Talk:Kisame Hoshigaki

Abilities
I have added the following information under the "abilties" category, as it appears greatly relevant to Kisame's strength.

Kisame himself proved powerful enough to successfully capture the Yonbi Jinchuriki after beating him half to death, despite noting his target's exceptional powers. Though a difficult task by his own admission, Kisame merely complains that he is "a bit tired". This is quite a significant feat, when taken into account how quickly Jiraiya's personal summon, Gamabunta was overpowered by Shukaku, the Ichibi (one tail).

I'm not very confident in how it flows into the next subject, though. Any suggestions and help would be much appreciated. --~Mizukage~ 05:44, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

The last portion of said addition was removed for the following reason: "Not as signifigant as one would think because in many cases summons arent that all powerful."

This may be true in some cases, but should not apply to chief summons. Manda threatened Orochimaru's life on more than one occasion, oblivious to the fact that he had been handicapped at the time. Jiraiya and Gamabunta are called partners, but Jiraiya himself states that even he can't handle him very well. They are at least heavily implied to be peers in strength. --~Mizukage~ 21:35, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

My edit note isn't going to fit, so I'll leave it here.

I've changed this:

Kisame himself proved powerful enough to successfully capture the Four-Tailed Beast's Jinchūriki without much effort or damage on him, despite noting his target's exceptional powers. Though an hard task, Kisame merely complains that he is "a bit tired".

Back to this:

Kisame himself proved powerful enough to successfully capture the Four-Tailed Beast's Jinchūriki, despite noting his target's exceptional powers. Though a difficult task by his own admission, Kisame merely complains that he is "a bit tired".

It flows better - refering to the difficulty of the task twice is redundant. But not only that, it's inaccurate. It refers twice to the level of difficulty, but says something different in each case. "Without much effort" is at odds with "hard task".

The reason I'm bothering to post this here is to urge people not to edit just for the sake of editing - that section of text was fine as it was. It doesn't actually help us, but instead gives us more to fix. So be concious of the material you are editing. --~Mizukage~ 22:05, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Earth
This-Earth Release: Underground Submarine Voyage. Where did this name come from? He didn't mention the name in anime, nor in manga, it looked more like Inner Decapitation technique.Paths 12:37, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
 * The technique is explained in the third databook. --ShounenSuki 12:39, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

Thank youPaths 12:49, 1 December 2008 (UTC)

akatsuki
is it notable that he is only member left akatsuki that doesn't have a major role in the organization
 * I wouldn't say that... Hakinu talk 21:47, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

he finishes unfinished jobsNolanRiot (talk) 14:14, November 16, 2009 (UTC)

Needs citation / sounds biased
"Although Kisame does have his pride, he acknowledged Itachi as the stronger of the duo."

Cite this please.

its not biased, chapter 144(japanese version):

Kisame states "While you(Itachi) may be able to manage against him, I couldn't possibly...He's in a completely different level..."

by his own admission it was revealed that although he[Kisame] couldnt handle Jiraiya, maybe Itachi can...


 * And it seems logical that Kisame said he couldn't handle Jiraiya... why? Kisame is so strong by being able to suck the opponent's chakra and convert it for stamina, chakra for himself whatever etc. If he were to fight Jiraiya and the latter be forced to use Sage Mode, if Kisame were to suck that chakra... Samehada would have turned into a stone frog sword (get it?:)) like pain's preta path did) or he would have turned into a stone frog if he would have transferred the chakra to himself:D But this may sound like supposition, that is why we would have to see a battle between kisame and naruto to see if that would happen:D - MadaraU (talk) 13:55, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Screentime
i personally beleieve that Kisame is the most recurring memeber of akatsuki appearing with itachi mid-way through part 1 and still alive as one of the last three members, if you feel you must change this tidbit in the trivia section, PLEASE discuss it here.--72.75.228.65 (talk) 17:48, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

this referance makes no sense
it says that karin never saw so much chakra in one place... and as referance it has the 8th one - naruto manga 260 page 16

but checking that page, it's the one about kakashi vs itachi... karin wasn't even introduced back then... any explination? --89.122.145.106 (talk) 10:11, September 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * Someone must have changed the numbers. Cause it happen. Jacce | Talk 10:15, September 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * On the other hand, that ref shows that Kisame just had 30% chakra, while his power was stated later. Jacce | Talk 10:23, September 5, 2009 (UTC)

