Board Thread:Consensus Track/@comment-38502514-20190216075013/@comment-1512913-20190217111934

Serendipity18 wrote: 'feminism' I just said it has origins within feminism. Just like all things, feminism has changed over the years. Serendipity18 wrote: Second of all, why are you bringing up science? Let people live their lives. There is no science to support it, but there is no science to disprove it. In fact, studies have shown that the mind of a trans baby does in fact reflect opposite genders etc. So while we can’t say chromosomes can magically change in favour of trans, it doesn’t matter. Trans baby? Seriously? You know a brain of a baby reflects whatever is around it as it's in the most major stages of development and learns by imitation? Not to mention there comes puberty later which finalizes the brain development, so there is no such thing as a trans baby, it's just a phase until the child is fully developed. Serendipity18 wrote: But here’s the REAL important thing. This is a work of fiction. Where foxes have nine tails and people spit fire. I think topics of “science” are very irrelevant. You’re saying people can’t change sex in real life so Oro should stay put. Well Oro isn’t in reality. Oro has changed literal sex multiple times. Oro has changed in to a snake, and a hydra. Oro isn’t in our reality. So why is science or feminism even being brought to the table? As far as we know, Orochimaru's monstrous snake body is still biologically male. This is sort of supported when Orochimaru is recreated by Jugo taking a piece of Kabuto's flesh and then Orochimaru coming back in his original body, even with original height he had before he started to switch bodies. Serendipity18 wrote: Are we going to say Tsunade and Sakura shouldn’t be physically stronger than B or A? Because scientifically muscle mass doesn’t work like that and female bodies can’t hold as much as two fully grown very muscular males? No. Because this is a work of fiction. We aren’t using real life regulations. It would be bizarre to try work things out as if these people are real people. If Tsunade can heal a stab wound by magic, she can punch a wall. That's the lore of the Naruto verse. Tsunade and Sakura's physical strength are for the most part not based on muscle mass but chakra control, but go on. Serendipity18 wrote: Another thing is this whole debate on why Kakashi isn’t being portrayed as a former sharingan user but as his current form. Why is this an issue? We made Oro represent what he is now, and that is “various”, or non-gendered. If we put him as “male” we would be taking first season Oro only. Which is like saying Kakashi has the sharingan even though he doesn’t anymore, or Jiraiya is alive. We are taking the latest info of Oro and updating it. Ins't this more in line with what you wanted? I want consistency, that's all. Serendipity18 wrote: Various is very suitable. And it’s really not about whether you believe in trans or feminism. It was, as a non binary person, a bit hard to read your misconceptions on the idea. But I hope you understand now that gender identity is shifting away from a mere PC term, and in to something more recognized. We do have examples of Non binary and trans creatures in nature, if you're ever interested in researching the topic for evidence. Cows, birds, fish, there are a lot of examples of very interesting cases. That very much show case gender is more fluid than we have it credit for. Are you seriously using behavior and mentality of wild beasts as something the human race should strive for? 2 female hyenas can penetrate each other or a female hyena penetrate male hyena (thanks to their enlarged clitoris) or 2 male hyenas penetrate each other... does that mean they are trans or non-binary or whatever? No, it doesn't, sorry. Gender (non-biological) is a human invention and concept, so you can't retroactively use it to claim that it has existed within nature, because of social roles in animal families and homosexual activity, because we are clearly more intelligent than them, or aren't we? Monkeys pee into each others' mouths and throws feces at each other.... let's make that a thing now, oh wait.... Serendipity18 wrote: But in this case, we are not pretending to be scientists. We are giving facts on a fantasy world. A world where someone has and did change gender and sex. So having it there is important. I do feel real life mentions of lgbtq+ issues should be kept outside this topic. As this is purely a work of fiction where anything is possible, and no one is asking for a political debate on your belief on real life people who transition and do not conform to binary views.

I'm still very much in support of the idea of "various" being used, as it won't step on anyones toes, and it is very accurate and factual on what Oro has displayed. You were the ones who brought it up as a political debate.