Board Thread:Naruto Discussions/@comment-27660682-20160128215222/@comment-26773508-20160129075149

Nobody's denying that Hiruzen was strong. We're denying a specific statement that was made early in the series i.e. "Sandaime Hokage was the strongest hokage in Konoha's history." That shit was uttered by Iruka and Kabuto. We know that shit was retconned in Part 2 with the rising prominence of Madara and Hashirama. So no, Hiruzen was NOT the strongest hokage after SPSM Naruto; it was Hashirama. Most of us accept that he was perhaps the second-strongest Hokage (excluding Naruto), but definitely not the strongest.

The manga gives ample proof of that. Dan Kato, Tsunade's sweet little boy toy, claimed that ONLY HASHIRAMA COULD STOP MADARA. Dan lived at a time when Hiruzen was both young and in his prime (most probably in his mid-30s). He also lived at a time when the memories of Hashirama and Madara were still fresh enough. So Dan is a shinobi who was best placed to gauge the power of Prime Hiruzen against Hashirama and EMS Madara. And what did he say? Yeah: ONLY HASHIRAMA CAN DEFEAT EMS MADARA. No mention of Hiruzen whatsoever.

So suck that, you Hiruzen fanboys. You talk about Kishi's "facts" without referencing any credible source. Just name the translator of the DB4, and then name other translators who have cross-checked those "facts" that are supposed to be in DB4. Just naming one lone translator isn't enough, because a lone translation is not VERIFIED.

So until you do that, the rest of us will continue relying on MANGA LORE that says loud and clear that Hashirama was the strongest Hokage who didn't need asspulls to grow stronger. The entirety of Part 2 was dedicated to the glorification of Madara, and how only Hashirama was the only one who could defeat him. SM Kabuto himself states that Hashi and EMS Madara were so inhumanly strong that almost no one in the current generation believed that the legends were true. Tsunade herself was shocked at how powerful Madara was, and she had struggle believing that her grandfather could beat someone that strong. That's manga lore for ya, which is always more important that some obscure databook most people outside of Japan can't buy anyway.

TL;DR: Nobody's denying Hiruzen was powerful. The only point of contention is his Part 1 description as "the most powerful Hokage ever". We know that shit has been retconned, and that Hashi was the strongest, followed by Hiruzen perhaps. Time to move on.