Talk:Obito Uchiha

''' For previous discussions about this character, see also Talk:Tobi and its archives. '''

Izanami
Since Madara said he would teach him the Six Paths jutsu (listed on the info box), Uchiha Kinjutsu and a Yin-Yang jutsu... Could we infer that Izanami is among the jutsu Obito learnt?

I'm sure the Kinjutsu wasn't Izanagi because Izanagi would be the Yin-Yang jutsu.

I thought this would be an interesting avenue of discussion, and something to highlight.

--Jingo12 (talk) 04:04, May 5, 2013 (UTC)

Madara has given no indication he knows Izanami, though he probably does. Madara listed the type of techniques he'd teach Obito, he wasn't enumerating each one. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 04:50, May 5, 2013 (UTC)

Well, as a former leader of the clan and the strongest Uchiha, he is more likely to know, we would list him if Obito used or mentioned it I guess--Elveonora (talk) 10:14, May 5, 2013 (UTC)

Surely the mention of Uchiha Kinjutsu is an indication that he does. After all, Obito did make it specially clear that his Yin-Yang jutsu (that Madara would've taught him) was Izanami. Yet whilst listing what he would teach Obito, he differentiated between this Yin-Yang jutsu and the Uchiha Kinjutsu.

Perhaps not definite, however could we make a little note that is is arguably possible? Akin to how we've got Orochimaru's Sage status in a manner that pleases everyone.

--Jingo12 (talk) 15:33, May 5, 2013 (UTC)

We list Madara as a user of Izanagi, so we either remove that or list both also as users of Izanami to be fair. Also something may be both Uchiha Kinjutsu and yin-yang release in one dude, that doesn't have a thing to do with anything--Elveonora (talk) 15:38, May 5, 2013 (UTC)

I'd think the both option is a good idea, imo.

That idea came to mind, that he was referring to one jutsu that was a Yin-Yang jutsu and an Uchiha Kinjutsu. However when I saw the page, it looked like he literally listed three distinct things he would teach Obito {Six Paths jutsu; Uchiha Kinjutsu; & a Yin-Yang jutsu}. So that means Uchiha Kinjutsu was something different to Yin-Yang jutsu. The Izanami idea cropped up because by that point in the manga, we were already aware that Izanami was an Uchiha Kinjutsu and that Izanagi was a Yin-Yang jutsu.

Rather than put Izanagi, we could perhaps list "Uchiha Kinjutsu" to be safe? Though personally I'd go with your Izanami on both articles idea.

--Jingo12 (talk) 03:42, May 6, 2013 (UTC)

"Critically wounded"
The panel dedicated to Obito's Sharingan before he walked into Kakashi's Raikiri indicates he may very well have used a genjutsu. It is speculation at this point in time but so is outright stating he allowed Kakashi to pierce him with this Raikiri.--Reliops (talk) 10:03, May 8, 2013 (UTC)Reliops
 * Well, his right side got crushed, heart tends to be on left so I was wondering ._.--Elveonora (talk) 10:07, May 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * It's genjutsu though. No matter how powerful he or Hashirama's cells are, nothing indicates that Obito could survive something like that when he was coughing blood after being punched in the stomach. Also note that Kakashi's hand came out of him sans the blood.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 11:09, May 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * Yup, I believe it's a genjutsu too, there's no way the Raiki could destroy his heart completely or that he hadn't have one before that since the boulders couldn't destroy his heart I think as it's more on left not to mention Naruto survived the same thing--Elveonora (talk) 11:14, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

Did Obito really phase through the Raikiri?
They're in the other dimension right? So any wounds Obito receives are real since he can't transport pieces of his body. --M4ND0N (talk) 15:28, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think obito phased through because you can tell if you look closer, yes those wounds will be real and maybe he can transport even if he's still in his dimension, but he let kakashi do that so then he could think back to the time when he got rin, and remember obitos' body is like a white zetsus' so the pain or damage wouldn't really affect him --ROOT 根 (talk) 15:31, May 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * Transportation and phasing are separate, he is already transported so he can phase--Elveonora (talk) 15:34, May 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * And where to would he phase? Don't tell me the real world this time.94.135.130.246 (talk) 15:36, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

Exactly. He can't avoid attacks in the other dimension though. That's exactly why Naruto and Kakashi were able to wound him in previous chapters --M4ND0N (talk) 15:39, May 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * The dimension is big, he can phase anywhere. The reason they could hit him in the other dimension is that while parts of his body are intangible in real world, those transported parts are tangible in the other dimension. He is now fully there tho--Elveonora (talk) 15:41, May 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * That's what I meant. It would be stupid of him to transport his chest to the real world where like 30 enemies still remain to see it as an opportunity to kill him.94.135.130.246 (talk) 15:43, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

Except that the hole is bleeding so even if he could transport parts of his body in the other dimension the hole wouldn't be bleeding, and it would become whole again as soon as Kakashi pulled his hand back. --M4ND0N (talk) 15:47, May 8, 2013 (UTC)
 * Sounds logical.94.135.130.246 (talk) 15:49, May 8, 2013 (UTC)

I think he will just heal back from this, all that junk he was doing and all he was saying and to let himself die like that?? I don't think so. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 02:53, May 9, 2013 (UTC)

After reading the previous debate, I think it is 99% positive Obito is just using a Genjutsu, he has NOT been wounded at all. Thank god.. that would of been a shitty ending to him. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 02:55, May 9, 2013 (UTC)

I agree that it's likely a genjutsu, but my observation was that it's physically impossible for him to phase through the attack with kamui in his own dimension. --M4ND0N (talk) 04:40, May 9, 2013 (UTC)

I don't see why everyone is making this all so complicated when really, it's simple.

