Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-26636534-20180830184727/@comment-34194151-20190111125340

@Ninja of War

No, it's because you are now ignoring BASICS of genjutsu and ninjutsu and you are the one ignoring arguments which is why I got annoyed. I clearly stated from the beginning, Itachi's THIRTY PERCENT usage of Ephemeral entrapping naruto is a feat because at 100 percent he makes his genjutsu more viable/potent. You are FACTUALLY wrong. You cited Kabuto entrapping a part one naruto when we all now he IMPROVED by early part 2, and Itachi with just 30 percent available still easily kept him in ephemeral.

No, just because he has low stamina ( visibly Tired after a few short battles in Konoha) doesn't mean his stamina is as low as you are claiming. He used three crow clones, multiple amaterasu, tsykuyomi, a few genjutsu, a couple of large katons, and then susano'o before dying.

Genjutus KAi? All NINJUTSU and GENJUTSU require you to FIRST mould chakra then manipulate. Even Jiraiya says that genjutsu itself is a type of ninjutsu. Even rasengan works on the same principle. Genjutsu :release requires you to mould chakra and then manipulate said chakra to forcibly bring your body's chakra flow to a stop against the will of the enemy. It's a simple technique. Mould chakra, then control it to stop the malicious flow of chakra in your body. Moulding more chakra increases the power of the genjutsu release. even if part 2 naruto can only properly manipulate 30 percent of his chakra, that's still ALOT with uzumaki reserves. Itachi has less chakra to work with because he is only at 30 percent. Reread Chapters 90-92, you clearly need to refresh yourself.

Ebisu clearly stated that even with naruto's poor chakra control, he quickly made progress with water walking. Then in Chapter 92, Jiraiya clearly stated that naruto's MASSIVE stamina allows him to get away with his poor chakra control. He is wasteful and not able to manipulate all his chakra properly, but because he can mould so much (especially when you add in NINE TAILS) he can still make powerful/effective jutsu without issue.

Proof? When naruto was able to tap into the nine tails chakra and MOULD MORE CHAKRA for his summoning, he went from summoning a tadpole to summoning GAMABUNTA of all things. His chakra control didn't improve, but moulding more chakra increased the potency of his technique. Naruto always naturally Moulded MORE chakra than he needs in the first place, and yet with his best efforts he STILL couldn't break a genjutsu from a watered down Itachi.

Do you also seriously think SM hashi can make a construct as large as Shinsuusenju just because of his chakra control? It's also equally because of his insane reserves.

What you said about Obito is something you made up. First of all, sharingan incredibly boosts the efficiency of genjutsu. Second of all, Obito himself has HASHIRAMA CELLS which were shown to incredibly boost one's reserves. He easily has the chakra amount, chakra control, plus the support of the Sharingan to achieve that feat. Obito was trained by Madara, he obviously has genjutsu prowess. Madara's Genjutsu was enough to Easily one shot Raikage A4.

Strawman argument. Asuma could compete with Kisame (explicitly listed as an S rank) in close quarters and Kurenai's genjutsu was good enough to be complemented by Itachi even though he easily broke it. They are top jounin. Weaker than Kakashi and Guy, but still strong.

This goes for you @Faito as well. Your scenario ignores Itachi's speed advantage. Again, in the instant Kakashi took to blink. Itachi did 4 actions: shurikens, water style tendril jutsu, Shadow clone jutsu, SUBSTITUTION jutsu.Itachi's jutsu execution is not the only problem. It's the INTELLIGENCE behind it. He purposely forced kakashi to create distance and then spawned the clone behind him and substituted, leaving an exploding clone right next to kurenai. Itachi is now a safe distance away from his own nuke, and while Kakashi correctly deduced which one was the real Itachi AFTER the fact, he didn't have a choice. He had to quickly move to save Kurenai who was walking right into a trap. IF Itachi wanted to, he could have had the clone chase after the retreating Itachi and kurenai, grab them DBZ Chiaotzu STYLE, and blow them to the moon.

Susano'o is fast enough to react to lightning. Totsuka blade is fast enough to blitz both Nagato and Oro without a mental reaction, no matter how hard people downplay. Orochimaru couldn't see the blade. He was genuinely surprised and confused when the blade pierced through him. Itachi also doesn't RELY on speed. He takes advantage of diversions. Yakasa beads were enough to stun SM kabuto enough for him to get tagged by Sasuke's arrow, despite the fact Kabuto showed the ability to casually dodge it before.

Itachi won't be camping in susano'o the way you set it up. Smokescreens allow his clone feinting to happen even EASIER. He doesn't need smokescreens to clone feint in the first place. All the people he clone feinted in the manga were looking right at him. Even Kakashi has to rely on LOS blockers. Itachi is clearly on par with Hashirama in clone feinting, the same dude who clone feinted Madara, a sensor type, in the middle of a kenjutsu clash. Itachi EASILY gets behind Konan and Kimimaro with a crow clone without them noticing, can't downplay feats. Amaterasu incapacitates Kimi easily and he won't be reacting to a blindside attack, because Itachi would time it for when Kimiaro bends down to summon his bracken dance. So now there is zero chance to dodge. Konan's papers are then destroyed by Itachi's katon, the crow clone stuns her by exploding into crows, and then you can pick the finisher of your choice. This fight literally ends before it begins. And he is only used 3 MS techniques and a cheaper crow clone, well within his stamina range.

Itachi doesn't need susano'o active constantly. Not his style. He isn't Sasuke. He relies on subterfuge and speed and uses his hax to end the fight, he doesn't spam. Like I said. Yakasa beads box Orochimaru in, stun him, and blind him. He isn't reacting to Totsuka in that condition. Konan's papers aren't doing jack to Susano'o in the meantime, then Itachi can simply deactivate it as orochimaru is sealed away. Totsuka, even if we ignore the fact that it lacks a physical form as per the request of the OP, it still pierced through Nagato, someone durable enough to easily tank a V2 lariat from Bee, who easily overpowered V2 Raikage while in BASE. It also pierced through Kimimaro's SM enhanced bones, which are known for it's insane durability. Totsuka would more than likely go straight through Orochimaru's rashomon gates, assuming he even had the time to create one in the first place.

Itachi literally can summon yakasa beads, fire totsuka, substitute with clone, all in the time it takes for Orochimaru, Konan and Kimimaro to do one major action. That is the difference in speed. They don't have enough experience against someone with unprecedented genjutsu abilites, unprecedented clone feinting speed, unprecedented jutsu execution speed, incredible combat intellect, and with an ultimate offense and defense to boot. Konan and Kimimaro literally can't harm him. And Orochimaru already bit the dust to a Totsuka blade that was fired without any diversionary tactics.