Talk:Flying Thunder God Technique

Kanji on Technique Formula
Can someone translate the kanji on the technique formula on this pic? I could only make out the first kanji 忍 (nin, endure) and last 絶 (zetsu, absolute). Can't tell the second one if it's awakening (kaku, as in kakusei), and the third seems to have something to do with talisman. Yatanogarasu (Talk) 19:37, February 4, 2012 (UTC)

Check this out. Skitts (talk) 19:40, February 4, 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. But I checked a little more, and I think I have the basic boiled down to this: the second kanji is kaku 覚, third is fu 符, and the last is zetsu 絶. ? I already left this translation at ShounenSuki's page, but still, here would be a possible for everyone to determine its validity. Yatanogarasu (Talk) 19:49, February 4, 2012 (UTC)

Because Kanji is japanese using chinese symbols for literally the exact same words, I used google translate to get the symbols. The 2nd kanji isn't 覚 meaning awakening. What I got was 忍交符绝, which if you take those and put them into google translate and translate either detect language or chinese into english you get Endure Cross Symbol Absolutely. Now I'm not saying that's EXACTLY what it is, because I don't know how to read Japanese or Chinese. I went to this site, http://www.saiga-jp.com/language/kanji_list.html, and looked at all the Kanji they had. The closest one to the 2nd kanji for the FTG formula I found in the 2nd grade set. Where it says "Grade 2 (160 characters)  available contents: basic informations, stroke order image, pronunciation audio", right at the edge of the light blue box, go to the 3rd Kanji on the right past the box and you get 交. Now I down't know what these are pronounced as in japanese, but Cross actually sounds fitting due to the use of this technique. 8.27.210.170 (talk) 15:55, November 16, 2012 (UTC) Connor 9:54, November 16, 2012 UTC-06:00

hirashin lv 2 or hirashin has 2 steps
because NS 248 was out,... so, which one is true?? there is hirashin lv 2 or hirashin has 2 steps??? sorry for my bad english... 182.1.201.171 (talk) 08:34, February 10, 2012 (UTC)FantasticGirl
 * This. Jacce | Talk | Contributions 08:37, February 10, 2012 (UTC)

Picture Slideshow
Why are we using that slideshow? The first and second pictures are at angles that do not properly show Minato teleporting. The one where he teleported to Mahiru's foot is more accurate. Yatanogarasu (Talk) 08:00, March 4, 2012 (UTC)
 * The single image of his with his hand on Mahiru's foot O.o? I know that the sequence in there now is not the best to illustrate the technique (this would be one of the only times I'd support us using .gifs) but one image can and probably will never, properly display the technique.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 12:06, March 4, 2012 (UTC)
 * How about one image of Mahiru alone, then the next, Minato teleports to his foot? Yatanogarasu (Talk) 23:54, March 11, 2012 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately the scene doesn't play out like that in the anime, as the beginning of that particular event is depicted in close-up, so currently the sequence that is being used is the most viable one. Other than waiting for the scene where Minato confronts A, there is little alternative than to stick with what's already there, although maybe the addition of some concise descriptions to the images could help clarify what is actually occurring. Blackstar1 (talk) 00:54, March 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * I was also waiting on the A vs. Minato clash to see if better series of images could come from there since that's the best scene(s) with them. So why not simply use them now? I know it's been depicted in the anime, but those images show the technique best.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 01:13, March 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I didn't watch that two-parter close enough to notice, so let's wait for A vs Minato and hope for the best there. Yatanogarasu (Talk) 02:31, March 12, 2012 (UTC)

Yes but what about changing it now O.o It'd look like this: Much easier to follow and such ye?--Cerez365™ 02:42, March 12, 2012 (UTC)

Not enough background, looks like its from 3 different chapters. --Gojita (talk) 13:26, March 12, 2012 (UTC)Gojita
 * Cerez's gallery seems best. Looks like a good display/summary of the technique to me Skitts (talk) 14:47, March 12, 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm not too sure, as I think the flow of either sequence suffers greatly from the severe angle changes that are present in both, meaning that someone's preference becomes more dependent upon how acquainted they are with the particular scenes. It's a shame that the "two steps" of the technique haven't been clarified, as the inclusion of short descriptions could have really helped. Blackstar1 (talk) 15:47, March 12, 2012 (UTC)

Not too sure what "not enough background" means O.o People are already (or at least should be) well acquainted with how the technique works given that it has appeared in all Naruto-related mediums. This is simply a case where we'd use manga images to depict the sequence of event which could be aided by descriptions with the images: "Minato scatters his kunai over the battlefield" "is able to move from one location to another marked location" etc for example. It's a bit regressive, but with the policy that prohibits the use of .gif files, I don't think any of the current images can "really" show the technique.--Cerez365™ 16:33, March 12, 2012 (UTC)