You see Obito use his Sharingan in one panel, then Kakashi looks shocked, next panel Obito walks into the attack, and then Kakashi sees Rin standing there instead of Obito. He's caught Kakashi in a Genjutsu of the day Rin died. *sigh* There is no need to make it more complicated than it actually is. SusanooUnleashed (talk) 07:07, May 9, 2013 (UTC)

Update to Personality/Ambitions
With 629 revealing the true stimulus for Obito starting the Fourth Shinobi World War, the entire shinobi system, it should be noted somewhere in his personality section as currently the only ambition for his antagonism is for Rin, which played a smaller role than originally believed. Furthermore, he still has yet to express his desire for reuniting with her in the dream world since becoming an adult, so that's speculation in itself. --Uchiha Suraku (talk) 20:24, May 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * I thought it to be obvious. There's no such thing as true peace possible in a chaotic world, that's why he wants to live in an illusion. Rin's death was a trigger though. Had she not died under those circumstances, he wouldn't have lost hope for "this" world. More or less, Nagato's philosophy is also what Obito believes.--Elveonora (talk) 20:35, May 9, 2013 (UTC)


 * Considering like there still many readers that didn't understand that the sentence "You let Rin die" was reffered about the reason for Obito to not return to Konoha also if he was survived (indeed it was Obito's answer to this Kakashi's question), sadly no, it's not obvious...--JK88 (talk) 14:18, May 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Obito even made it clear that he holds no grudges against Kakashi. There's nothing he could have done, but he was considered a hero while in fact he couldn't even save his friends and keep a promise and the true hero is unknown (Rin), that's why he is a trash just like anybody else that is Fortunate by prospering/living off from others' misfortune etc.--Elveonora (talk) 14:29, May 12, 2013 (UTC)

Obito's age
Why does Obito still have no age information? Since he is a former classmate of Guy and Kakashi in their youth, if we follow their current age in Shippuden, he should be 30 now actually too. But why there is no age info at his infobox? 125.212.50.94 (talk) 05:13, May 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * Because people still argue and make wars around this and he is in fact 34 according to manga and databook information.--Elveonora (talk) 12:33, May 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * Well there could be mistakes regarding with both manga and anime timeline. However only time will tell. 125.212.50.94 (talk) 15:37, May 20, 2013 (UTC)

If chapter 599's 3 mistakes are excluded then Obito and Rin would be 2 years and 7 months older than Kakashi in manga and databook. If chapter 599 is excluded period, then in manga and databook Obito and Rin are 3 years and 7 months older than Kakashi. 96.241.55.117 (talk) 01:05, May 25, 2013 (UTC)

No your only evidence is the graduation ages elve, you ignored the reg. numbers, and chapter 599 which only had THREE real errors. You ignored the fact that Itachi and Kakashi only took 1 year to graduate, while no one else is known to have done it, you also ignored the fact that asuma and gai were chunin when rin shows the congratulate kakashi plan knowing they were 11 and 12 meaning kakashi was 11, obito was 13 at kanabi bridge thats a fact and rins scene with the paper was right before the gaiden, jonin sensei's can withhold any of their students from chunin exams for as long as they see fit or if they fail one the jonin can prevent them from taking another until he/she feels they are ready. You seem to not want to accept that either. Kurenais reg. number is right near rins who is near obitos, and the smallest a graduating class has been known as is 36. naruto and sasuke entered academy at 5 and graduated at 12, so did the rest of the konoha 9, kakashi is 8 years 8 months older than itachi, who was 4 in the third war, before it ended, and was 5 when obito attacked konoha. How many facts need to be thrown at you before you realize your ONE evidence of grad ages is not a deciding factor?? 96.241.55.117 (talk) 04:53, May 25, 2013 (UTC)

Ages and facts.
Mind you, there are 36 graduates(ShounenSuki said at least) from the academy each time and ninja registration numbers are what a ninja is given when they pass the academy and become genin, getting their pics taken and reg. number given. Mind you ShounenSuki told me this a some time ago.

Here are the facts

Now Kakashi Graduated the Academy in only one year and was then given his reg. number upon becoming genin. The rest did not graduate in one year. Asuma and Gai were chunin in chapter 599 when rin shows her plan. Obito was 13 at Kanabi Bridge which took place very very soon after Rins plan was shown. Itachi was 4 in the 3rd war, most likely near the end which the Kanabi bridge incident was near. Itachi was 5 when obito atacked konoha. Kakashi is 8 years 8 months older than Itachi and he was 14 years and 25 days during the nine Tails Attack.

The evidence here stacks up evenly, making Kakashi 11 when he became a Jonin, making him 2 years and 7 months younger than Obito and Rin.

Kakashi Hatake Birthdate	 September 15 Age	Part I: 26-27 Part II: 29-30 Ninja Registration	009720 Academy Grad. Age	5 Chūnin Prom. Age	6

Might Gai Birthdate	 January 1 Age	Part I: 26-27 Part II: 30 Ninja Registration	010252 Academy Grad. Age	7 Chūnin Prom. Age	11

Asuma Sarutobi Birthdate	 October 18 Age	Part I: 27-28 Part II: 31 Ninja Registration	010829 Academy Grad. Age	9 Chūnin Prom. Age	12

Kurenai Yuuhi Birthdate	 June 11 Age	Part I: 27-28 Part II: 31 Ninja Registration	010881 Academy Grad. Age	9 Chūnin Prom. Age	13

Rin Nohara Birthdate	 November 15 Ninja Registration	010885 Academy Grad. Age	9 Chūnin Prom. Age	11

