User talk:Seelentau

Verlassen des Wikis
Bitte lass es nicht dazu kommen! Ich verstehe, warum du sauer bist, aber in manchen Fällen muss man einfach über die Ignoranz und Sturheit der anderen hinwegsehen, bis eine glasklare Antwort vom Mangaka kommt (am besten in Form eines neuen Databooks, wann immer das auch sein mag). Aus genau diesem Grund nehme ich an den meisten Diskussionen nicht teil, weil ich Angst hab, mir das Wiki dadurch verderben zu lassen.

Auch wenn wir bis jetzt nicht so viel miteinander zu tun hatten bitte ich dich, die Sache mit dem Aufhören nochmal zu überdenken. Immerhin bist du meiner Meinung nach eine der wenigen Personen hier mit einem gesunden Menschenverstand, ganz zu schweigen von deinen Japanisch-Kenntnissen. Dein Verlassen wäre ein Verlust für das Wiki, ganz sicher! Norleon (talk) 23:03, September 7, 2014 (UTC)

Re: I'd like you to
Request denied. You're upset that's understandable. You want to leave, that is understandable. But I'm not going to encourage this kind of response by banning you and keeping you from coming back if you calm down and decide you want to come back.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 15:53, September 8, 2014 (UTC)

Your a great addition to this wiki and deep down i don't think anyone wants you to leave. The wiki needs you. Munchvtec (talk) 17:38, September 8, 2014 (UTC)

Seelentau-san, what's going on?! I was held at school, so I couldn't come on the wiki until now, but from what I understand, you're leaving? Why?! The wiki needs, and I'll be really sad if you leave. :(-- Ninja Sheik  02:26, September 9, 2014 (UTC)

Apology & Question
So, first, I would like you to know that, though I disagreed venomously with your analysis of the Jiton (and still do), I do not harbor any ill will towards you. I'm glad you decided to stick around because, truth be told, you were right about one thing: you are a pretty unbias reader of the series. Doesn't mean I agree with some of your explanations, but I'd be wrong not to say as much. I never wanted to drive you from the wiki because, as many others have expressed, you are very much needed here and it would truly be a loss for the wiki without you around. If you still dislike me, well, I can't help that, but I do want to extend to you an sincere apology for letting my frustration with everything get the best of me. I miss the days when we, as a site, could sit down and discuss conflicting ideas without feeling the burning desire to tear each other's throats out and I know you feel the same.

That being said, I have an honest question for you in regards to the Gudōdama. We're both aware of how contentious that debate is, and the fact of the matter is, we're banging our heads into a wall over some fairly simple questions. It is my belief that Kishimoto finally gave us the natures for the Gudōdama (regardless of the user; the technique itself) with Black Zetsu's remark. I realize that some disagree with me on this point, and you might too, which is the point of my question:

After examining the RAW of Black Zetsu's text, and knowing what previous characters have said in regards to the Truth-Seeking Balls, do you think that solid'' manga evidence suggests that each user's Gudōdama is of a different and unique composition? Or do you think that the technique, like any other technique, is composed of the exact same elements?''

That question seems to be the only one keeping us from finally putting this whole TSB debate behind us once and for all. Let me be clear, I don't care either way. I have my beliefs, but if the manga says something, we obviously need to document it. If its still too ambiguous, we wait, but recently it was decided that every user had the same natures except Naruto, whom the consensus said should have every nature but Yin-Yang, due to a few user's absolute refusal to believe he can use them. I just want the issue behind us. So, regarding that question, what is your thoughts? (And for any third party reading this, please don't butt in. Its rude to barge into other's conversations.) ~ Ten Tailed Fox 23:06, September 9, 2014 (UTC)


 * I suppose the only logical thing to do then is to wait, and, as you said, record what we know. Madara did say something about being surprised that Naruto wasn't erased when he blocked his Gudōdama, and thought that it might have something to do with him being heavily wounded (having not noticed his senjutsu enhancement yet), so I assume that means his can too. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Rinnegan Sasuke.svg 23:40, September 9, 2014 (UTC)


