Board Thread:Naruto Discussions/@comment-40242313-20191028045201/@comment-9782468-20191028202319

Orochimaru was one of the most powerful characters, and I think summoning the Hokage to the battlefield counts him as less than useless.

Hokage Kakashi. He's the Hokage lol. Also Jonin at 12. He's not the most powerful of the cast, but he's far from fodder. His Purple Lightning is powerful enough to summon rain clouds.

Tsunade is pretty far from Hashirama, and that's made clear throughout the series.

Hiruzen fought Orochimaru and weakened 1st and 2nd Hokage when he was nearly 70 and almost won. He died but crippled Orochimaru.

Sakumo had a reputation that overshadowed the Sannin while he was alive.

Bee basically murked Sasuke's entire squad without using any Tailed Beast chakra. He only brought it out when Sasuke used an MS Genjutsu, but that was after he schooled all of them.

I was talking about Gaara without his Tailed Beast, as he spends most of SHippuden without Shukaku. But we agree on post extraction Gaara.

I mean we can debate whether or not they're fodder, I was just pointing out that there those who managed to become very powerful without any of those special things. In any case, this discussion is talking about ranks lol