Obito Uchiha Birthdate	 February 10 Age	Part I: 13 (Kakashi Gaiden) Ninja Registration	010886 Academy Grad. Age	9 Chūnin Prom. Age	11

96.241.55.117 (talk) 05:21, May 25, 2013 (UTC)

I just realized something
Obito taught Nagato all of the 6 paths techniques... that means he knows them and now that he has Rinnegan he can use them all too. So I say we add them all to his jutsu list 96.241.55.117 (talk) 20:55, May 29, 2013 (UTC)

We don't know if "Madara" taught Nagato anything, but take a look at talkpage discussion regarding Madara's comments about teaching Obito six paths technique, meaning both of them can use all 6--Elveonora (talk) 21:52, May 29, 2013 (UTC)

That is a confusing as to the facts here, as Nagato only was ever shown summoning the gedo and using shinra tensei on a pathetic scale before he became "PAIN" I think after Yahiko's death, he found Tobi again and was willing to learn the rest of the 6 paths techniques all the way. But then again, maybe he was never shown using the techniques then?? But that would not explain Deva Path using shinra tensei to kill Hanzo, which would mean Nagato could of used Bansho tenin and shinra tensei to kill him when they first fought... 96.241.55.117 (talk) 22:52, May 29, 2013 (UTC)

Obito's left part
In the paragraph "body modifications" I think it would be fair to add something about the replacement of his left body's part with the Zetsu materia, like shown us recently when he used Kakashi's chidori to stab his chest and it's possible to see like Obito seems to lack of any organs inside.

Very likely also his left arm must have been replaced (and this would be able to explain the loss of the Zetsu materia from his left arm after Minato's rasengan), but we can't have certainty about it. Anyway I think that we can be sure at least about the replacement of the left part of his thorax.--JK88 (talk) 15:08, June 4, 2013 (UTC)

His lack of organs was likely a genjutsu--Elveonora (talk) 15:19, June 4, 2013 (UTC)

Plot Hole
On This page it states that Obito Uchiha propted the Ame Orpahns to form Akatsuki and controlled Yagura. This was done directly after they were trained by Jiraiya. However the page on Jiraiya states that he hadn't even begun training Minato yet which raises the question.

How could have Obito prompted the Orphans to form Akatsuki and controlled Yagura if the thrid great ninja war hadn't even started yet?

There are three posibilities:

1: The Ame Orphans and Yagura actually met the real Madara Uchiha. This however is unlikely as all sources state that it was Obito.

2: The Ame Orphans were 7 when Jiraiya first met them. He trained them for three years. Let's assume that Minato is the same age as them. So when Jiraiya returns Minato is 10 just graduated from the academy. Minato becomes a Jounin at say 16. He then leads his own team of Obito (aged 9), Kakashi (aged 5) and Rin. Obito was 13 when Kanami bridge happened. Give him 1 year to recover from getting crushed. That would leave the Ame Orpahns at 21 when Obito went to them. . However this would mean that Obito was 16 when he attacked Konoha. The reason for the timeline being sped up is that rumours quickly spread about the Ame orphans which would imply that Akatsuki was formed quite quickly. However that would mean that Minato became Hokage a 21. This is plausible but rather unlikely.

3: Obito can use Kamui to travell through time. It is called time space ninjutsu after all. This is the most likely option.

121.223.147.231 (talk) 08:21, June 10, 2013 (UTC) Skrasnic


 * No, he was dead by then and manga showed Obito meeting them, you know this.
 * Yes and no, the attack on Konoha happened about 5 years after the Kannabi Bridge incident, so Obito was about 18, the rest is correct. For Minato's Hokage age, I'm not sure now if he became Hokage after the war (this would render his reign to about 1 year) or already during it after victory over the bridge mission. For his actual age, everything fits him being as old as Ame Orphans which are about as old as Inoichi, Chooza and Shikaku were, so he died as circa 26. He either became Hokage at 21 as you say or 25. His conversation with A and B suggest the former though.
 * nice try
 * I still don't understand what Yagura has to do with anything? There's no error. Obito controlled Yagura during the war and even possibly still after.--Elveonora (talk) 14:47, June 10, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah Obito was 16 if you count chapter 599 when he attacked Konoha. He was 13 when he "died" at Kanabi Bridge. If you go by the Databook Only, then Obito would be 18 at the Kyuubi Attack. 96.241.55.117 (talk) 07:11, June 11, 2013 (UTC)

Tracking/sensing
since this site doesn't speculate or assume should we get rid of the spot that says he can locate people? for all we know Zetsu is the one that is locating people for him. 173.20.170.66 (talk) 02:09, June 14, 2013 (UTC) NaruHina4ever
 * It's not speculation, he was able to follow the 4th Hokage when the 4th teleported away from him. TricksterKing (talk) 02:15, June 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * We don't know how he does it though. When he intercepted Taka when they were on their way to Konoha, he said he had ways to find them, but didn't elaborate upon it. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:23, June 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * The Suit Clone was stated by Zetsu that it was basically his clone and that it and he could communicate telepathically. 173.20.170.66 (talk) 02:27, June 14, 2013 (UTC) NaruHina4ever

p.s his ways could be zetsu 173.20.170.66 (talk) 02:33, June 14, 2013 (UTC) NaruHina4ever
 * And Zetsu telepathy only works when they're near one another, and as far as we know, there was no Zetsu with Taka for them to talk. Maybe they had spores, but they grow when activated, and for the telepathy to kick in, another Zetsu would need to be close by. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 03:01, June 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * Kind of an assumption, but aren't Zetsus sensors? He is half-one--Elveonora (talk) 09:15, June 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * The "method" was sort of proven already to not have been Tobi, but Zetsu. Remember the Zetsu spores on Sasuke prior? Orochimaru commented that Tobi had them place so they can observe and help Sasuke if need be. I too vote that we remove the part about him finding people anywhere in the world. I mean, he found Minato because he possibly knows the sensing technique. That's not as farfetched as finding anyone in the world, no matter their location. Doesn't make sense, he never said he could do that, and we know how Tobi tracked Sasuke. That particular section, about Tobi's "tracking skills" should be removed. Senju_Symbol.svgKotoSenju (OldUser:JaZZBaND)-Talk-Contributions 11:00, June 14, 2013 (UTC)

