Talk:Naruto Uzumaki's Jinchūriki Forms

Regarding the "Seven-Tailed Form"
It appears as though Naruto (in his regular Version 2 state) was standing within the seven-tailed Kurama construct, making it sort of the Version 2 equivalent of him manifesting Kurama in his Tailed Beast Mode cloak. Then, as it dissolved away, he seemed to sort of absorb the seven-tailed cloak and its bones into himself before it completely vanished. It's probably worth noting because, filler or not, if the article implies that Naruto was the Kurama construct itself than that form can't really be called Version 2, since that has essentially been defined as a tailed beast's chakra pressed into a human form.--BeyondRed (talk) 05:08, January 12, 2013 (UTC)

Madaragoku13 (talk) 22:31, January 13, 2013 (UTC) which episode does naruto get 7 tails? Madaragoku13 (talk) 22:31, January 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * in the newest one....94.135.242.181 (talk) 22:35, January 13, 2013 (UTC)

Naruto was the construct himself, it was both version 2 and a partial transformation--Elveonora (talk) 11:10, January 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * They really didn't make it very clear, but I guess filler will be filler. The reason I had added the statement about it being a "construct" is that at one point, Miina seems to see Version 2 Naruto inside of the seven-tailed fox and then sees Naruto himself within the Version 2 cloak, although his skin also appeared fine, so maybe the scene should be ignored altogether.--BeyondRed (talk) 02:54, January 15, 2013 (UTC)

The Naruto awakening was inside his/her mind, not physically--Elveonora (talk) 14:15, January 15, 2013 (UTC)

Chakra Transfering
Apparently we arent going to include the Jinchuriki Transformation of the other Shinobi on this page, so I guess we're doing pages for all of them? lol Or what did you have planned Cerez? Skarrj (talk) 14:24, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

Chakra Transfer technique isn't a new jinchuriky form... should be mentioned under Tailed Beast Mode--Elveonora (talk) 14:50, January 16, 2013 (UTC)
 * This. Along with the fact that alterations were seemingly made to the chakra or what not.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 15:25, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

Kurama apparently taught Naruto how to transfer chakra, the "alterations" were simply what he does now all the time, he filtered it from red into yellow--Elveonora (talk) 15:48, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

I propose we add back the section that I had made and Cerez removed. It was a sub section under version 1 reading "Chakra Transfer Technique" and had an image showing naruto transfering chakra to Shikamaru and in the process, Shikamaru entering Version 1. And explained the form and when it was used and all that junk. Skarrj (talk) 07:45, January 17, 2013 (UTC)

Him handing chakra isn't one of his forms, just a skill he has now. A mere sentence can explain that, there's no need for an entire section. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:53, January 17, 2013 (UTC)

In regards to the imperfect forms
Should it be noted that Naruto was able to overcome Kurama's will because of Miina or no? Diamonddeath (talk) 22:47, January 16, 2013 (UTC)

It should. Skarrj (talk) 07:48, January 17, 2013 (UTC)

I included the information, but it was removed. Why is that? I thought Miina helped him in that way. Diamonddeath (talk) 05:03, February 1, 2013 (UTC)

Changing Images
Shouldn't the image for Nine-Tails Chakra Mode Naruto be changed to this one. Even though it depicts Naruto using his Rasenrangan, this image shows Nine-Tails Chakra Mode a lot more clearer than the one being used right now. Wouldn't you guys agree?--Itachi7000 (talk) 01:33, January 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * Not really. Current image is fine. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 03:10, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

Are you sure cause the one that the page is using isn't really all that clear. We should at least try to find a much clearer image.--Itachi7000 (talk) 03:26, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

I don't see a problem with the current image. It's a full body image of him in Nine-Tails Chakra Mode, and every change that happens to him is visible in it. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 14:45, January 19, 2013 (UTC)

minstranslation?
"After Kurama had generated more chakra, modified it and gave it to Naruto, the chakra was sensed all the way in Konohagakure by Sasuke Uchiha, Suigetsu Hōzuki, Jūgo, and Orochimaru" Kurama didn't modify any chakra, also C hints the power was due to Naruto's--Elveonora (talk) 22:42, January 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * As far as I understand, Kurama generated the chakra, something was done to it, and Naruto handed it out. The chakra is sensed as being Naruto's, but it makes a tailed beast cloak. Who performed the change is unclear, but on it being Kurama's and being detected as Naruto's, I think that has to do with how the seal is set up. Remember that Minato left an opening so Kurama's chakra naturally leaks to Naruto. Does that mean Kurama's chakra becomes Naruto's? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:11, January 20, 2013 (UTC)

