File talk:Kabuto tongue out.png

Didn't happen
This scene never happened. The camera was focused on the tongue only, but not both the eyes and the stuck out tongue. If someone could indicate the time this actually appeared at, I'd appreciate it so I can check it. --Speysider Talk Page 18:40, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
 * I actually combined two images (The tongue only one and the eyes one) into an one image just like done on this image. — Shakhmoot Nadeshiko Village Symbol.svg (Talk) 18:45, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
 * Don't know if you are aware, but doing that doesn't make the picture fair use as it becomes fanart. A similar issue with another user's image (which was two images stitched together) occured a while ago and the image got deleted for that reason. --Speysider Talk Page 18:52, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think we can do this eiher--Elveonora (talk) 18:58, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * I thought it's legal to do that, but what would be supposed to do for these cases? The animators usually seems don't like to do as they are depicted in the manga. I apologise for this mistake. — Shakhmoot Nadeshiko Village Symbol.svg (Talk) 19:01, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * Nothing. We just leave the manga image in. There will be cases where the anime will provide no proper depiction. --Speysider Talk Page 19:04, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

@Spey, ninja'd ._. yeah, we keep the manga image if animators screw up, we should keep the Magatama image as well, it's not seen much in the anime at all--Elveonora (talk) 19:06, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

Speysider's claims about "stitched together images" are pretty entirely bologna. File:Rookie9.jpg is two images. File:Might Guy pose.png is at least three. So long as it's acknowledged in the fair use rationale (as in, don't use the boilerplate "a single frameshot") there's nothing wrong with it. ~SnapperTo 20:10, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * This is news to me, so hurrayyyy to photoshopping images, no standards present at all? ._. --Elveonora (talk) 20:19, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * Geez, you're right; I didn't notice that Shakhmoot removed Kabuto's crows feet when he combined the images. And made his cleavage more pronounced. This is definitely photoshopped! ~SnapperTo 20:29, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * News to me.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol.svg (talk) 20:30, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

Sarcasm isn't your strong point, it's about standards... what are the rules for when even sysops ignore them? Do I have to link you to image policy? Only official ones allowed, two or three merged together ain't directly from the anime. But yeah, ur right, who cares? "No pics, thus didn't happen!!! What should we do? Nah, no problem brah, we will just make our own, so edgy!" --Elveonora (talk) 20:34, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
 * @Snapper2: What do you mean by "removed Kabuto's crows feet"? To be honest, I just combined these two images into one. And by the way, I've never used the Photoshop in my whole life. It's better to make this discussion more opened on a forum here. — Shakhmoot Nadeshiko Village Symbol.svg (Talk) 20:46, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

@Shakhmoot, ignore that, obviously one of Snapper2's crow feet ran away, so now he has just one foot left to stand on. And there's no problem with you, I just disagree with it's usage. Tell me a valid reason for why shouldn't the manga one stay in place--Elveonora (talk) 20:51, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * I don't know what drugs you've been taking Snapper2, but I can assure you that stitching images together is not officially licensed under fair use laws, because the image didn't even come from the anime at all (the animators designed it as two separate images). An image that would be accepted is just seeing Kabuto stick his tongue out (as in, the camera panned down and showed him sticking his tongue out) because that is official. Joining the two separate scenes together is not official and considered fanart, which is banned here. --Speysider Talk Page 20:53, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

@Elveonora: I have no problem that manga images should be supposed to stay instead of these stitched anime images, I did that for the wiki support as well as I saw many images like mine. That's all. — Shakhmoot  (Talk) 20:59, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

I don't watch the anime, so maybe I've misunderstood what this is. Is it an image from two separate scenes or is it one image that the camera is panning across? ~SnapperTo 21:06, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * they are two separate scenes. The animators had the camera pan down from Kabuto's eyes down to his tongue so you could only see one of each other. --Speysider Talk Page 21:10, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

I suggest that someone provides a link to fair use law where this practice is specifically spelled out. Until proven not fair use, the image should stay. — S im A nt 21:11, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