About the seven swordsmen
it sais that they were using particulary big weapons...whereas Raiga...a former member...used 2 one-handed short swords...I think you should look to change that passage...--Yumetai (talk) 20:00, November 5, 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, Raiga is from an anime filler arc, which are hardly even canon... Mimixcarr (talk) 08:27, November 6, 2009 (UTC)


 * The second databook quite clearly stated that all the Swordsmen use large swords. --ShounenSuki (talk 09:10, November 6, 2009 (UTC)

the filler arc clearly states that Raiga was a seven swordsmen of the the mist i don look at the data books, and i dont know who makes them, but mashashito kishimoto has complete control over the anime episodes and i trust them more than the data books it is also possible that the data book had a mistake, and we know that us possible because one data book had zetsu as being from the hidden leaf village and we know hes not the data book prob had a mistake, or the person who makes them just assumed that they were all big swords (also, in the picture for the seven swordsmen of the mist, the guys on their knees as if bowing have thin swords like raigas, so that proves my point more) --Sauske-Blaze (talk) 03:08, November 14, 2009 (UTC)Sauske-Blaze

ROFL, Kishimoto is the one who makes the Databooks, so for you to say the databook has a mistake, means that you are saying that Kishimoto made a mistake of his own series. The anime, while approved of Kishimoto, is not under the direct control and directing of him from what I know, and many of the fillers are just fillers for the anime, so they can wait for the manga to get so distance between it's storyline and the anime, as anime episodes can at times cover 2-3 chapters at a time. As for the Zetsu thing, either a) the people who showed the information on the internet mistranslatied from the databook, or b) they got the information from a wrong source. Point is, the anime, while somewhat following the manga (Which IS cannon), is at times wrong, mostly during filler arcs, so Raiga is merely an filler character used to kill time. --Juubi no Ryuu (talk) 03:33, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

There is no reason to assume that Kishimoto cannot make a mistake in his databook. He has marked the "Rescue Kazekage" mission as A-rank, which is clearly wrong. It has to be a S-Rank mission, because you cannot possibly say that there are too many missions more important or difficult than rescuing the village leader of an ally, and yet a number of experienced characters in the Narutoworld have completed more than a handful S-Rank missions. Geijustu wa bakuhatsu da (talk) 04:18, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Dude... if Kishi says it is A-rank, and he like invented the mission difficulties (along with the rest of the Narutoverse), then it was an A-rank mission LOL. Besides it could have been named A-rank (in the story) because they (Konoha & friends) did not know what they were going up against (DEIDARA AND SASORI WERE THE FIRST AKATSUKI TO BE FOUGHT BY THE GOOD GUYS... in the open at least - trivia much?:D ) Bottom line for all the crazy things I heard in this talk: Databooks must be taken word for word (as long as they are correctly translated) Fillers: meh, the anime guys screw up even some canon stuff (such as when they made Pain's eyes yuch:))) so I am guessing they don't talk to Kishi too often - MadaraU (talk) 13:49, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, sure, if you want to take the easy way out (and let Kishi do the same), that's fine. As far as I am concerned, once the author has made some rules in the story, even he has to follow them consistently. If Kishi says in the next databook that Moegi is stronger than Kakashi and Jiraiya, and you say that it has to be correct because Kishi said so, then that's fine with me. I cannot do anything about it, and it's none of my business anyway. Geijustu wa bakuhatsu da (talk) 15:11, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

By the way, the rank of a mission is not decided after the mission by taking into account what happened during the mission. It is decided when the client comes to the Hokage and gives the details. In case of "Rescue Kazekage" mission, the Sand's messenger bird came with a message of Level 1 emergency alert, and the rank of the mission was to be decided there and then. If a level 1 emergency alert from an allied village does not call for a S-Rank mission, then what does? I was just wondering if Naruto were doing a D-rank dog walking mission, and Kisame appears on the scene to fight with him, then does the dog walking mission suddenly becomes a A-rank mission? LOL. Geijustu wa bakuhatsu da (talk) 15:16, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Random trivia note for you Geijutsu, in the manga it is an A rank, in the anime, S-rank mission. So many differences. Now as to WHY they might have put it as A-rank, I don't know honestly. Also, an A-rank is appropriate for rescuing a leader of a village, as A-rank can concern village or country-level problems. Had they known about Itachi and Kisame, they probably would have raised it to S-rank, for the fact of having to deal with around half of an Organization full of "S-rank" criminals. --Juubi no Ryuu (talk) 04:59, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

You are still saying the same thing. Let me emphasise it again. The rank of a mission is decided when the Hokage accepts the mission from the client, after going through the requirements mentioned by the client. It is not decided after the mission is completed, by analysing what happened during the mission.