Naruto no longer has Eight Trigrams Sealing Style tho, but Torii Seal. In Chakra Mode, Naruto separates Kurama's chakra and makes it his own (it even turns from red into his own color, yellow) while shelves his own chakra away. In TBB mode, Naruto merges all 3 chakras together (since his is no longer being eaten away as they are buddies... no chakra trade needed, the one from under the Torii and Kurama's) The generated chakra has mostly Naruto's "nature" (warm and bright) while keeping Kurama's power. Exactly nothing was done to it what hasn't been before, Kurama simply molded enough chakra so Naruto could divide it to those other folks around, that's why it took so long.--Elveonora (talk) 23:37, January 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * There is no way Naruto used his "own" chakra to do what happened in the chapter. What would have been the point of Kurama even talking this chapter? Secondly, how would it be even possible for Naruto to distribute chakra like that? There's nothing special about Naruto's chakra by itself and how exactly would it have caused people to materialise chakra cloaks? If it were only Naruto's, what was the point of even entering Tailed Beast Mode? From what I know, the Eight Trigrams Seal and the Torii Seal is the same thing (it seems the Eight Trigrams Seal might have been designed for this occurrence; wouldn't surprise me); remember for example, that B's seal has not changed from the Iron Armour Seal. As for how the NTCM currently works, that's unclear since they've began cooperating. I think what Kurama and Naruto did is simply based on the way their seal is set up.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 01:03, January 21, 2013 (UTC)
 * From what i see, Naruto took the chakra and mixed it with his own, maybe to get a better handle of it or due to the workings oof the Eight Trigrams seal...besides jinchuriki as a whole do appear to mix their chakra with that of their tailed beast to some extent. Besides i also got the idea that the chakra he took from Kurama, when he gained the NTCM, was finite, and now he's using the power straight from Kurama now. Darksusanoo (talk) 01:26, January 21, 2013 (UTC)
 * I don;t think all jinchūriki's seals work like that, just Naruto's which allows it to "naturally" happen. B at one point had to ask Gyūki to hive him its chakra after his had run out.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 15:17, January 21, 2013 (UTC)

Ugh, in TBB Naruto mixes his chakra with Kurama's, that's common knowledge. Kurama taught Naruto how to do chakra transfer technique, read some chapters back when Kurama says that he will teach him the trick later. Everything has been explained. Currently the mention is wrong, all Kurama did was to restore back used up chakra, no mention of modifications--Elveonora (talk) 18:49, January 21, 2013 (UTC)
 * I'd like to point out that when Killer Bee fought Zetsu disguised as Kisame, he and Gyūki both noted that the chakra cloak was created by Bee's own chakra, while Version 2 was Gyūki's chakra. Is it really that much of a stretch to say that Naruto is melding Kurama's chakra with his own and his chakra is causing the cloaks to form? ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 18:48, January 21, 2013 (UTC)

@Fox, some people just don't follow details properly ._. The chakra is even orange (yellow+red) Naruto has 3 separate chakra in access. His very own, the extracted from Kurama and Kurama's. It works the same with all Jinchuriky--Elveonora (talk) 18:54, January 21, 2013 (UTC)

To avoid making another topic, I think the part about his cloak resembling So6p's silhouette should be moved to Trivia section. The connection might or might not be even there, it's either symbolic or coincidental. Also none of the characters know what he looked like (except the remaining two tailed beasts now) so the note isn't in-universe but from behind the fourth wall. So unless/until someone mentions what he looks like and makes a comparison, it isn't there at all. The necklace/magatama is a part of the Torii Seal's design, and his hair gets spiky just like Hinata's got upwards now--Elveonora (talk) 22:34, January 21, 2013 (UTC)

You are putting too much stock in something like colour rather than information we have been provided. You guys are behaving as if all of this hasn't been referenced in the manga, and we're doing guess-work here. All of this has references in the article.

Still if we go on colour the Nine-Tails Chakra Mode cloak is what colour? Purely yellow, how does that work out now, when we know that a person's normal chakra is yellow in the manga, but at the same time they explained to us that Naruto shelves his own chakra to use Kurama's? Plain and simple Kishimoto could have made it pink for all we should care. The Tailed Beast Mode cloak now actually does have an orange tint to it: still doesn't matter because we were told that the two of them melded their chakra to achieve that form. As for the Hinata bit: her hair isn't spiky, it's the same it's always been, the same goes for Ino, another female for example, their hair is just flying about the place.--Cerez 365 ™(talk) 16:17, January 22, 2013 (UTC)

Not true, every individual has his/her own chakra color in the manga, Naruto's yellow. And yes, I meant hovering by "get spiky"--Elveonora (talk) 16:21, January 22, 2013 (UTC)
 * Wait what? Nobody else has ever had their chakra coloured in the manga. Dōjutsu assign colour to a person's chakra but that does not mean that everybody has their own individual chakra colour. Not only has that never not been seen or said, but actually impossible. There's also a difference between getting spiky like Naruto's which looks like Kurama gelled it up (which gets more feral when it takes Naruto over) and simply flailing in what appears to be breeze or simple movement.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 16:34, January 22, 2013 (UTC)