 * I believe the evidence is there for Jiton. Using context clues and making an assumption are two different things. With the TSB, I understand the convolution, but there really is nothing like that for Gaara, Shukaku, and the other Jiton users. If you go back and read all of related chapters (even some of Gaara's words in his fight with Kimimaro) its quite apparent that's what Kishi intended. TheUltimate3 and the others have a valid point when they say Kishimoto won't tell us everything. Like any author, he's going to assume that we have the necessary material to put two and two together to get four. In areas where its murky (I believe that 3 out of 4 users of TSB having consistently all the same thing isn't murky, but I can see why you and others do), we can just do our best and record only what has been flat out told to us, but in areas where its pretty much obvious, we need to be readers, no Kishi's editors, and do the math. That's just my opinion though. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Rinnegan Sasuke.svg 00:33, September 10, 2014 (UTC)


 * Its pretty simple: does the manga support it, or is the evidence too flimsy to hold up? If someone can show me page, after page, after page, after chapter, after interview, after quote, etc, ect, that something is a certain way in the manga and it all holds up: add it. There's nothing wrong with that. Jiton is one example of that. When Gaara's father displayed the exact same rings as his son in his eyes, Kishi was basically handing us that information on a platter, regardless of whether we think so or not. If weren't a contributor to this wiki, and was just reading this manga to myself, that would've been an "Aha!" moment for me, because I'm the type of reader who will connect information. That's part of reading a story like this and its enjoyable when the author wants you to notice something rather than slap you in the face with information all the time. Sometimes, they want you to find it yourself, and I have fun looking for it. But if someone tells me that Sasuke has Hashirama's cells, for example (this was an actual argument), just because Kabuto said he used his studies of Hashirama's cells to heal him, and that's the only evidence they give me, I'm going to wave them off and call crap on it.


 * That's why I, personally, wasn't involving Science in the Jiton debate (yes, I know others were). Kishi says he sucks at Science. We don't know how much he sucks (he obviously thought that Sakura's method of keeping Naruto alive was legit, for example; it wasn't. Punched through a rib and a lung scientifically), so its an assumption to say he'd even know what diamagnetism is. To him, it literally could've been as simple as "Hey, I want [insert Jiton user here] to magnetize this!" and that's it. But the manga itself held up, in my view, consistently. So to answer your question in one concerted effort: Where do we draw the line? If the manga supports it, and we can give enough references to back it up, add it. If it doesn't hold up or the references are too flimsy to use? Wait. That's how I see it. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Rinnegan Sasuke.svg 01:00, September 10, 2014 (UTC)


 * That's where consensus comes in. Its one thing if one or two people are seeing the same thing. If three, four, five people are all seeing the same thing based on the same evidence, you've got one of two things going on: mass hysteria, which is unlikely, or something legitimate is being presented. I mean, the consensus, prior to your analysis on Jiton, was literally unanimous. Even in the recent debates, I only saw Elveonora and Munch (can never say his full username) that still saw things similarly to you (Elve had his own ideas, but that's getting more and more common lately). And what's more, we were all seeing the same evidence. The same consistency. The same patterns and the same context clues. In those cases, consensus is our best option. If there isn't one, then obviously the evidence is too flimsy. You'll see me doing the same thing. Where I'm on the fence with something, or want to believe something, but the current evidence just doesn't hold up, so I'll ask to wait on it. I have no problem waiting when the information isn't there. Its when we literally have the answer right in front of us and we're screaming at each other over the stupidest technicalities that I start having issues. As for "grasping for straws", I shouldn't have jumped on that bandwagon, and I apologize. I let my frustration get the better of me. But there are cases of that. The debate on whether or not Naruto could use certain elements through his connection to the Bijū, for example. We had one user who just refused to let it go through and was even reverting the edits once the decision was made out of nothing more than his own stubbornness to give in. That is grasping for straws and when that happens, we obviously need to deal with the user in question, because that's a person problem, not a wiki issue. So, yes, it was wrong of me to accuse you of that. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Rinnegan Sasuke.svg 01:28, September 10, 2014 (UTC)