 * Well if concise descriptions are to be included, then I'm fine with using the manga sequence, given that it has better clarity and that I'm under the impression it depicts how Minato is implied to typically employ the technique (i.e. scattering numerous kunai). Blackstar1 (talk) 16:59, March 12, 2012 (UTC)

Trivia point
So I'm not sure, maybe I'm interpreting it wrongly (and I don't think asking the author will help much) but is there a point to having a trivia point that says: "In the games, most of Minato's ultimate techniques involves teleporting behind his opponent using Rasengan." I mean, isn't that Minato's whole fighting style O.o.--Cerez365™ 00:48, March 12, 2012 (UTC)

Hiraishin Lv 2
should we add in the trivia section that in the indonesian version of the volume, there is hiraishin lv 2..??  

minato says "inilah hiraishin level dua (english: that(this) was hiraishin lv 2)"...

sorry for my bad english... ^.^ 182.1.131.22 (talk) 09:57, March 18, 2012 (UTC)Jengkol
 * All versions said that. It was a mistranslation that was cleared up here.--Cerez365™Hyūga Symbol.svg 10:17, March 18, 2012 (UTC)

random here just wanna add how the flying thunder god jutsu seems to be more about reverse summoning than anything else mentioned in its article.
 * Okay. What is in the article is pretty much a direct translation from the databook.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 09:31, September 1, 2012 (UTC)

Just wondering on the Users of the technique
Didn't Naruto use this in chapter 544? or was that something else?

No Naruto didn't use hiraishin no jutsu, he just used the immense amount of speed granted by the 9-tails chakra mode. Yamato just likened it to the hiraishin no jutsu.71.71.58.70 (talk) 09:37, September 14, 2012 (UTC) yomiko-chan

I disagree. I think Naruto did use it. He learned it from his dad during their time together. Both Tsunade and Bee thought it looked "just like a yellow flash". I'm sure A fought with many Jinchurikis before, first example being Bee himself who has an excellent bond with Hachibi, yet it is still said "naruto is the second to ever evade it". Therefore I think it's no coincidence, speed and Biju power isn't enough to dodge it - Naruto can not only USE flying thunder god, he perfected it (like he did with Rasengan, his dad's other S-level technique) 62.219.147.167 (talk) 10:49, November 28, 2012 (UTC) Kobi Mangafan
 * The Flying thunder god technique requires a seal at the place where the user wants to go. Naruto hasn't placed out any seals.
 * The Flying thunder god technique summons a person to the seal, thus no movement and no flash.
 * Minato didn't get the nickname "yellow flash" from using the Flying thunder god technique, but from his "normal" speed. Jacce | Talk | Contributions 11:19, November 28, 2012 (UTC)

It was just a body flicker my god...--Elveonora (talk) 19:08, November 28, 2012 (UTC)

Level 2 and game
So, I was checking new gameplay video, and it seems that, at least for video game purposes, they do consider the "level 2" a different technique, it's Minato's ninjutsu during awakenings in UNS3. They called it "Flying Raijin: Second Stage", that's probably 飛雷神二の段, which we would translate as "Flying Thunder God: Second Step". Looks like the same thing he did against Obito, the action in the video was a bit fast, but that's what it looked like. That'll probably be created for video game, but the question is, do we consider it a separate technique manga and anime wise as well? I know we always considered it just an explanation of the technique itself. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 21:10, November 3, 2012 (UTC)
 * Anyone? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 22:46, November 6, 2012 (UTC)

No, "Flying Thunder God Technique Level 2" sounds stupid as an article. But if a videogame names them separately, we will do so... so canonical article nope, but two game articles yep if that bothers you ;)--Elveonora (talk) 23:19, November 6, 2012 (UTC)
 * The video game technique "Flying Thunder God: Sequential Steps" was most likely named after what the manga called "Flying Thunder God: Second Step". It wouldn't be anything "new". What I wonder is if we should do like it was done with Sasori. There were at least a few of his techniques in the manga and anime that were never named, but named in the video games, so those were used. I don't know if they were considered techniques in their own right before the games came out, that happened way before I knew what Naruto was. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:45, November 6, 2012 (UTC)

Those 2 Sasori's techniques were unique, this is flying thunder god no matters how you look at it. Would be like making a separate article for the ranged variant of Rasenshuriken. Also what about this? http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Flying_Thunder_God_Technique/Archive_1#About_the_so-called_Hiraishin_Level_2 --Elveonora (talk) 01:31, November 7, 2012 (UTC)