Are you serious?... Chakra has been shown to vary in color between people in multiple instances... Naruto's yellow, Sasuke's purple, Madara's blue, Kakashi's white... should I go on?--Elveonora (talk) 16:44, January 22, 2013 (UTC)
 * Dude nooooo. Those are Susanoo colours you're talking about? Right then and there Itachi's Susanoo... which is... also yellow. So your point is defeated. Kakashi and Sakumo's chakra colour has only been shown to produce a white effect through the chakra sabre. You could go on but I'm pretty sure outside of the use of a dōjutsu, no one's chakra has ever been coloured differently.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 17:21, January 22, 2013 (UTC)

Susanoo = chakra... No one ever said 2 people can't have the same color, the point is the color isn't generic. stop arguing about known facts please.--Elveonora (talk) 17:36, January 22, 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah I was re-evaluating the Susanoo bit because now I'm a bit confused even though I was the one who write that bit. Still, the Susanoo point doesn't work in your favour with Itachi's Susanoo being yellow. As for the volume cover, that's Lightning Release that Kakashi's using right there not basic chakra flow. Just like what he was doing in the chapter...--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 17:39, January 22, 2013 (UTC)

How come it doesn't? Naruto and Itachi have alike colored chakra, just like Sasuke and Orochimaru have the same. And except it isn't, on the cover page it's purely chakra flow, it doesn't look as lightning and Lighting Release is colored yellow in manga--Elveonora (talk) 17:49, January 22, 2013 (UTC)
 * Because you cannot just draw people from all over the place and just matching them up based off circumstances I'm assuming? When was Sasuke and Orochimaru's chakra even said to be the same colour. Yes it is true that Susanoos have unique colours, but saying "hey Itachi and Naruto have the same chakra colour, no biggie" cannot cut it. As for Kakashi's kunai thing, why would Kishi show lightning release in the chapter then put basic chakra flow on the cover? Look at how it's drawn, to me at least, it looks exactly like it is in the chapter which has it. As for why his and A's lightning natures have two different colours: that could be a whole other debate.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 18:07, January 22, 2013 (UTC)

We are arguing about nothing... it's already offtopic. It was about a mistranslation by pandas. There's another thing that needs to be checked in the chapter, already posted on Seelentau's talkpage. If you want to continue then we can take it to talkpages, but that would be pointless. You have been proven wrong, if you don't think so, then feel free to create another topic elsewhere, also check the trivia for chakra article, the same thing I say is there--Elveonora (talk) 18:12, January 22, 2013 (UTC)
 * I never really intended to continue the discussion. I have read what is on the chakra trivia section and I'm fine with it. People are free to interpret the information any which way they feel a mind to.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 01:04, January 23, 2013 (UTC)

Special transformation
I lol'ed so hard at the argument above, anyway this is Naruto6paths here, about the new chapter, should we note in the trivia section that naruto is able to form a bird in combination with the alliance with his tailed beast mode and the tailed beast cloaks ? It was clearly shown in page 14 of that chapter in the manga stream. --85.90.74.121 (talk) 09:52, January 25, 2013 (UTC)

(No links. Love, TheUltimate3 ಠ_ಠ) --Naruto6paths (talk) 09:54, January 25, 2013 (UTC)

Am I missing something?--Elveonora (talk) 15:31, January 25, 2013 (UTC)

It is not a special transformation. The shinobi clad in the chakra were simply running in a formation that shaped out like a bird. It was to symbolise nothing more than Neji's "will".--Cerez 365 ™(talk) 16:15, January 25, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, but what's with Naruto6paths signing as TheUltimate3?--Elveonora (talk) 16:29, January 25, 2013 (UTC)

He just removed the external link.~ Ultimate  Supreme  16:35, January 25, 2013 (UTC)

Naruto's V2 Chakra Cloak
Since the V1 chakra cloak describes how it changes Naruto's physical appearance, why not do the same for the V2 chakra cloak? 207.216.212.199 (talk) 19:15, January 31, 2013 (UTC)

What about it? It doesn't change his body, just peels off his skin. Any physical changes are result of a partial transformation, it's a separate things from cloaks--Elveonora (talk) 20:25, January 31, 2013 (UTC)

100+ Shadow Clones while in Nine Tails Chakra Mode?
I've noticed a lot of this going on across many pages on this wiki, but I disagree with

"Despite these risks however, once Naruto was on the battlefield, he deployed several of his shadow clones while in this mode to the different divisions to confront the enemy White Zetsu, indicating that the risks associated with this form are not instantaneous."