Aside from that, the message from the sand said that "The Kazekage has been kidnapped by the Akatsuki", and that means you can pretty much assume that you have to go against the whole Akatsuki organization.

Then, you say that A-rank mission concerns the village or the country. If that is so, then what, according to you, is the concern of S-Rank missions? Just go through Jiraiya's trivia section. He has completed 138 S-Rank missions. Isn't it a little far-fetched to think that there are that many missions more important or more difficult than the "Rescue Kazekage" mission?

However, we have slightly deviated from the main point here. Someone here said that "Kishi writes the databooks, and there cannot be any mistakes in the databook", whereas my point was that, "Kishi is still a human being, and he can make mistakes." I just brought the "Rescue Kazekage" mission to illustrate my point. If you now say, "Kishi might make mistakes in the databook, but even so, we would accept that as right.", then I would agree with that, but if you keep saying, Kishi can never maki mistakes while writing databooks, then I certainly don't agree. I hope you agree with me on this one. Geijustu wa bakuhatsu da (talk) 05:14, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

Alright, alright, while I had never said Kishi couldn’t make mistakes while making the databook, I admit I did imply it, but really, what are the chances of that happening? But I guess it could happen, he can make mistakes too, Killer Bee’s transformations are an example of that. However, when I first replied here, it was not Kishi making a mistake I was talking about, I was meaning to say to Sasuke-Blaze that the fillers are not cannon, or part of the real story, and Raiga is just a kill-time character. As for the S-rank/A-rank..... *Shrugs.* Either Kishi decided not to put it as an A-rank in the manga and later put it in the anime as S-rank, or there is some detail we don’t know about, like him making a mistake. --Juubi no Ryuu (talk) 00:33, November 16, 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure if you're all completely aware of this, but Kishimoto-sensei has little to no input in the anime. The anime creators made a mistake with Raiga and with the ranking of the Kazekage rescue mission as well. From our point of view, Kishimoto-sensei is incapable of mistakes, unless he admits to one or contradicts himself. --ShounenSuki (talk 02:12, November 16, 2009 (UTC)

Who are included in this "our"? You are worshipping him like Mikami of Death Note worshipped Yagami Raito. Kishi is not GOD, he is a human, and he can make mistakes, just like you and me. As I have said before, it is alright if you say that even if he makes a mistake, we would still accept it as right, but certainly not that he cannot make mistakes. There is nothing wrong in making mistakes, so there is nothing wrong in admitting that someone made a mistake. Geijustu wa bakuhatsu da (talk) 12:49, November 16, 2009 (UTC)


 * "Our" refers to the editors of this encyclopædia and to Naruto fans in general. I never said Kishimoto-sensei is incapable of making mistakes, what I meant was that it is impossible for us to know when he made a mistake, unless Kishimoto-sensei admits it or contradicts himself. So from the point of view of his fans and the editors here, everything Kishimoto-sensei says is correct. There is no point in arguing about whether or not he made a mistake.
 * So when Kishimoto-sensei says that the Kazekage rescue mission was A-rank, it was A-rank. When he says the Seven Swordsmen wield large swords, they wield large swords. Only if and when Kishimoto-sensei goes against these facts or says they are incorrect, can we assume they were mistakes. Until then, it is the anime that is incorrect. --ShounenSuki (talk 13:36, November 16, 2009 (UTC)

What is this?
Kisame seems to have a thing for a ninja S-Class title. As he sulked that Jiraiya's "Legendary Sannin" title sounded better than "Itachi of the Uchiha Clan" and "Monster of the Mist" - I don't get it... I was under the impression that what he meant was that if he and Itachi were to challenge Jiraiya, the names Uchiha and Seven Swordsmen would be put to shame. - MadaraU (talk) 12:20, November 6, 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree, it makes no sense. There isn't even such a thing as an S-class title. I'm removing it. --ShounenSuki (talk 15:14, November 6, 2009 (UTC)