Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-25265296-20150827064037/@comment-5936871-20150828172343

QuakingStar wrote: Naruto and Sasuke are overrated. Their fight was over, and they ended I.T. they expended the rest of the chakra Hagoromo gave them. Sasuke of course since he is an Uchiha kept his Rinnegan. But Naruto lost SPSM, never shown using it ever again.. BUT he gained the FULL Kurama and a Hashirama arm. So he got stronger than when he fought Edo Tensei Madara that's for sure, but his absolute strongest will always when he got half of Hagoromo's chakra until he expended it all. IMO Hashirama in Sage Mode would wreck Naruto, and living, Dual Rinnegan Madara would wreck Sasuke. They are indeed very strong, but come on now... who else is alive to compare them to? Kakashi lost his sharingans period, along with the chakra that obito gave him so he's just normal old Kakashi with nothing special going on. If Healthy Prime Nagato, Healthy Itachi, Hashirama, Madara, Tobirama, Prime Hiruzen and Minato were alive then Naruto and Sasuke would easily have tough competition.. in fact in the 4th war they were contrasted with pathetic shells of living people(Edo Tensei) and white zetsu to make them look strong which is... pathetic. Obito alone before becoming TTJ took on Gai, Kakashi, Bee, and Naruto while using Six Paths of Pain on Edo Jinchuriki and controlling their tailed beasts, fighting with them himself and still he never lost to them. Naruto and Sasuke were below even Minato until they got the Sage's chakra gifts for a short time. I would put them at barely Sannin level in the 4th war pre-chakra gift, and a smidge above the Sannin after their fight and I.T. ended. From the Naruto: the Last forward, I would put them at Minato or Tobirama's level. Naruto used SPSM in Gaiden and the Boruto movie, so he still has it. Hashirama in Sage Mode wouldn't even touch Naruto in SPSM, Naruto only in NTCM was on par with Minato's speed. Naruto in SPSM is leagues beyond that, he could easily blitz and one-shot Hashirama before he could react. Madara stands no chance against Sasuke either, he can see and counter his limbo and move significantly faster than Madara with teleportation and decapitate him before he can react, did you not see how he bisected TTJ Madara? Or how Naruto fought against TTJ Madara? Who's stronger than TTJ Obito? Who gave NTCM Naruto, EMS Sasuke, Tobirama, Hashirama, and Minato all plenty of trouble and nearly killed them all on several occasions? Even TBSM Naruto, TBM Minato, and then TBSM Naruto and SS Sasuke plenty of trouble? They only defeated him because they ripped out all of his chakra and had plenty of help from the alliance, other than that he wasn't really fazed by any of their attacks.

Prime Nagato, Prime Itachi, Hashirama, Madara, Tobirama, Prime Hiruzen, and Minato are all nothing compared to them at the level they're at now. Even if they're all more skilled and talented than they are, in terms of raw power, speed, durability, ect, Naruto and Sasuke as they are now would wreck all of them. Also, they weren't pathetic shells of their former selves. Tobirama specifically stated that Orochimaru brought them all back almost at their full power, and Kabuto mastered the Edo Tensei even better than Orochimaru did. Capable of reincarnating all of those shinobi and Madara, who was said to be stronger than he was when he was alive before, until he was brought to life again. Which btw, was only so strong because he took all of Hashirama's Senjutsu chakra and used Limbo on all of the TB that they had no counter too at the time and also got smacked around by them for a bit. Sasuke on the other hand, was able to genjutsu them all and then cast chibaku tensei on them all in an instant with them being unable to do anything.

Also no they weren't below Minato, I agree that NTCM Minato would be much faster. But in the raw power and senjutsu department, that was needed to combat TTJ Obito, they were clearly above him, and way beyond any of the Sannin. I don't even see how you could think they were below Tsunade, Jiraiya, and Orochimaru at that point. Naruto fully mastered SM a long time ago, something Jiraiya couldn't even do. At Minato and Tobirama's level in the last? The hell? Naruto can use Rasenshuriken with one hand in base, use all of Kurama's power and project him outside of his body while using both NTCM and SM, which would be much faster than both Minato and Tobirama since he now has all of Kurama's chakra and Sage Mode added, not just half of NTCM. On top of that, Naruto can concentrate all of Kurama's power into specific body parts to greatly enhance them like when he you know, blocked Toneri's moon splitting attack and then proceeded to ram his fist through it and take Toneri out in a punch.

Also, based on what I hear in the Boruto movie, Naruto and Sasuke are even stronger than before. So no they aren't "overrated" at all, they're just superbly OP. You may not like that, but saying that they're weaker than all of those people after the war is ridiculous. SPSM Naruto and Rinnegan Sasuke faired better against a powered up TTJ Madara using Limbo than Eight Gates Guy ever did, when Madara was at his weakest as a TTJ and didn't use Limbo on Guy at all. They're clearly on an insane level of speed, power, technique, and chakra reserves. Most importantly, Sasuke was said to be at Hagoromo's level when he combined all of the tailed beasts power with his susanoo, a power Naruto could match by absorbing massive amounts of natural energy while hardly having any TSBs left, out of chakra from the other beasts, and only having half of Kurama. Now Naruto may not have TSBs and whether he has the other beasts' chakra is still a big debate, so I wont mention it, but he now has full Kurama and still has SPSM and could still absorb that much natural energy if he wanted too. So just think about that for a second. If you really think they aren't god-like, you're just letting your dislike of them get in the way of seeing what Kishimoto transformed Naruto and Sasuke into at the end of series, they're basically the next Hagoromo (Pre-TTJ) and Hamura.