 * If the manga supports it? Absolutely. Kishi may retcon or correct facts later, but you can't tell a group of users who have reference after reference from the manga supporting their argument that they are wrong. Their basis is the manga. No different from anything else we add on this wiki. I mean, if we can't use the manga to prove our points, and get stuff done around here, we might as well lock the entire wiki until the series ends and the last databook comes out. We have to do something, Seel. Its not like we're saying, okay, add whatever you want to the wiki! We're saying, "If you have credible, consistent (direct confirmation works too, obviously) and the consensus sees it, then we add it. If you don't, we wait." That's not a bad system. It literally requires manga evidence, which is what you want in the first place, correct? Like I said, Kishimoto isn't going to tell us everything on a neon billboard. No author anywhere does that, so we shouldn't expect him too either. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Rinnegan Sasuke.svg 02:09, September 10, 2014 (UTC)

Sorry to butt in...
But I had to tell you this. I overlooked your messaging with TTF, and you asked if Madara ever negated something with his TSBs. He did actually, in chapter 665, page 12 when he cut off Minato's left arm with his TSB. Minato's left arm never grew back, just like Obito did with Minato's right arm. So yeah, Madara's TSB also has Yin-Yang Release. Again, didn't mean to butt in and be rude, that's why I created a separate headline on your page, but I was just trying to help. :) Glad you haven't left the wiki, that would have been a blow to Narutopedia. -- WindStar7125   00:22, September 10, 2014 (UTC)
 * Of course they do, Madara is a known YYR user since he had told Obito he would teach him just that--Elveonora (talk) 09:25, September 10, 2014 (UTC)

SPS&Rinnegan
Not entirely:
 * both Naruto and Sasuke received power from Hagoromo which allowed them to awake SPST and Rinnegan respectively (I originally thought it was because of Hashirama stuff alone), so having 9TBs chakras by itself wouldn't give him SPST without Hagoromo's touch--Elveonora (talk) 22:33, September 10, 2014 (UTC)

I mean latest chapter made it clear that Hagoromo has to do with their SPST and Rinnegan (so the tattoos weren't the only things he gave them) but Hagoromo didn't give Naruto TB chakra, they themselves did and Obito did the remaining 2. So whatever Hagoromo gave Naruto is the "missing piece" to the puzzle.--Elveonora (talk) 10:18, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

Talk about coincidental timing 0_0 we messaged each other at the same time :P And yes, latest chapter makes it seem Hagoromo has to do with their powers, but you may figure out otherwise once you get your hands on the raw or so. And even though Madara didn't meet Hagoromo, he was TT jinch. TT is 9TB + x, the 'x' being what allows Six Paths Sage Technique--Elveonora (talk) 10:21, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

Hagoromo said that giving power only to one of them resulted in Ashura and Indra rivalry, giving power to both Naruto and Sasuke didn't fix it tho. So if the only power Hagoromo gave to Naruto and Sasuke were the tattoos, then either Ashura or Indra must have had one or both tattoos as well. Unless he was talking about different thing than the tattoos--Elveonora (talk) 10:27, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, Indra was already born with strong chakra and Ashura's eventually matured/bloomed as time went on. But birth inheritance isn't gift, unless Hagoromo created Ashura weak and Indra strong with Creation of All Things. So I suppose what the original gift refers to is Ashura's "battle avatar" Hagoromo likely gave Ashura Six Paths Senjutsu. Indra wasn't given anything, thus had only Sharingan. This time around, Hagoromo not only has given Ashura's incarnate Six Paths Senjutsu, but Rinnegan to Indra's incarnate as well. This way it makes sense--Elveonora (talk) 10:42, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

But Ashura eventually became equal to Indra. Hagoromo says giving power to one caused rivalry, so that doesn't seem like it refers to one of them having been born stronger. Hagoromo had no input about how their genes would turn out. Also I believe in an older chapter this is referenced and Hagoromo says he gave power to Ashura, so giving power to Ashura made him stronger than Indra thus caused trouble and as such can't refer to their birth inheritance, since Ashura was the weaker one originally. But you are the translator, so you may know better--Elveonora (talk) 10:52, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

