User talk:TheUltimate3

I need help, please
Ya, I wondered about that, too. Gotta see what the raw says. Seelentau 愛議 14:12, April 2, 2014 (UTC)

So...
it seems we have a deeper problem in this wiki. I got that feeling ever since ShounenSuki left. He was the calm that held the wiki together and now that he's gone, every discussion turns ape-shit in a couple of hours. See Blaze Release. I asked Elve-kun to start a discussion and left for maybe four hours, and when I come back, there are multiple replies with accusations and bolded words, because we all know that someone who bolds his words is right and the others are wrong.

Ever since I began here, I only wanted to clarify stuff, since I'm most likely the one with the most Naruto knowledge, at least in the German fandom. I never intended to give my personal views on happenings, every discussion I began was based on the manga and what he gives us. But most of the time, I'm confronted with ignorance and words like bias or so.

You remember when Suki did his New Years Fact Checking or whatever he called it? He explained some stuff and BAMM, everyone believed him, no big deal. Now I do the same, I explain to you guys what Enton, Senjutsu and all that stuff is, all based on the manga and everything, but in return I get "discussions" as seen on the Blaze Release talk page.

If it was a random fan who wanted to tell us otherwise because he simply doesn't know better, I'd do it like you and not start a big discussion. But I am by no means a random fan. As I said before, I'm Seelentau, I know my stuff and I believe you guys should trust me a little more, instead of telling me to go and beat dead dolphin horse babies or whatever.

Anyways, I think we need to find a new calm. I originally intended to be it, but apparently, I'm not suited for it. So what do we do? I don't wanna go the current road any longer (or at all). • Seelentau 愛 議 22:00, June 25, 2014 (UTC)


 * If I may offer a solution: maybe Seelentau should replace Suki as a sysop in the capacity of the site's translator. Considering Suki has, in effect, left the wiki, I think this is the most appropriate thing to do. --SuperSajuuk Talk Page 22:02, June 25, 2014 (UTC)
 * The problem we are having is that everyone's ego is damn too high and each one of us wants to be right and command the others. That's pretty much all. Having had a single figure (Suki) that we followed had its pros imo. Because now, we all want to be Suki. To put it into better words: People demand democracy and want to overthrow the monarch. But once the rule is in their hands, they start fighting against each other--Elveonora (talk) 23:04, June 25, 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you, both of you for your feedback. The decision on who should be a sysop is not mine to make. That lies with Dantman.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol.svg (talk) 23:18, June 25, 2014 (UTC)
 * Ya, thank you guys for replying. But I don't think making me a Sysop is going to solve the core problem. It doesn't make me more correct than the rest of you guys or in any way better than you. I think the only little thing most of you need to understand is that I in fact see things as black and white when it comes to the manga. At least 95% of everything I write during discussions is based on what the manga gave us. That's also why I don't understand anyone who calls me biased or a fanboy. It could very well be that I'm blinded by myself or so, but if you really want to prove me wrong, calling me something or saying I beat things isn't the right way. I mean, we all work towards the same goal and when I present you guys a possible mistake, it's your job to prove me wrong, not prove why you're right or call me anything. For example, I wrote on the Blaze Release discussion

"that it was cast from one eye, and then manipulated with the other. - but that is not the case. • Seelentau 愛 議 21:38, June 25, 2014 (UTC)"

Now, I say that never happened and the easiest way to prove me wrong would simply be to give me a manga chapter where it happened. From there on, we could discuss further.