There seems to be a common theme on the wiki currently that any time there is a plot hole or contradiction in the series, someone fills it in on the wiki with a rationalization. The fact that Naruto, after only having JUST learned nine tails chakra mode, created OVER 100 (not 'several') clones, ALL OF WHOM were in 9 tails chakra mode for an extended period afterward, does not 'indicate' anything other than an oversight. For this to be a quality wiki, we need to be able to call out inconsistencies when they occur, instead of pretending the writing is perfect. SvenBoogie (talk) 06:52, February 4, 2013 (UTC)

i can tell that you want hard proof, but that quote kinda has a point. it was said that there are consequences to using shadow clones while in the nine tails chakra mode. he was just pointing out that it wasn't automatic. it may not be fact, but it has logic behind it, so i personally believe it can stay. 192.183.30.172 (talk) 06:56, February 4, 2013 (UTC)Adam

Your entire response amounts to "it was said that there are consequences to using shadow clones in nine tails chakra mode, yet there weren't, so it needed to be somehow justified." Which was my entire point in the first place. It's a non-factual, opinion only rationalization of why earlier established information was suddenly ignored. SvenBoogie (talk) 07:00, February 4, 2013 (UTC)

Remember when B told Naruto 'bout 'tha, it was back when Naruto hadn't yet gotten all buddy-buddy with Kurama. You don' remember when Naruto asked B how he uses lot's of Gyuuki's Chakra without dyin', and B said it's cuz' they get along they work somethin' out? Now Naruto's appearently "worked somethin" out with Kurama.71.71.58.231 (talk) 07:05, February 4, 2013 (UTC) Yomiko-chan

That would be nice and all, except for the fact that he didn't become friends with Kurama until quite a bit later. In episode 277, the 8 tails tells B:

"Naruto may have learned to use 9 tails' chakra mode, but he hasn't made the 9 tails his friend. Nine tails continues to sap Naruto's chakra. When Naruto's chakra reaches 0, he'll die."

Keep in mind that was said the night before B and Naruto ran into the zetsu clones. No significant change had taken place in the series (particularly in the anime) between that statement and when Narto created over 100 clones in nine tails chakra mode. SvenBoogie (talk) 07:09, February 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh yer talkin' 'bout 'tha thing he did when he and B first came 'ta 'tha battlefield. I thought you were talkin' 'bout in 'tha most recent chapter when Naruto was makin' those clones 'ta Chakra cloaks 'ta 'tha ASF Shinobi.71.71.58.231 (talk) 07:16, February 4, 2013 (UTC) Yomiko-chan

Right, when he and B first encounter their first zetsu clone opponents, immediately after, Naruto sends out over 100 clones, all of them individually using nine tails chakra mode. SvenBoogie (talk) 07:36, February 4, 2013 (UTC)

There is actually a point here, the information in that section is outdated. It was revealed to us some chapters later that Kurama had actually stopped feeding on Naruto's chakra, that is why the young man was able to use so may shadow clones without suffering the adverse effects. Of course it's a rationalization we see him use it and we say "hey, maybe the effects aren't instantaneous because obviously he used the technique and didn't collapse instantly". But thank you all the same for pointing that out. As for the other plothole "covering" that you believe is being done here, sorry, but I can't help you with that.--Cerez 365 ™(talk) 13:07, February 4, 2013 (UTC)

Kurama obviously didn't drain his chakra. But how was he so sure and created them, risking death, then dunno. Maybe 100 clones is "a few" for Naruto, since he could do 1000-2000 (don't remember now) in Part I. with his own power.--Elveonora (talk) 17:19, February 4, 2013 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but i don't recall seeing him use 100 clones, not until we get to Madara's appearance, during which that clone was in sage mode and taking Chakra from a willing Kurama-which in two ways defies the conditions for it to be lethal. the most i see him use before that was at least 6-10, there abouts. --77.102.178.207 (talk) 20:05, March 1, 2013 (UTC)

I have a quick clarification question for everyone. Since Naruto released the seal on Kurama in order to go into Tailed Beast Form, can Kurama have a change of heart and become whole again?--Karldonovan (talk) 07:09, March 3, 2013 (UTC)

If ur asking if Kurama may attempt to take over him again like during Pain fight, then yes and no, it feeds on Naruto's hatred and since he cleansed his mind with that waterfall thingy, he isn't as sensitive and susceptible to negative emotions as before... so unless he gets all emo again, there's nothing Kurama can do to him at the moment, not to mention it also had a change of heart thus I don't see why it would--Elveonora (talk) 15:00, March 3, 2013 (UTC)

Thank you!! And also do we know if Naruto will every be able to fully transform into the nine-tails like Killer bee or is this as far as it goes.--Karldonovan (talk) 17:41, March 3, 2013 (UTC)