So Hagoromo gave Naruto and Sasuke successorship to Ninshu? That's it, Hagoromo made a clear parallel between giving power to Naruto and Sasuke and having given power just to Ashura--Elveonora (talk) 11:12, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I think in the latest chapter. But you may want to take this to relevant talkpage for everyone to chime in.--Elveonora (talk) 11:18, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

Six Paths for Kaguya
I thought it was agreed that Kaguya has no involvement to the Six Paths or any related techniques.—Steveo920 (Talk) 10:05, September 11, 2014

I believe it was during the discussion of the Truth-Seeking Balls.—Steveo920 (Talk) 10:11 September 11, 2014

stuff
Rikudou Rod etc. were also used I believe, but by Naruto and he likes to give weird nicknames. In my honest opinion "six paths" simply means Hagoromo, thus six path's means Hagoromo's.


 * Hagoromo's Senjutsu (his Senjutsu)
 * Hagoromo's Chakra (his chakra)
 * Hagoromo's Power (his power, unspecified)
 * Hagoromo's Yin Power/Yang Power (his power, specified)
 * Hagoromo's Chibaku Tensei (specialized version of the technique)
 * Hagoromo's Technique (his personal technique with the Rinnegan)--Elveonora (talk) 20:31, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

Yes. But within the context of what we know, all six paths stuff = hagoromo stuff. There's no way to figure why he is six paths and what it is tho. We may need a databook for that. And I think your list should be complete, I don't recall any other six paths good job--Elveonora (talk) 21:06, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

You did, but honestly, half the terms most likely refer to the same thing. Also in case you would, then be so nice and give some input to these:
 * http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Nature_Transformation#Something
 * http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Naruto_Uzumaki#So_just_as_I_was_saying
 * http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Talk:Naruto_Uzumaki#kekkei_mora

Thanks in advance. The first, Six Paths Yin/Yang Powers were never called Yin and Yang nature releases, were they? The second, I believe you also know that Naruto is just a pseudo jinchuuriki of 1-8 TBs and not a full one. The third, is Naruto even an user of kekkei mora? He asks the Tailed Beasts for the natures, so he doesn't know how to use them himself. Therefore I think it's nonsensical that he has the ability to merge all natures that he can't even use, not to mention it has a genetic vibe to it, therefore in my opinion only Kaguya and Hagoromo should be considered users, not her jinchuuriki--Elveonora (talk) 21:17, September 11, 2014 (UTC)

That's understandable, but man, If I had to count how many times I wanted to almost leave the wiki ... :P But what would this place be without me, right? :D Anyway: And funny you mention that. The term pseudo worked just fine, until certain people changed it as they deemed fit with "logic" that "when chakra talks, they are full jinchuuriki" or so, like wtf. But I don't think you should be quiet about this, once the raw comes out and it implies that the Tailed Beasts aren't truly within Naruto, then you should let people know. And I know. Fact is, our beliefs are to be put in line soon, very soon... as soon as Naruto's TSB clashes with Sasuke or his technique ;) I admit that there's a chance we are wrong, but in my opinion more things imply his aren't all natures. So if we turn out to be wrong, then I will personally apologize to everyone I disagreed with and leave with a tail in between my legs--Elveonora (talk) 21:51, September 11, 2014 (UTC)
 * I guess you are right. Although that's the reason why I'm wondering, are there things such as Six Paths Yin/Yang Release? :O

Your opinions on stuff
I just wanted to say that I completely agree and support all the stuff you say. i agree with your opinion's on magnet release too. Just wanted to let you know that your not the only user that doesnt agree with all the bull shit that gets added. Munchvtec (talk) 00:10, September 12, 2014 (UTC)
 * Butting in :P the thing is, it shouldn't be about an agreement to begin with. If millions of people decide to agree about something that's just plain wrong, it won't become right anywhere but in their own heads. And even if they are right, they still are making an assumption (even if true) thus are jumping the gun, before it's actually known to be true.--Elveonora (talk) 12:04, September 12, 2014 (UTC)