Black zetsu was able to sense naruto and bee from a long distance when they got off the island turtle. Black zetsu probably sensed team taka. and as far as the fight against the 4th hokage it was stated that their were zetsu all over the place. 173.20.170.66 (talk) 14:14, June 14, 2013 (UTC) NaruHina4ever So no arguments I'll go ahead and change it? :) 173.20.170.66 (talk) 20:06, June 14, 2013 (UTC) NaruHina4ever

Rinnegan techniques
Obito clearly has them, but as stated in 576 he didn't use them due to the drain on his reserves. Taking into account that he has access and CAN use the jutsu, I say they should be added to him. Orochimaru's Mokuton set a precedent that where we know a character is capable of something, even if it hasn't been shown, certain things should be credited to his profile. This is one of those things imo.--77.102.73.252 (talk) 23:25, June 26, 2013 (UTC)Reliops
 * We've added the ones we saw he could use, and the ones he mentioned he could use. Kekkei genkai isn't the same as a kekkei genkai technique. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 01:24, June 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * "come Obito, I'm gonna teach you six paths technique" he said SIX, not 5 paths, 4 paths, 3 paths, 2 paths or 1 path technique--Elveonora (talk) 14:25, June 27, 2013 (UTC)

Whoops I cited the wrong chapter. It's 567 I meant. In that chapter Gai says Obito isn't using Rinnegan techniques because they have counters for them, to which Kakashi also adds by mentioning the burden of controlling the bijū. i.e. Obito DOES have access to all of the related Six Paths techniques, he just didn't use them then because he they would be countered and a waste of chakra. Chapter 636 also adds to this as Obito is about to the use the Rinne Tensei.--Reliops (talk) 23:24, June 27, 2013 (UTC)
 * Maybe the main "(name) Path" ones, but certainly not the specific ones derived from them. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:43, June 27, 2013 (UTC)

Obito's delusion?
There was a recent exchange between Obito and Kakashi where he mentioned that he doesn't view Kakashi and the "original" Rin as being the "true" Rin and Kakashi, and how the Rin and Kakashi he'll "create" in his new world will be the "real" ones. I really loved that part because it cemented how far gone his character really is and it doesn't make him seem like some random guy simply bent on revenge as he himself admits that he has moved on beyond how he felt about Rin's death and how it impacted him. In that sense, it's a sign how of far his insanity has taken a toll on him or how greatly deluded his views have truly become. But yeah just thought I'd mention that since I think it'd be an interesting addition to his Personality section (specifically the delusion of viewing Kakashi and Rin as imitations to the "real" Kakashi and Rin that he's planning to create). --DementedP (talk) 19:57, July 2, 2013 (UTC)

Obito's motivation
Obito motivations are being described here as too Rin-Centric when the author (Kishi) clearly established that it is about more than that. His goal isn't just to create world where Rin is alive with him because he could have just been focusing on reviving her alone, his goal is to create a reality where people like her don't need to senselessly die. A world where "heroes don't have to make pitiful excuses in front of graves"(Obito, chapter 597).

He said it himself here: "The ones who put this hierarchy into place... the villages... the shinobi.... The realization of what that ideology leads to is what shattered my hopes and dreams... That this world... is nothing but bull ****" (Obito, chapter 629)

He also specifically said that if Kakashi thinks it's just about Rin, he's wrong.

The progression of his character and why he hates the ninja system is actually fairly straightforward. Doubts first came in Gaiden when he heard about how the White-Fang was treated as a failure and when Kakashi was ready to abandon his own comrade over his mission.

Then after he was crushed and disfigured by a rock fighting in the war, Madara pointed out something to him that clearly affected him.

---{no links}---

Notice Obito's reaction on that bottom panel. Clearly, on some levels he realizes Madara is correct and that there is clearly something wrong with a world that would do this to him.

The final straw was when he saw Kakashi murder Rin presumably over some mission the ninja world put out. That is when he finally realized that Madara was correct and that the world was broken and needed fixing.

Considering this, wouldn't it be fair to edit the article to actually reflect Obito's true character motivations. I think this segment that states:

"Only Obito's love for Rin remained, his desire to create a world where she would exist together with him happily becoming the motivation for his actions."

Should be replaced with "Only his desire to change the world remained. His quest to create a reality where the tragedy he and those close to him have suffered would not be possible became the motivation for his actions."

I think that would be a fair assessment of things considering a lot of things he has been saying in recent chapters.

PS: This is more of a grammatical thing but at this part in the article:

"However, Obito laughed as he clarifies he did not start this war for them while using his genjutsu "

Can you replace "them" with Rin or Kakashi, because it isn't very clear within the paragraph where this sentence is.