Neither is it mentioned that such practice is allowed in there, then the rules should be more specific--Elveonora (talk) 21:20, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * Simant, isn't the fact that you deleted an image before because it was stitched together proof enough that it isn't allowed ? --Speysider Talk Page 21:22, February 7, 2013 (UTC)
 * The only stitched images I recall deleting where from separate scenes. Otherwise it was likely stitched poorly. — S im A nt 21:34, February 7, 2013 (UTC)

Dantman, where art thou?--Elveonora (talk) 21:25, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * So this image is two scenes and a camera pan? That doesn't make sense. The episode isn't on Viz's website yet so I can't even check for myself. But I can check File:Yamato fused with Hashirama's living clone.png, so let's talk about that. Is that image agreeable?
 * For reference: I think the image Speysider is referring to is File:Dead Ame Orphans.png.
 * The important question is, does the combination of the two images misrepresent anything? I believe that is the intention of the image policy when it says that "images that have been edited (other than for simple resizing or cropping), will all be deleted unconditionally." And obviously it can be changed or made clearer as a result of this discussion. ~SnapperTo 21:58, February 7, 2013 (UTC)


 * This has nothing to do with Fair Use law, AFAIK.
 * Its just that we have to deciede if we should allow these kind of images or consider them as fanart.~ Ultimate  Supreme  11:46, February 8, 2013 (UTC)


 * Like I said before, Simant deleted such an image for being multiple frames stuck together because it's fanart: as in, it is NOT an official scene in the anime and therefore the image could contain additions made by the uploader. Said file has been linked to by Snapper2 above. --Speysider Talk Page 12:37, February 9, 2013 (UTC)

First off, sarcasm is Snap's strong point, just putting that out there. Secondly, I don't think there's anything with the "pan and scan" function so long as it's not copy and pasting three different images together in an editor. As long as our rationale mentions it, we should be fine. It's not something that occurs here all the time, it's a very rare occurrence.--Cerez 365 ™(talk) 13:47, February 9, 2013 (UTC)


 * I don't necessarily think images composed from screenshots of different scenes, as is the case with the deleted Ame example, are bad for the wiki because of their fair use concerns (which they don't have) or because they're inherently fanart (because they're not). They're bad because it's almost impossible for them to be useful in an article. I know regular users can't look at the Ame example, but its dimensions are 2464 x 768 pixels. When that's scaled down to the usual thumbnail size it's almost impossible to make out the image in any meaningful detail. Were the same thing to happen to one of these panned compilations, then they shouldn't be used for the same reason.
 * Speysider is making a point about precedent, that since the Ame image was deleted so should all others that are like it. Yet such an image has been in use since 2008, so a precedent to keep them predates any kind of precedent to delete them.
 * As I said above, the real question should be: does the combined product misrepresent anything? ~SnapperTo 20:04, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * IMO, it misrepresents what the animators intended to display. We are the official wiki and we can't just decide "Oh the animators made a mistake, let's just put two separate scenes (Kabuto's eyes and his tongue are different scenes, even though it's a pan/scan) together and misrepresent the anime completely". What Snapper2 said about precedent is correct: if one image is deleted, then similar images should be deleted for the same reason. --Speysider Talk Page 20:08, February 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Snapper2 said something else regarding precedent, too...
 * It isn't as though each shot was drawn individually; the whole product needs to be drawn, although not necessarily animated throughout, in order for the panning to work. Therefore, combining them restores the image to what it originally was and, presumably, to what the animators would like to be shown if televisions had different dimensions. I'm sure the animators would have loved for the whole Yamato+Hashirama clone to be shown at one time, but they would not be able to do that without filling the rest of the shot with meaningless background and/or reducing the detail of the depiction.
 * And if animators' intentions are so important, then images shouldn't be cropped. The entire screenshot/manga panel should be shown regardless of whether or not something in it is strictly necessary for the wiki's purposes. And yet that isn't what's done. ~SnapperTo 20:35, February 9, 2013 (UTC)