Talk:Urashiki Ōtsutsuki

first appearance
I'm assuming his first appearance was as a silhouette? If so, should that be noted? Diamonddeath (talk) 16:00, March 12, 2018 (UTC)

Lightning Release and Sand Manipulation
Should we really add natures and traits he fishes up with his rod into his infobox? Technically he just fishes them up, stores them in his jar and then fires them out, he doesn't posses them himself.--Elve Talk Page 12:28, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Kakashi's Sharingan isn't really his either.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 12:31, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Same concept as Tenten unsealing a Fire Release technique from her scroll, so no he shouldn't be listed as having a stolen nature since his body doesn't produce it. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 12:40, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Just to note, Momoshiki is listed as a user of the techniques he absorbed, even though he didn't produce them on his own too, so I'm curious how Urashiki's case is different. Ravenlot 27 (talk) 12:44, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * @Saru's case: Urashiki never sealed anything. We're led to assume he STOLE everything. No way is the same to Tenten. I liken it to the whole Kakashi/Susanoo situation, where we have Kakashi use both Sharingan despite not technically having them.BerserkerPhantom (talk) 12:51, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * In my opinion, characters who have used a nature through outside source, but can't perform it themselves, shouldn't have it listed in their infobox. So if Tenten sealed a Lava Release technique performed by someone else, into her scroll and then unsealed it, we should list her as a user of Lava Release kekkei genkai? It's nonsense in my opinion and a policy should be established what counts and what doesn't.--Elve Talk Page 12:57, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Not really the same case as Tenten. Just to note, Urashiki stored up not the actual jutsu themselves, but the samples of chakra of their users, which in turn allowed him to use the abilities of those users. Again, it's more similar to the absorption/amplificatiion ability of Momoshiki. Otherwise, all of Momoshiki's natures and techniques should be removed from his article as well, since he isn't their actual user, but received them through absorption ability. Ravenlot 27 (talk) 13:04, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * In that case it's fine, he is a user.--Elve Talk Page 13:18, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * I agree with Elve that characters who have used a nature through outside source shouldn't have the nature listed in their infobox. That doesn't apply to Momoshiki as he uses a body part to perform nature transformations like Madara/Danzo with Hashirama's face allowing them to use Wood Release. Urashiki's gourd performed Lightning Release, not Urashiki himself. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 13:39, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Urashiki's gourd is made out of chakra, so it's not a physical item, but a part of his abilities, the same way as his fishing road, akin to Kinshiki's Tool Creation Technique. Ravenlot 27 (talk) 13:44, June 14, 2018 (UTC)

Sharingan usage?
Am I the only one who thinks that there's no basis to list Sharingan amongst Urashiki's abilities? I mean, his ability to see through the opponents' tactics was attributed to his Byakugan, while the Rinne-Sharingan-styled left eye he activated was called just Rinnegan. I do realise that it's similar to Sasuke's version, but even Sasuke's left eye is still officially Rinnegan (although it retains his Sharingan abilities, it's called Rinnegan nonetheless). Regarding Urashiki's supposed copying of Gaara's sand techniques, it could've been the simple observation and replication he used, and his left eye wasn't activated in the Rinne-Sharingan style, it remained as a Byakugan almost all the time, up to the moment Urashiki had to escape from water waterfall of Chojuro. Ravenlot 27 (talk) 14:20, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * You're not the only one. I also don't understand it.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 14:23, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * The Rinnegan doesn't have tomoe, the Sharingan does. The tomoe in Sasuke's Rinnegan are his Sharingan's tomoe, this is clearly demonstrated in Gaiden. There is no reason to think Urashiki's case is different.