Thank you for your time. Kenny U (talk) 23:42, July 5, 2013 (UTC) Kenny

Obito did not want to listin to madara at first but he only did so after seeing Rin's death and that is because he was ok with how the world was since Rin was in it, but after she died he accepted Madara's plan right away and not to mention the uchiha's curse that Tobirama talked about after being reincarneited. so in my opinion rin's death IS a huge part of his motivation so i dont think its wrong to describe obito's motivations as too Rin-Centric. but really that's just my opinion.--Charmanking2198 (talk) 00:20, July 6, 2013 (UTC)

Her death brought him Mangekyou, so he clearly was affected on personal level. It's true her death served as a trigger which opened his eyes on the system they live in though. She was on his mind even in the latest chapter. But well, perhaps we should make it less "rin-centered" since she was as much of a reason for Obito's plans as death of Izuna was to Madara's--Elveonora (talk) 00:48, July 6, 2013 (UTC)

Stronger than Hashirama? True & False or Speculation and Theory
It has been stated by Hashirama, but not yet proven physically who is stronger, its just an assumption that doesn't sound right. Skitzo1 (talk) 06:59, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Its an "assumption" by Hashirama himself, that was agreed upon by Tobirama and Hiruzen, who are credible sources. Furthermore, the fact that he was able to not only overtake, but rip completely apart Hashirama and Tobirama, before either one of them could react, lends credit to this statement. We don't put what "seems right" or not into the articles. Hashirama made a statement which was confirmed by two other characters, and then, to some extent, proven by Obito's attack in the next page; hence, the information was added as presented. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 07:16, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, I think that is very clear that Obito is stronger than Hashirama. Come on guys, Obito is the jinchuriki of the Ten-Tails, the strongest beast of the shinobi world. And in the chapter appears that Obito can control it in a excellent way. Hashirama is a genius, but the strength of the transformed Obito is far from him. Obviously, until see more of Obito's skills we can't affirm anything, but the level is higher compared with the Hokages. That is my opinion Leo  Hatake  07:41, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Obito beat a clone? pretty sure it turned to wood after the hit? As obvious as it is, unless he beats Hashirama in a flat out battle, we could never know. Even if more characters agreed who was stronger, we still can never be sure, how many characters in Naruto and other Anime have overcome foes more powerful than them? Well.. If we take into account everything Hashirama has stated about himself, apparently Itachi was a better shinobi than Hashirama, Hashirama said so, so its true right? Not really, Itachi didn't possess the title "God of Shinobi".Skitzo1 (talk) 14:22, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Are you aware that such statements are used by authors to tell the reader how strong a character is? You can think of it as if Kishimoto told us that Obito's now stronger than Hashirama. Seelentau 愛議 14:24, July 9, 2013 (UTC)

Wait one moment... he said Itachi was a better Shinobi than him, he said Obito was stronger than him now. Is that even one in the same?? I am slightly confused here... we need the most accurate translation on the Itachi statement, because if that is true then Itachi is a damn god. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 21:29, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * People missing context as always, there's no problem with a translation but its interpretation. He wasn't talking about Itachi's strength, but what he had to endure and what he did made him a better Shinobi than Hashirama is. The talk was about his action and his sacrifice for the village and his brother, not power--Elveonora (talk) 22:28, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Just associate what was said to whom it was said by and call it a day. "Hashirama has credits Obito's power upon becoming a host to be greater than his own, and assertion agreed on by Tobirama and Hiruzen" or something like that. What's so complex? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:53, July 9, 2013 (UTC)

@ItachiWasAHero, don't be so self-centric please. I used plural, I wasn't referring to your person alone. You react too emotionally over nothing. And I don't remember having any business with your behind, in case you are talking about the deletion of the forum-like speculative topic with no possible conclusion on Nagato's talkpage, things like that do not belong here. And no, my hormone levels are normal, thanks for asking.--Elveonora (talk) 12:24, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

Attacking with his bare hands?
On the page it mentions obito attack Hashirama and Tobirama with his hand but shows that he is using something. I'm not sure what it is but he obviously didn't destroy them with his bare hands. Joshbl56 13:45, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * You mean those black circles around his bare hands, right? I've noticed them as well, I'm not sure if this is a new justu after he acquired the Ten-Tails chakra or not. Let's wait for the next chapters then... — Shakhmoot Nadeshiko Village Symbol.svg (Talk) 13:54, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Agree, let's what until we get a better look at that before mentioning it. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:53, July 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * we should still remove the bare hands part, as its false information. MangekyoSasuke (talk) 00:10, July 11, 2013 (UTC)

Where did the colored image of him attack hashi and tobirama come from?? ItachiWasAHero (talk) 21:13, July 15, 2013 (UTC)

Shape-shifting
Soo...out of Obito's various new capabilities, one not much discussed yet is how he extended his body in a very Orochimaru-like way. When he attacks Gamakichi from underground, does his lower body have a very wood/root-like appearence like Wood Release or is it just me? Either way any opinions are welcomed. Darksusanoo (talk) 19:24, July 17, 2013 (UTC)