I don't know. I liken it to when one technique is used a new way and although the newly named technique is simply a different way to use the very same technique. I think of it like the naruto uzumaki 2k barrage vs the original naruto uzumaki barrage.98.26.246.74 (talk) 01:50, November 7, 2012 (UTC) yomiko-chan

If the game lists it as a technique then I believe we should add it as a game technique without letting one media colour the other. Maybe make a note that in the canon series it's a misconception about the "two steps" and such.--Cerez 365 ™(talk) 08:33, November 7, 2012 (UTC)

Dodging
How does he know when to dodge the attack of a lightning-fast punch from A? Minato may be fast, but it dosen't increase his reflexes.--Aeonophic (talk) 21:25, November 18, 2012 (UTC)Aeonophic
 * It gives him the advantage by only requiring him to notice the attack is coming, not try and maneuver out of the way, the seal does it for him. --Hawkeye2701 (talk) 21:45, November 18, 2012 (UTC)
 * He dodges it at the last possible moment. Though Minato has good reflexes, it's not something that he does reflex-wise, to me at least, it seems as though, A was simply an inch away from punching Minato and the speed of his technique allowed him to fly in that short gap of time.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 21:46, November 18, 2012 (UTC)

Debut
ya know in the first episode and chapter of the series, in the very beginning; Minato and Gamabuna are briefly shown fighting Kurama.. and theres a bright flash ending the flashback.. so im pretty sure that is the first official debut of Hiraishin.--RexGodwin (talk) 05:11, March 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * Except Hiraishin doesn't give off light. A bit in the games, but not in the manga and anime. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 22:09, March 8, 2013 (UTC)

Flying Thunder God Slash
I had a hunch that this day would possibly come ever since Mianto said Tobirama could use Jikukan Ninjutsu. Any way, I just wanted to know if anyone could find a source for where it says that Minato created this technique? I tried to find databook translations, but was not successful.--Cerez 365 ™(talk) 15:24, March 19, 2013 (UTC)


 * There's a reference to second databook, too lazy to check it out lol. If the kanji are mostly the same, then I doubt it's just a coincidence--Elveonora (talk) 15:40, March 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * I was hoping we could find an English translation. None from ShounenSuki though or at mangahelpers who are very good at this. I'll still check though.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 15:42, March 19, 2013 (UTC)

Can't find anything either :-/--Elveonora (talk) 15:50, March 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * According to this (not too sure it counts as a link that shouldn't be there) it does say a technique of the Fourth Hokage. Though that still doesn't say he invented or engineered it. Omnibender could actually confirm it better than me, as I actually speak Spanish, not Portuguese.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 15:51, March 19, 2013 (UTC)

Perhaps Sasuke invented Fire Release: Great Dragon Fire Technique by himself but the concept existed earlier on just like perhaps Minato took what Tobirama had and improved upon it--Elveonora (talk) 16:01, March 19, 2013 (UTC)

That scanlation says nothing we don't know or list already. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 16:05, March 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * It's more how we word it, rather than what's actually there. We have accurate information and everything, but there's a huge difference when we say "used by Minato Namikaze" as opposed to "created by Minato Namikaze". Going forward it could make the difference.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 16:46, March 19, 2013 (UTC)

Sempai, i can speak Portuguese (actually i am that) and there is nothing in that link you posted that states that Minato invented the technique, only that his use of it was what made him famous. Minato may have improved the technique, he maybe better at it than Tobirama, but we have zero evidence that he was it's creator...add that to the how he slapped himself and the Second as space-time technique users and now this technique, with virtually the same name...yeah i think i make myself clear. Darksusanoo (talk) 02:52, March 23, 2013 (UTC)
 * Aye, you did. The changes have been made already.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 12:13, March 23, 2013 (UTC)

Inventor?
Was this technique indeed created by Minato? The reference provided in the article for the info, which is the 2nd databook, says nothing of such. The 2nd databook simply says the technique is Minato's technique. I think that the line came to be in the article when some Minato-fan created or edited the article. This is why any info not EXPLICITLY supported by canon should never be allowed in here. Original research or "intelligent deductions" should be limited as much as possible. NoJutsu (talk) 04:47, March 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * If you had bothered to look at the section above the one you created you'd have seen that the community was already discussing the issue. Stop blowing it out of proprtion, it was neither research nor intelligent deductions, it was a poor word choice from a translation. Notice since you have the databook translation at hand, that the article is possibly near word-for-word of it.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 09:58, March 20, 2013 (UTC)

Minato and formula
Unless I'm missing something, Minato used FTG by the end of the chapter the same way Tobirama did, both simply touched another Hokage and all vanished. Unless it's revealed Minato's tags are very resistant to lots of stuff and persist through years, and that he tagged lots of random locations before his death, I don't see how he could have teleported to his own face in the Hokage Mountain. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 22:49, April 10, 2013 (UTC)