Another thing that comes to mind, again related to Blaze Release, is how some of you handle new information. Sasuke used no Blaze Release: Kagutsuchi, but a normal Kagutsuchi (whatever that is). Instead of accepting it as something new, you guys say that it's not something that needs to be discussed, for whatever reason. But I believe that it shines a new light on things. So what are we going to do? • Seelentau 愛 議 09:33, June 26, 2014 (UTC)
 * The main problem lies in the manga itself. I don't know how you guys see it, but in the past, everything that happened in the manga was easy to understand and document. Lately, there pops up so much stuff that's not explained completely or just gives flimsy hints towards things we already took for granted, so the the fans are forced to link the recent events with the "old knowledge" by themselves. Naturally, people interpret certain key elements different than others, and that's where discussions start. Just look at the ridiculously long debates about "Naruto having Magma Release", "Naruto and the 9 Tailed Beasts inside him in general", "Kaguya's eye being a Sharingan or not", "Blaze Release being something we did not think about before or so..." and it goes on and on and on.
 * Of course it's a problem how quickly discussions start to get out of control. I deliberately refrain myself from participating in any of these debates as I know that I will quickly lose any motivation to come to the wiki itself - just because it never goes forward. To spreak in fanboy-language, it reminds me of Izanagi.
 * Making somebody an admin for this reason is again not legit enough for me, but that's not for me to decide either. For future discussions with seemingly no end: A good action in my eyes is to, for once, not continue until every participant hates each other even more while there's still no consensus reached, but instead agree on a way to write down the discussed subject in a way everybody can agree on. If that's not the case, write down both versions as possible probabilities. I know this wiki does not include speculation, but a conclusion based on the own argumentation is also speculation in its own way. I mean, nobody can't really say what's going on in Kishimoto's head, right?
 * The argument "I can't go back on what I said as I am 100% sure it's right" is also no warranty for a victory in the discussion. The opposing participants think so just as well. What gives anybody the right to think that his or her thoughts are superior to others? Norleon (talk) 10:36, June 26, 2014 (UTC)
 * @Seelentau: I don't recall anybody has called you a fanboy. The term get's thrown at everyone else though. That being said, in response to "that it was cast from one eye, and then manipulated with the other. - but that is not the case" comment, when we first see the Kagutsuchi, in chapter 464 states that he Sasuke casts the Amaterasu with his left eye, then manipulates it with the right, which we see in what basically amounts to slow motion in this current chapter. Unless of course you mean to tell me that what has been in the chapter for damn near four years is wrong then by the Old, this wiki we have much much bigger problems. And to a "normal" Kagutsuchi because it dropped the prefix, I will point out to this technique which I was told over and over had to have Wind Release, despite not having it as a suffix.
 * So what are we going to do? At this point, I want to us to stop assuming everything we see is new unless it is actually explained as being new. We have a wealth of information that Kishimoto has already provided us, if he isn't explaining anything now, then we must assume, and I know you really really hate using that word, that it is because we should already know it. But I've stated this 100 times before and naturally that blanket decision is not mine alone to make, but you know that.
 * @Norleon: Izanami. But I see your point. That would be the best course of action, it opens itself up to other issues. For example, picking at the "Naruto and the tailed beasts" thing, that got stupid when it was brought up that because Minato also had a talking tailed beast him in, that that made him a jinchuriki, but when Naruto had 9 of basically the same thing, he wasn't. Then it spiraled into stupid from there. Adjusting it to be more ambiguous could work, but then by that same token it would have to be adjusted to be just as ambiguous for Minato, and so on. And that doesn't get into the realm of infoboxes, categories, ect. The idea is sound and damn may even work. But such ambiguity would have ripples at everything.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol.svg (talk) 11:41, June 26, 2014 (UTC)
 * I'm all for us stating more possibilities in the articles. Why are we so afraid of doing things such as: "Note: Hagoromo proclaimed that his mother has power of the Sharingan, while an identical eye of Madara's was called a Rinnegan. Sasuke's eye which is similar is also a Rinnegan. Currently it's unknown which is true" etc.--Elveonora (talk) 11:46, June 26, 2014 (UTC)
 * @TU: I don't know if I was called it directly, but I was called it indirectly, I think. But that doesn't bother me.
 * Regarding the Blaze Release thing, you're right (as far as I remember the Japanese text). So if he uses his right eye to only manipulate it, then how do you explain the instances where he has only his right eye opened? The fight against Obito comes to mind. Also, the Lava Rasen Shuriken itself is ambiguous, I or instance say it's not Wind Release. So I wouldn't count it as an example. (See? That's what discussions are. Not the horse beating thing.)
 * How does one explain something to be new? Isn't it new if it simply has never happened before? • Seelentau 愛 議 13:20, June 27, 2014 (UTC)
 * Flames created off panel or "quick" (thus still off panel). We don't always see Naruto creating the necessary Wind Release: Rasengan or see him go through the motions of producing shadow clones, but we know he's doing that. But I do not plan to go through the Blaze Release confusion in my talk page. Consider it me losing if that'll make you feel better.
 * But what can be considered new has to actually be new. Small variation of we already know, isn't something totally world breaking new. If it was, damn near more than half of just about everything we see could be labeled a new technique, new trait, new anything, simply because it wasn't 1:1 of what we have seen before. As I stated before, regrettably using the Blaze Release I just said I didn't want to use again, we know his right eye manipulates the flames while his left creates it. What we don't need is two dedicated panels every time Sasuke points black fire arrows at something. Just as we don't need something of 4 panels for Naruto preparing a Rasenshuriken, parts of techniques are cut out to save time, because Kishimoto expects us to know what's happening because he already showed us it before. But something is new when it is actually something that has never happened before. If something happens and we are literally unable to go "Ok in the past, X happened so Y", taking into account the very first use of something, subsequent usage and the like, then that is something new. What we saw with Sasuke wasn't new because we know that is how it has always worked, we just have to use the dreaded common sense to understand that every piece of it is likely not going to be drawn down because it was essentially been a waste.--TheUltimate3 Allied Shinobi Forces Symbol.svg (talk) 13:47, June 27, 2014 (UTC)

