Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-26005711-20150530210611/@comment-5273810-20150602161415

Aki174 wrote: Any anyway, when Obito revealed himself to Kisame in Part II, Kisame called him the former Mizukage because Obito was the person controlling Yagura. And that shadowy outline matches Obito when he had long hair.

Well I'm wrong then however that still doesn't make sense to me when Obito could just simplify things and do his superduper genjutsu on Bee or Naruto instead of the whole Madara plan. Akatsuki team with a controlled Bee or Naruto. Who can stop them?. There must be a reason why Obito couldn't control Bee or Naruto and it's not clarified in the story. Another theory is that Yagura is willing to let Obito control him in the first place for some unknown reason hence the genjutsu worked or something. Ahh I don't know and I'm not too bothered about it. That is the problem that arose, that people seem to forget. Genjutsu has had certain rules that can have it beat, but Itachi and Obito have broken those rules and overcome those weaknesses. When you're a Genjutsu user on that level you could be feasibly invincible. Obito at the conference even with his nerf should be able to take down all those Kage. None of them have a tailed beast to agitate their chakra. All he needs to do is glance at each one of them place them under a Genjutsu and hold them hostage then take the tailed beasts at his leisure.

But in the end, its really due to plot convenience that he didn't do that. Kishimoto wanted the war arc(and to be honest since I really like that arc, I can't really blame him) and so ignored his Genjutsu prowess. Plus he was a master of woodstyle, why never use it? You can't say it was to hard to control, when he first used Kamui he intermingled between Kamui and Woodstyle flawlessly and without training. Plus since Madara was a woodstyle user himself wouldn't he train him to master the woodstyle? Even if Madara didn't train him in woodstyle, Obito could train himself(and I imagine he did considering how good he is with it). Kishimoto also wanted to build in the fact that Madara was more powerful than Obito so what better way to show that then to have him not be able to do what Madara could? Then what does Madara do, when we see him again? Use abilities linked to the Rinnegan and Woodstyle thus he was kinda overhyped. Why overhyped you say? Because he had to be buffed by Kabuto to do all these things plus to further cement my point even if he wasn't buffed, the only way to do all he did was with those abilities which he never had when he was known to be alive. So Tshuikage when Madara says he was holding back he wasn't holding back all this power since he never had those back then. Anyway I better stop myself, I could go on and on about this, so I should stop now while I have the chance :).

Obito with knowledge and the intelligence to use it(note: he did not have the intelligence when fighting Minato) is on the level of Madara Uchiha before his acquiring the Rinnegan. This is why I have been saying Obito was stronger than the 4th Hokage but still lost by getting cocky. All his opponents believed he was Madara Uchiha. The 4th Hokage said only one person he knew of could do all this "Madara Uchiha". When Itachi met him he believed he was Madara Uchiha even going so far to give him credit for the 9 tails attack(despite having no proof that he did). Perhaps most importantly for all this the 9 tails himself(who had been manipulated by Madara before) believed him to be "Madara Uchiha".

Now I have a question for you, do you believe the 4th Hokage was on the level of Madara Uchiha? If you answer yes then well, why did the 4th Hokage not earn the moniker "God of Shinobi"? If no, then I think you get my point. The fact is during that fight, Obito didn't use everything he had(admittedly the Genjutsu might not have been one of them, though again the point about training from Madara still stands, but if that was something he had then that's another added point to my argument), he was proficient in Woodstyle and his Taijutsu was really, really powerful(just look at after Rin's death before his training and before you say it wasn't his power, Tobi was not helping him as Tobi himself noted). What about Izanagi? He had to of been trained in that by Madara, but yet he never used that during the fight. You might say he didn't want to lose his MS and eyesight but here is question for you. What happened to the left Sharingan of Madara? We know he died without it as when he was revived he didn't have an eye. So where did it go. If you connect the dots he gave that Sharingan to Obito. So I ask again why not use it? He could undo that beating the 4th Hokage gave him and undo the marking on him and with knowledge of his sensei's tricks, win the fight and escape with the 9 tails.