 * Soft Physique Modification anybody? ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 20:05, July 17, 2013 (UTC)
 * Maybe...i actually forgot that...Darksusanoo (talk) 21:09, July 17, 2013 (UTC)
 * Perhaps. His sudden expansion reminded me of Jokey Boy. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:24, July 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * We already saw that the Jūbi can expand, drop parts of his body an regenerate them, and lot of other things, it is normal that his Jinchūriki is able to use the same skills. So it as nothing to do with Soft Phsysique Modification, that was something developed by Orochimaru, unless Orochimaru had contact with the Jūbi or Obito, which does not seems had happened. Dan.Faulkner (talk) 00:34, July 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * Orochimaru did not create Soft Physique Modification. It is a basic ninjutsu invented for spying purposes. It perfectly fits what the description of SPM is. How does the Jūbi being able to divide its body have anything with his ability to stretch and expand his own body. That's exactly what SPM does. Obito obviously did it to counter the fact that his body expanded and rendered him unable to move normally because he wasn't used to the Ten-Tails, a fact stated by Minato himself. It is in noway implied to be a new Jinchūriki skill. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 02:49, July 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * You are assuming that, but Obito couldn't do it before becoming Jūbi's Jinchūriki, so doesn't fit as a STM. Dan.Faulkner (talk) 03:11, July 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * No. That's what Minato said. He couldn't move because he wasn't used tot he Jūbi. But, thanks to SPM, he was able to manipulate his body. Go back and read the chapter and then read the technique. Secondly, just because someone has not used something before, doesn't mean they couldn't. He used it as a solution to a problem he had. Not everything he does in that Mode is a Tailed Beast Skill anymore than Naruto doing a Shadow Clone in KCM is a Tailed Beast Skill. They're not. They're two normal techniques. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 03:14, July 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * You really need to read it again, you are the only person supporting this so far, it as nothing to do with SPM, wait for more explanations before adding that assumption. Dan.Faulkner (talk) 03:18, July 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * Really? I count two other people that seem to agree with me. Its not speculation. It is the exact description of SPM. Something you don't seem to be able to see. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 03:19, July 18, 2013 (UTC)

Color Pictures?
Are we using color versions of the manga now? I'm just asking because Obito's page is full of color versions of the manga. I mean, they pose not difference as to black and white, just a question. Zelwolf (talk) 02:05, July 18, 2013 (UTC)Zelwolf
 * Chapter was released in full colour in commemoration of any anniversary of something. Check this week's chapter talk page for more details. Short version: those are official colour pages. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:08, July 18, 2013 (UTC)

Ahh, okay. The chapter I read didn't have the color version. Thanks! Zelwolf (talk) 02:11, July 18, 2013 (UTC)Zelwolf

Chapter 640
"it was revealed that Obito had intended to use it to destroy the unruly right side of his body" WTF is that? No translation I've read implied anything even remotely similar to this statement. Where does it come from? Obito just couldn't control his aim because his mind was fighting with Juubi's mind, that's all to what's happened.Faust-RSI (talk) 09:29, July 26, 2013 (UTC)
 * As nobody is interested with this ridiculous statement left in the article, I've fixet it myself, according with the VIZ translation (Minato: "His attack missed! It looks like Obito's consciousness is merely clinging to Ten tails' great power... He barely has any control over it!").Faust-RSI (talk) 08:38, July 30, 2013 (UTC)

Unnamed Parents?
Could we add unnamed parents to his page? chapter 603 page 9 --Tyler Perry (talk) 14:20, July 28, 2013 (UTC)Tyler Perry
 * We know about them, there's just nowhere to mention them appropriately.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 14:39, July 28, 2013 (UTC)

Intelligence
Ok...a large part of what defines Obito's intelligence was erased...for what reason, i do not understand. Most of the stuff that was erased related to the things he knew about the Sage of the Six Paths and the things he knew about Konoha. Now truth be told the Guy part was silly, but the reasons don't make sense. Obito displayed extensive knowledge of the Leaf Village and the things about the Sage. The source or way he learned it should not matter. By that standard we shouldn't even have these sections since...hell everyone learns by either reading, someone else teaching/saying or by viewing it, etc, etc so we can't start nitpicking that. Darksusanoo (talk) 00:45, August 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * Intelligence and knowledge are two very different things, and you don't seem to be able to distinguish between the two. Intelligence is putting knowledge to use; putting a battle strategy into action, figuring out a great mystery through wit alone, pulling the wool over an equally intelligent person's eyes. Frankly, it is irrelevant that he knows anything. That just proves he has a brain and it functions as it should. We have these sections to display how smart people do smart things. Look at Shikamaru for example. We don't spend three paragraphs trying to explain to the readers that he know Nara Clan techniques, or knows how to throw a kunai. That's stupid. We show that he is intelligent by mentioning that he is an expert tactician. Also, on a side note, I believe Snapper2 asked you to stop editing Obito and Madara's pages 15 times a day, because problems like this tend to arise. Your devotion to them is admirable, but we can't be adding little nitpicky stuff, like this, to the article, when its already mentioned in the Plot section or elsewhere. Not to mention its not even appropriate in the section you placed it in. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 00:51, August 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * Ok your ideas are as twisted as anything i've ever heared...how could he have pulled half the stuff he did without that knowledge? Intelligence is knowing how to apply knowledge...to do that, you need to know stuff...how you learned it is not important...what's important is if the information is true and how you use it. It isn't nitpicking stuff (the Guy phrase was silly and not of my authory, hell most of that part wasn't) but how he could identify a lot of jutsu and a lot of stuff about the village...hell redo that section, shortnend that but do not remove it. Also do not comment on what i edit or do not edit...that is what's not appropriate to mention on this section. Darksusanoo (talk) 01:06, August 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * Regardless, we're not in the business of recording everyone's knowledge in the intelligence section. Just how to apply the knowledge, which is intelligence. Most of what you entered in your massive paragraph was unneeded speculation and irrelevant to his intelligence. It serves us no purpose to understand what a character knows, only how they apply it. That is what intelligence sections are for. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 01:12, August 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * Hum did the part where i said that part was not written by me missed you by any chance...plus what was there was applied by him...hence why i said redo it ', don't erase it. Darksusanoo (talk) 01:15, August 1, 2013 (UTC)
 * The reason all of it was removed was because none of it was redeemable. I'm not in the business of removing information beneficial to characters...--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 01:27, August 1, 2013 (UTC)