weird
I could have sword that I did put your comment back. Although those beers may have something to do with it--Elveonora (talk) 22:43, June 28, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Intervention
The irony of that is astonishing since you guys replaced a much higher quality image with the current one simply because it was "too close up". --Mandon (talk) 22:46, July 5, 2014 (UTC)

Madara Uchiha editing
Look, I am not saying that I am a die-hard fan of Madara, I am just saying that sections like his Sharingan should have more specifics. A lot of cutting out took place after I spent several weeks editing it like I did other pages. I have no problem with simplifying the sections. It's just when you put a lot of work into something, you feel bad when basically it isn't considered good enough and plain cut off. I am not trying to start an edit war I am just speaking my mind.Steveo920, 18:22, July 7, 2014

Sorry if my writing style comes off as an obsessed fan, but I am not. Personally, I hate narcissists. Also, I am not asking you to restore or give the okay for me to restore my edits. I also have been simplifying sections all over the site. I am just saying you didn't have to announce to all readers that I'm "waving my dick to Madara". Steveo920, 19;34, July 7, 2014

Hey, I am open to constructive criticism. I was just giving my two cents to the subject on editing. I you think there was something wrong with my editing, that's fine. I'm all for making this site seem professional, just keep it civil and not embarrassing should others read it. Steveo920, 20:38, July 7, 2014

Request
Hi. May I ask you to look at this talkpage? It's about a missing derived jutsu and nobody answered until now. If you don't agree with what I wrote, please tell me where I'm wrong. Thanks in advance! Norleon (talk) 18:05, July 9, 2014 (UTC)

Talk Page
Hi, there is no Talk Page for the Naruto Uzumaki Region Combo, I didn't edit immediately because I am not sure if we should add Flight Technique or Six Paths Sage Technique as a parent--MERCURIOUS (talk) 19:27, July 15, 2014 (UTC)

Well, I am not sure how Naruto would attack a flying opponent from all directions(from below as well) if he cannot fly.--MERCURIOUS (talk) 21:03, July 15, 2014 (UTC)

Matianu.alexandruionut
I'm not getting in an edit war with him. Can you deal with him on the Rinnegan Shifting Technique page? WindStar7125  (Talk) (Contributions) 19:11, July 16, 2014 (UTC)

Gantta
This Gantta guy keeps reverting edits on the Kamui page. Can you please tell him that on this wiki, we do things democratically and don't define things to suit any one person's needs? I don't wanna get into an edit war with this guy; he's a new editor and is already becoming annoying. WindStar7125  (Talk) (Contributions) 16:11, July 19, 2014 (UTC)

Evidence that contrast your second paragraph was offered up in the talk section. I guess "this gantta guy" is a democratic deadbeat.

