma Shiranui and unnamed Kohona shinobi)], since they can only do it in combination with each other? Or do we not due that anymore? Dragon Hacker (talk) 18:17, November 4, 2011 (UTC)
 * Not really. The technique itself isn't a combination technique, they just use it like that because they're not capable of using it by themselves. Several shinobi used Water Release: Water Encampment Wall against Madara, but them using it together doesn't make it a combination technique, because we know it can be done alone. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:07, November 4, 2011 (UTC)