I don't see a separate section for "Knowledge", so I don't see why we can't include that portion of his mental prowess in the intelligence section. In particular, the notes about Guy and the Aburame clan were noteworthy because they added evidence to his "vast knowledge" statement that is already present in the section. We had never even heard of Shikuro Aburame before he encountered Torune, or would never know the name Danzo's summon, etc. Basically, someone took out all of the examples so now it almost looks like an empty claim without any proof to back it up. We may as well just not mention knowledge at all in any of the characters' articles by this logic. --Uchiha Suraku (talk) 01:04, August 2, 2013 (UTC)

Sensor
I have just returned from a trip where I had no internet, and I'm only now catching up on the last few days, so forgive me if this is already being discussed elsewhere, but why is Obito now listed as a sensor? I know he mentioned he sensed Sasuke gathering chakra in his eye to cast Amaterasu, but we've only seen him sensing chakra as a jinchūriki. He's no different from Naruto in either Sage Mode or Nine-Tails' Chakra Mode regarding sensing. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 21:37, August 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * Except sempai, for us to note that we'd need to have a better grasp about the Ten Tails' abilities and whole thing about the Ten Tails chakra being like natural energy...also since Madara is a sensor there's also the possibility he taught that to Obito. Darksusanoo (talk) 22:05, August 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * You can't just teach someone how to be a sensor, it's innate. Omni, you do have a point though, Obito's sensory ability may be conditional to his new mode. But then he could be a sensor, would explain that peculiar habit of being able to locate people all the time.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 22:10, August 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * Technically senpai we don't know exactly how one becomes a sensor...if it's a purely innate thing or if it can be taught to a certain degree. Also another thing is that NTCM doesn't sense chakra, it senses negative emotions. But overall there's too much unknowns to determine if it's Obito's own power or he gained it from the Ten-Tails. Darksusanoo (talk) 22:16, August 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * Except Kishi has made Naruto suddenly sense chakra as well in NTCM. Also Obito is likely to be a sensor since he could locate people and stuff--Elveonora (talk) 23:43, August 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * See that's the thing...in what chapters were Obito's tracking abilities ever noted, could someone tell me? Darksusanoo (talk) 01:19, August 5, 2013 (UTC)

Well, he found Konan and Taka and we don't know how.--Elveonora (talk) 14:04, August 5, 2013 (UTC)

He found Minato, and Kushina and they were in a barrier. He was heading towards Naruto when he had the six paths with him, and he found Taka and Konan as mentioned above... he is clearly a sensor as he did not use Kamui when he was heading directly towards Bee and Naruto. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 21:58, August 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, he is listed as of now so all good. There's evidence for sensory skill while nothing against. After all, Hashirama is a sensor, Zetsu was a sensor, Madara is a sensor... Perhaps Hash cells have something to do with it ^_--Elveonora (talk) 22:03, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

It could be just Senju DNA in general makes a person more attuned to sensory ability, as in Tobirama for example. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 22:44, August 12, 2013 (UTC)


 * That may be taking it too far. We've seen Senju who haven't shown any sensor abilities (Tsunade) and there has never been any talk about the Senju being a clan of sensor-type shinobi. Joshbl56  23:02, August 12, 2013 (UTC)

Finding Minato and Kushina inside a barrier means nothing. Is there any indication that the barrier used blocks sensing? Only the barrier on the island turtle was ever explicitly shown to block that. Besides, until I see a translation, his "sensing" of Sasuke preparing Amaterasu could just as easily be him seeing the chakra gathering with the Sharingan or the Rinnegan. Just because he crossed paths with Naruto and B, doesn't mean he knew where they were going. Evidence for sensory skill is circumstantial at best, I'd sooner call it conjecture instead of evidence. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:33, August 12, 2013 (UTC)


 * Regarding him noticing Sasuke building up chakra in his eye, are we sure that wasn't his Sharingan/Rinnegan? With those, he can see chakra and where its being focused rather easily, and... he was looking right at them as they were preparing their attack. To call him a sensor I think is doing a fair bit of stretching the facts. He found Konan. So? He's been shown meeting with Nagato and Konan at their tower. He found Konan at said tower. Not to much of a stretch to say he just went to the tower, knowing she'd be there. Omni already cleared up the Minato and Kushina thing. There was also the fact that Kakashi blabbed the location of Naruto's birth to Rin's grave and Obito, like a first class stalker, was listening in the tree. We saw that in the flashback. The only one we really can't explain is his finding Taka, and that could be any number of reasons. Remember, he has a network of Zetsu that are literally all over the place underground, communicating with the main one, and, at the time, Zetsu went everwhere with him. Not hard to imagine Zetsu just told him where they were going. So, I'm with Omnibender here; prove he could sense outside of his Ten-Tails form, and we can call him a sensor. Otherwise, I'd say its just a jinchūriki power he gained. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 00:28, August 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * If he didn't actually see the chakra gathering with either eye. Obito has used the term sensing or something similar for seeing chakra with the Sharingan before. When the Alliance made that huge technique combo against the Ten-Tails' first form, when the Wind Release pushed the mist and the insects towards the Ten-Tails, Obito looked right at it with the Sharingan and told Madara they wouldn't be able to sense them. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:33, August 13, 2013 (UTC)


 * That's what I was thinking too. It didn't strike me that he was actually sensing their chakra, rather just viewing it with the Sharingan. On both mentioned occasions, he's staring right at the target when commenting on the chakra he "felt". So, unless his Sharingan is all of the sudden malfunctioning, I'd feel safer pinning it on the Sharingan or the Rinnegan, rather than some phantom sensing ability that came out of nowhere. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 02:45, August 13, 2013 (UTC)

