Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-33390047-20171108150121/@comment-33390047-20171108214754

Vladosaurus wrote: I don't want to underestimate Jiraya's SM, but he didn't display SM feats to the same degree Naruto did. For instance, Jiraiya's sensing and reactions were quite meh, even in SM. It was pretty BS how he wasn't able to sense and/or react to the Asura path sneaking on him, and he was in SM at that time. He also never displayed Naruto's ability to use NY as an extension of his body. He does have a way larger pool of justu than Naruto, and yes, Naruto did have to make a lot up to, considering the huge gap between their base version, but still Naruto did get a much greater buff with SM than Jiraiya. He will also have to go through about 8 rasenshurikens, who can get both expanded and detonated at will, and knowing Naruto's fighting style, it can come when you least expect it. His shadow clones can also easily make the senjutsu version of the big ball rasengan.

Pain did state that if Jiraiya would've known his secret, he might've won, and Naruto did get support from the frogs and from Kurama, but let's be honest here: Naruto's fight with Pain was on another level than Jiraiya's.

For me this battle could go either way.

He displayed his feats quite well actually. We can both agree his jutsu depth in sage mode >>>> sage naruto plus he used his impartial sage mode to his benefits. The main buffs of sage mode are greater sensory abilities, increased physical strength durability speed etc and added jutsu. Let's assume naruto is a better sensory type, jiraiya's still got the remaining feats on lock.

This whole he couldn't sense pein is another thing people like to bring up, now it's been a while since I watched that fight, but first of all they were in amegakure, peins home turf, not an open plain like naruto had( before going 6 tails). Secondly ma and pa didn't sense him as well so you can't say his sensory abilities are weak, the sneaking up was just that good. Also, and I know everyone knows this, he went in blind(figuratively), in the enemy's home turf.