For something to be Rinne Sharingan, it has to be in the forehead, be clearly red (not just flashing red for a moment) and have 9 tomoe. For Sasuke, the reason why his eye has been referred to just as the Rinnegan, is because his Rinnegan is always present, while as shown in the Gaiden, the tomoe are not, because the Sharingan is something that can be turned on and off.--Elve Talk Page 14:24, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * I didn't say the eye is supposed to be a Rinne Sharingan, I just called it this way for convenience. It's just that Urashiki's eye isn't exactly the same as other Rinnegan related doujutsu seen before. It's even different from Sasuke's Rinnegan in several ways (the eye contains Byakugan and Rinnegan simultaneously, can be activated at will and is reddish in colour). I simply suggest to left its status as the Rinnegan, as it was called by Gaara, and don't throw up any of our own assumptions about its nature for the time being, until cleared in the series. Ravenlot 27 (talk) 14:32, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * ^^Very much agreed. Gaara called it a Rinnegan. It's similar to Sasuke's, but not exactly the same. I'd wait for clarification too.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 14:36, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Gaara didn't even see it though. He just assumed that Urashiki used a Rinnegan to escape--Elve Talk Page 14:52, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Sasuke also assumed that Rinne Sharingan was a Rinnegan when he stated that IT is a Rinnegan genjutsu. At the time, we didn't have any idea about the existence of such form as Rinne Sharingan, so the doujutsu was treated as Rinnegan up to the time it was cleared up in the databook. I don't see how Urashiki's case is in any way different. We have only this one statement regarding Urashiki's eye and should stick to it as well until cleared up by the later statements. Ravenlot 27 (talk) 14:56, June 14, 2018 (UTC)

This is a Rinne Sharingan. Sasuke's Rinnegan has tomoe because of his Mangekyo Sharingan. Did Urashiki show a Mangekyo Sharingan? If not, the case is clear. • Seelentau 愛 議 15:03, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Not really, we just saw one of his eyes in the scene. For all we know we might see Sharingan/Mangekyou Sharingan from him later. Shouldn't Rinne Sharingan be a forehead eye with 9 tomoe?--Elve Talk Page 17:33, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * .--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 17:39, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Considering the Rinnegan is capable of being red and having tomoe, it's not a clear case of it being a Rinne Sharingan. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 17:49, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Really? Show me a red Rinnegan with tomoe then. • Seelentau 愛 議 17:50, June 14, 2018 (UTC)

We really shouldn't assume that all Rinnegan are the same. Madara's, Sasuke's, and Momoshiki's are already all different and have different powers. The only time we've seen two Rinnegan look the same are Hagoromo's and Madara's. By all appearances, this is a red-tinted, one-eyed, six-tomoe Rinnegan. Whether an assumption or not, Gaara called it the Rinnegan. We certainly shouldn't assume more than he did. FF-Suzaku (talk) 17:55, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Sasuke's Rinnegan looks exactly like Madara's and Hagoromo's. • Seelentau 愛 議 17:57, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Exactly, the tomoe in Sasuke's Rinnegan are his Sharingan, he doesn't have 'special' Rinnegan. For 6 tomoed Rinne Sharingan, I know that it was a thing, when the Ten-Tails was incomplete. The thing is, I would wait a little bit to label it a Rinne Sharingan. If it's red still the next time it's shown, then it somehow just might as well be one... even though it should be a forehead eye, but whatever... let's wait a little bit. But it's clearly not just Rinnegan, it's either weirdly Rinne Sharingan or Rinnegan with Sharingan.--Elve Talk Page 18:08, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Tomoe indicate presence of Sharingan, so it's either a Rinnegan that also has Sharingan powers like Sasuke's, or a Rinne Sharigan, and since that has always been a third eye, for now, I'd list it as Sharingan as well. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 18:11, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * But then we'd assume that he has the Sharingan, which wasn't shown either. I think we shouldn't declare it as either, but note that it could be either. • Seelentau 愛 議 18:13, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * Considering the Rinne Sharingan has origins in Shinju's chakra fruit and there are more Shinjus in the universe/in other universes, is it really surprising that other Otsutsuki, who also consume these fruits, would have Sharingan and Rinnegan?--Elve Talk Page 18:18, June 14, 2018 (UTC)

For a time being, would everyone agree to leave the eye alone as a Rinnegan, as stated in the episode, without assuming its Rinne-Sharingan or Sharingan-inclusion nature, until further explanation in the series? (Probably, with some statements in trivia section about its unusual nature.) Ravenlot 27 (talk) 18:19, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * I can agree to that. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:05, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * I changed the wording a little, because whatever it may be, it's still an outlier for the time being. Also, we'd need a picture for the Rinnegan article, but I dunno who makes those. • Seelentau 愛 議 19:13, June 14, 2018 (UTC)
 * I know who to contact. Hopefully he'll respond. 19:22, June 14, 2018 (UTC)