Inability to use Kamui
In some translations it says that Obito can not travel between dimensions, but in others (notably mangastreams) it says "I can't afford to be reckless" instead. which one is the mistranslation? Almightywood (talk) 21:40, August 30, 2013 (UTC)
 * See here. Seelentau 愛議 21:47, August 30, 2013 (UTC)

Infobox image
I know this might seem out of the blue but I've noticed that in a lot of cases we usually have a preference to use infobox images of a character as they were depicted in their debut in the present storyline, in the cases of using the photos of many of the characters as they appeared in Part 1. However, Kakashi Gaiden was never part of the present story, it was a flashback. Nagato had a flashback too, depicting his younger self long before his present self was formally revealed, yet we use a photo of Nagato as an adult for his infobox. Does anyone agree that it would be appropriate to do the same for Obito, due to the fact that he only really appears in the present storyline as an adult? It seems like a similar situation to Nagato. --Mandon (talk) 05:05, September 9, 2013 (UTC)


 * Nagato's appearance in the story never changed (he was just a bit taller and slightly emaciated, but his overall appearance stayed the same), but the series introduced Obito with a mask under the name of Tobi. Later he would be introduced as Obito and since both masked Tobi and no mask Obito have been shown in the anime, both his younger self and his masked alias are used in the infobox. When the anime depicts his older appearance in the war, it is most likely to be used (if the community agrees to it at the time). However, while Kakashi Gaiden was a flashback, it is a major part of the entire storyline of Naruto because it explains a lot about Kakashi and his team then. --Speysider Talk Page 08:52, September 9, 2013 (UTC)


 * Kakashi Gaiden is however, a glorified flashback no matter how you look at it and Tobi's first actual appearance in the series was with the mask. I always figured we should have just kept the Tobi image in the infobox, I just never made a fuss over it because to I was certain the Tobito fans would find me and string me up from a tree.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol.svg (talk) 10:11, September 9, 2013 (UTC)

I think it's okay to use two images, but we've never used flashback images for a character's infobox unless they haven't appeared in the main story. Take Obito for example, we used his Gaiden pic because that's all there was. We thought he was dead so it made sense to use it.. but now I'm not so sure. It's reasonable to keep it until chapter 599 is animated but after that I'm all for changing it to his present look. --Mandon (talk) 19:27, September 9, 2013 (UTC)

I agree. The original Obito is long dead, doesn't make sense to use picture of him as a child. Not only it was a flashback, but the person he used to be is gone. It's even more out of context considering his villainous acts and dialogue and then looking at his Part I. pic in the infobox... What about using the colored cover which has both his young and older selves?--Elveonora (talk) 21:13, September 9, 2013 (UTC)


 * That will bring back the can of worms about colored manga images and blah blah blah. Would rather we just use the one with the mask and avoid it.
 * Or hell maybe it wont. We came to an agreement about Part I and II images but not about this.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol.svg (talk) 21:15, September 9, 2013 (UTC)

The fact that it doesn't portray his villainous self is slightly irrelevant Elve, but I agree that kid-Obito isn't very imposing for one of the main antagonists. What makes want it changed is the simple fact that we've never used flashback photos for an infobox. The standard has always been the usage of a photo of a character as they appeared in the CURRENT timeline. We don't use a photo of Naruto as a small child for his infobox, so we shouldn't do it for Obito. I also think the Tobi photo should be temporarily used for the default image used if the digital colored manga panel is out of the question for his unmasked self, it is how he initially appeared in the present storyline after all, but then Haku also appeared with his mask on during his debut yet we use a photo of his face. so if we're allowed to use the digital colored manga then I think we should replace the Kakashi Gaiden image with it. --Mandon (talk) 06:12, September 10, 2013 (UTC)

Just use the image of his debut adult face (even though I personally don't like it as it's slightly different from the following face shots), when the mask was destroyed in 599. It's already in the article under Appearance, so just set it as default. --Uchiha Suraku (talk) 06:24, September 10, 2013 (UTC)

I don't buy the Haku argument. Haku was introduced with a mask, but was quickly shown without it. Obito was introduced as masked, and remained so for a significant portion of the story. Would you like us to change Yamato's image to his ANBU mask image as well? Do you think we'd change Kakashi's infobox image to one of him without the mask should we ever see him without it? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:15, September 10, 2013 (UTC)

TOBI has been seen for a long time with his mask, but as soon as the mask came off was when we found out it was Obito. and he has been unmasked for a long time now. Theres a huge difference between Obito and Kakashi's masks.--RexGodwin (talk) 03:33, September 11, 2013 (UTC)

I'm all for using his current face without mask. There have been enough arguments already. But maybe we should wait for the anime version, because the first panels of him (unmasked) aren't of good quality and even more - slightly differ from the main style used in later chapters.Faust-RSI (talk) 06:04, September 11, 2013 (UTC)

Possible surname to mention?
In chapter 63, Obito was called by Madara "Messiah"/"Saviour or the world" (here the raw version of the page: http://i.imgur.com/1EcPrMH.jpg). I know that very likely Madara was stating this just for deceving the boy (and that surely completing the Moon's Eye plan don't make of him a saviour), however considering the paralles between Obito and Naruto, I think that the use of this expression was made on purpose by the author to put another similarity between him and main character, called in the same way by the alliance. So I was thinking that could be worthy to add this surname on his list, or at least mentioning this parallel on his trivia section.--JK88 (talk) 18:44, September 11, 2013 (UTC)