--Gantta (talk) 17:16, July 19, 2014 (UTC)Ganta

hello,nomme me sysop svp et je te mets des pages nouvelles--Sasuke449 (talk) 14:46, July 24, 2014 (UTC)

cool
Although this time I'm not talking about any merger, just listing Kaguya as jinchuuriki of the Tailed Beasts, since they are inside of her. Not listing Gedo Mazo. ok... I got it already, you want it separate at all costs, but is there a reason not to list Kaguya?--Elveonora (talk) 15:14, July 24, 2014 (UTC)

Nah. Don't take this as an insult, because I know you are an intelligent guy. You are just kinda jitterish and stutterish. You see things twice as problematic as they are. They actually don't stop being separate/don't merge when inside the Gedo Mazo. I originally also thought that to be the case, but was wrong. They are just inside while chakra is syphoned from them. Had they merged, it would have been impossible to unseal them, without using creation of all things again, that is.--Elveonora (talk) 15:34, July 24, 2014 (UTC)

Saying Hello and asking a Question
Hello My Name is Paul Dy. How is your Day.--Paul Anthony Dy 16:48, July 25, 2014 (UTC)

Chat
Can you please come onto the live chat ? Need to discuss something with as many sysops as possible. --SuperSajuuk Talk Page 19:52, July 27, 2014 (UTC)

Kaguya
There was no need to lock the article, really.--Elveonora (talk) 15:03, July 28, 2014 (UTC)

Articles are usually protected when edits are being reverted back and forth, or not? If you disagreed, you could just hit rollback and call it a day or something. But yeah, I brought it to talkpage, feel free to comment--Elveonora (talk) 15:13, July 28, 2014 (UTC)

Gaara
Since I sense things quickly getting out of hand with that talk page, and wish to spare you the headache of breaking up another needless argument, I'll ask your opinion here since I know you and I can at least remain civil with each other. Gaara's eye rings and Magnet Release. The previous ruling found that we don't list Gaara as a user. Fine. He hasn't actually been seen using it, but I do think we should list him regardless. Orochimaru hasn't used Wood Release, and we list him because we know he has it. Tsunade's Lightning Release, I know that you know is a screwy situation. That being said, don't you think we have enough context clues (since that is a viable means of drawing a canon conclusion from any literature) to say that Gaara does?


 * His father, a Magnet Release user, has the same markings.
 * He has those exact markings and is the jinchūriki of a tailed beast that can use Magnet Release.
 * The argument, used by some, that Gaara's marks are from insomnia was never actually stated in either the anime or the manga. That argument, itself, was speculation born from Part I, when he was stated to not have slept since he was very young.

You and I both know that no author on the face of the planet does that for shits and giggles. I also don't believe that Kishimoto will write it in a databook. I could be wrong, but again, authors simply don't spoon feed their readers every minute detail of information. Sometimes you have to put two and two together and Kishimoto has all but flat out said it just by showing the scene of Gaara's father gaining the exact same markings as his son.

Your thoughts? I'd really appreciate it because I really don't want another drawn out, insult ridden, argument to form on a talk page meant to further the betterment of our information here on the wiki. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 21:12, July 31, 2014 (UTC)


 * Correction, Gamabunta attributed those rings to insomnia--Elveonora (talk) 21:19, July 31, 2014 (UTC)
 * [Edit Conflict] What Elveonora said, Gamabunta stated it in Episode 78 of the anime. I can't be certain, but it might also be stated in either Chapter 134 or Chapter 135 in the manga. --SuperSajuuk Talk Page 21:21, July 31, 2014 (UTC)
 * Gamabunta also stated that Gaara never had any sleep his entire life (lie) and that Shukaku eats the souls of those hosts that fall asleep (also false). Gamabunta's statements, are also, hearsay, while Gaara's father demonstrating the rings is visual evidence, which, as anyone who studies criminal justice knows, trumps hearsay. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Rinnegan Sasuke.svg 21:25, July 31, 2014 (UTC)
 * Sorry, But I'm going with a statement from a toad in the actual manga over a "guy on the internet"'s feelings. EDIT: @Foxie, no offense meant, but you telling us it's not insomnia despite the manga having told us it was insomnia is just too much :P--Elveonora (talk) 21:33, July 31, 2014 (UTC)

What the hell? Don't use my page as a staging ground for this fight? Take it back to Gaara's talk page.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 21:37, July 31, 2014 (UTC)
 * There's no fight, just some friendly exchange of opinions.--Elveonora (talk) 21:46, July 31, 2014 (UTC)

Hey Shouldnt Naruto's Jutsu be updated with http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Scale_Powder_Creation Since the page was made and it has as user Naruto

But it doesnt display on Naruto's page....