 * I just don't get it. Nothing indicated that they used Hiraishin at all. All that seemed to happen was they used super-speed or the Body Flicker Technique to move quickly to their respective heads. And can you guys check my question on Tobirama's talk page?
 * [edit] Hm, I see them touching the shoulders of the other Hokage. Skitts (talk) 22:51, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

I can't explain how the seal persisted so long, especially considering his death, but Minato does appear to teleport to his own face in the Hokage Mountain in Chapter 502 (page 6). Blackstar1 (talk) 23:00, April 10, 2013 (UTC)


 * Which is part of the reason I think they might've just used the BF. o3o Skitts (talk) 23:08, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

They obviously used hirashin, Tobirama touched Hashirama and Minato marked Sarutobi. Also Omni, you are forgetting the seal was already placed on the monument during QB attack--Elveonora (talk) 23:42, April 10, 2013 (UTC)
 * Minato marked Hiruzen? Er, what? And Omni's whole point is that unless there is something special about Minato's tags (i.e they don't deteriorate from the elements), then there's no explanation how he (or Tobirama) can be said to have used Hiraishin in this instance.
 * [Edit] And I'd like to point something out. Based on these 2 pages (627pg13 & 627pg16), they were already directly above the Hokage monument, so I don't see why they would've had to have used Hiraishin to move a few dozen feet forward, minus just the BFT. So, I petition we remove any mention of Tobirama having Hiraishin until he actually uses it, or mentions that he knows it. Skitts (talk) 23:55, April 10, 2013 (UTC)

What about the sound effect when they touch them? And Hashirama orders Tobirama to use Hirashin in the shrine if you forgot--Elveonora (talk) 23:58, April 10, 2013 (UTC)
 * The sound effect, I dunno. In the translation I read, Hashirama just says that they were going to fly outside the Naka Shrine. We should get Seelentau to check this out when the raws are released. Skitts (talk) 00:01, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

No links to scanlations. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:05, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

He still says Hirashin and meant for transport, thus his usage at least of it is undoubtful--Elveonora (talk) 00:11, April 11, 2013 (UTC)
 * He mentions that "We can't use the Hiraishin, we're bound." I agree that could indicate he knows it, or a goof ON Kishi's part in that he knew that Minato knew the technique (not the first time Kishi's made a goof like that lately, i.e Hashi and Tsunade). Skitts (talk) 00:18, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

whoever said that his tags disappear with his death or that that wear away with natural weathering? speculation right there--208.124.127.18 (talk) 02:13, April 11, 2013 (UTC)


 * I think all Tobirama/Minato did was "mark" the other two Hokage. If they had flown, the smoke would've appeared like it always does. They could be planning on using it now/next chapter.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 02:38, April 11, 2013 (UTC)


 * Jutsu are held together by the chakra of the user. At death their chakra disappears. And so do the Jutsu. I always thought that the kunai he had the seals engraved on were still there.--Yomiko-chan (talk) 02:40, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

I agree it was the flying thunder god, and no jutsu do not all the time disappear with the death of their user. hence itachi amaterasu sealing in sasuke before he first met madara (tobi), and any type of sealing jutsu actually makes that statement null. if their jutsu was only held together by their chakra and it broke apart with their death then the nine tails seal would of broken when the 4th died. same with the reanimation jutsu, although it directly states it would not end that way. since the flying thundergod was mention several times, and both the hokage knowing it made physical contact with the two that didn't before vanishing and reappearing at the hokages heads, accompanied by the sound effects used for the flying thunder god, I am inclined to believe that is what was used. --208.124.127.18 (talk) 06:30, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

@Cerez, the smoke wasn't always there, I remember Minato using it at least twice without it, the smoke ISN'T part of the technique, just an effect, kinda like a trope of sorts--Elveonora (talk) 12:58, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

Naruto as a user
Er, when did Naruto ever use FTG? I don't recall him using it once in any movie. --Reliops (talk) 15:41, April 11, 2013 (UTC)Reliops

I don't see him.~ Ultimate  Supreme  16:16, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

It was quickly removed. Jacce | Talk | Contributions 16:20, April 11, 2013 (UTC)

File:Naruto_defeats_Menma.png, here?--Samemaru 23:32, May 7, 2013 (UTC)
 * Not because the scene looks similar means Naruto used the Flying Thunder God Technique.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 00:12, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

All we know is that he somehow managed to catch the thrown Kunai, likely body flicker--Elveonora (talk) 09:21, May 8, 2013 (UTC)