Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-5273810-20150721161252/@comment-5273810-20150814080134

BakumatsuWarrior wrote: Whose list are you talking about? I already said Part 1 Kakashi was inferior to Part 1 Guy, Tsunade, Jiraiya, Orochimaru and Hiruzen. However, he is not inferior to Asuma. Did you miss the part where Kakashi was reputed to be the strongest jonin in Konoha at that time? Because the Sanin, who were much stronger than Kakashi, were all in foreign lands at that time. Also, Kishi didn't hype up Guy too much in Part 1 because of Plot i.e. Guy's jutsus were too OP for the relatively lower-scale ninja battles that were characteristic of Part 1 (unlike Part 2 which had quite a lot of ultra-destructive jutsus). Guy has shown feats which prove he's far superior to Kakashi. Asuma has shown none of it. So no, Kakashi wouldn't lose to Asuma. He would lose to Guy, the Sanin as well as Hiruzen. So Kakashi was like the 6th strongest Konoha ninja in Part 1 (counting Orochimaru). He has a poor combat record but that doesn't make him inferior to Asuma, who lacks both hype and feats. Kakashi's hype and feats are much better than Asuma's, even with his miserable track record. Sorry for the misleading comment I was replying to Minato87 who said Part 1 Guy would lose to Kakashi something that I find ridiculous myself. I was commenting on Kakashi's track record as a Kage level shinobi.

If you are including Orochimaru then you need to include Itachi that is probably his most humiliating defeat in the entire series. I will not include Danzo or Obito as they didn't appear in Part 1 though without a doubt if they were included Kakashi would be below them as well.

As far as I'm concerned with Asuma his performance one on one against Hidan was around par with Kakashi's performance(without using Kamui). As neither really changed that much between Parts 1 and 2 with the only major change coming from Kakashi with Kamui(which he didn't use in his fight against Hidan) that kind of shows the levels of each. It is also interesting to note that for Asuma he was operating blind on how Hidan works(which ultimately got him killed) compared to Kakashi who with said knowledge gave the same level as Asuma which I find rather sad for Kakashi and find impressive for Asuma. If Kakashi was in Asuma's shoes operating blind I have no doubt he would have died just like Asuma did(discounting Kishi's intervention of course like with Guy after 8 gates for example).

Again I hate using the stats(I don't use them for judging how a fight goes and won't here but they can give a pretty good idea of how Kishi sees their overall prowess in a area) but when it comes to minor details like judging prowess in a area it can be a pretty good barometer.

For Asuma and Kakashi they tend to be pretty even but when it comes to stamina Asuma has a slight edge which is one of the few important notes. Again inadmissible in a fight against each other in my opinion but an interesting detail, that Asuma is supposed to have more Chakra in Part 1 and even in Part 2.

As they are around the same league of chakra(with Asuma having a slight edge) it really comes to chakra consumption for their fighting styles. For Kakashi he uses Sharingan which consumes a lot of chakra and has a max of 4 lightning blades before he can't do any more. As in his fight with Zabuza(which is Kakashi's league lets be honest) on the bridge he used like 2 or 3 lightning blades and his dogs he consumed practically all his chakra, who is to say Asuma couldn't do the same? Asuma's fighting style hinges on close combat with his knives in which he is the best in all of Konoha. Asuma also has elemental superiority on Kakashi and so a clash of Asuma's blades and Lightning Blade would go in his favor. Furthermore Asuma's fire attack is a pretty good ability to keep Kakashi at a distance for a bit or force him to go a bit more out there in his attacks.

Perhaps my problem with Kakashi and my nonexistent problem with Asuma stem from the same thing, the hype. Kakashi is renowned as a Kage level shinobi when in my honest opinion he isn't even in that league, nothing supports it. His best fight is against Zabuza who in all honesty is just an elite jonin gone rogue and not a Kage level shinobi himself. Kakashi is said to be as good as Guy in taijutsu which is a hilarious statement and as smart as Shikamaru and while he is very smart he is not as smart as Shikamaru no way.

Asuma meanwhile has no such hype and does mildly well in the brief amount of time we actually got to know him.