Help
How do i make articles that don't have a template like for example an article on a book not the volume? Munchvtec (talk) 18:13, September 13, 2014 (UTC)

no offense taken and i was gonna create articles for the three anime profiles books. Munchvtec (talk) 18:16, September 13, 2014 (UTC)

Six Paths
In the chapter that Naruto seals Madara's shadows in, he refers to the black rods as the "Sage's Rods". I don't know if that means anything or what the RAW's actually say, but I thought I'd bring that to your attention. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 01:58, September 15, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Names
I know how and where to look. Currently from here and here. I expect both to get more names as the days go by. The links on the first I can only read right when I get Google's cached version, I just look for a video game technique I know they have. Second link will have more movesets as the days go by as well. I got most of the Storm 2, Generations and Storm 3 from their Storm 3 site over at the enormous list I have at Forum:Video game jutsu overhaul/sub. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 18:38, September 15, 2014 (UTC)

not very serious, just bored
Yet, I've been thinking... most Root remembers were orphans, right? Iruka is an orphan. The guy in the background looks just like Iruka and I presume that that's Hyo under the mask. So both orphans, same scar, same hairstyle and hair color, same eye color... same person? :O Too bad it doesn't work since Hyo is 21 years old, rait? T_T--Elveonora (talk) 12:26, September 16, 2014 (UTC)

Outer Path Fact-Checking
Hey, I was wondering if you could translate a few things related to the Outer Path abilities when you get a chance. Thanks.--BeyondRed (talk) 23:49, September 16, 2014 (UTC)
 * Chapter 565, pages 6 and 10 - Do these seem to attribute the connected vision to Gedō or just controlling corpses with chakra? (The article currently states both are derived from Gedō).
 * Chapter 569, page 2 - Does Obito actually say he'll drag Four-Tails and Naruto inside of himself? This isn't documented anywhere on the wiki, as far as I can tell.
 * Same chapter, page 10 - What does Obito say about his and Nagato's binding power? Is this sufficient evidence that both the chakra receivers and chains are Gedō powers? We currently list the latter as one but not the former, using this page as evidence. (And yes, I'm fully aware that Madara created receivers without the Rinnegan in one instance).

Sorry for butting in, but I'm also interested in the Outer Path's connection to the "Gedo Mazo". I remember that you already explained this somewhere, but I can't find the topic.--Elveonora (talk) 09:49, September 17, 2014 (UTC)

Translation requests
Can you translate these two pages for me??

http://blog.pierrot.jp/wp-content/uploads/blog.pierrot.jp/2014/05/%E3%82%A4%E3%82%BF%E3%83%81%EF%BC%88%E6%9C%A8%E3%83%8E%E8%91%89%E6%99%82%E4%BB%A3%EF%BC%89%E3%81%AE%E3%82%B3%E3%83%94%E3%83%BC.jpg

http://blog.pierrot.jp/wp-content/uploads/blog.pierrot.jp/2014/06/%E3%82%B5%E3%82%B9%E3%82%B1%E3%81%AE%E4%B8%A1%E8%A6%AA.jpg ItachiWasAHero (talk) 01:56, September 19, 2014 (UTC)

I just wanted to know everything that was said on those pages is all. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 21:32, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

Sasuke and Kakashi Character Scans Translations?
Hello Seelentau-Senpai! How are you today? When you find the time, can you please translate the new scan of Sasuke and Kakashi's character design for the new movie? I've heard some rumors that it says Sasuke has turned good and Kakashi is Hokage, and also that starting in October, we will get new teasers of the movie with every new Naruto Shippuden episode. Can you please confirm or deny these rumors, as well as let me (us) know any other information the scan provides? Thanks a bunch- have a nice day! --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 23:43, September 19, 2014 (UTC)
 * Does it say that Sasuke is now on the "good side"? What do the little messages next to both Sasuke and Kakashi say? And do you have any extensive info about what these teasers are? Thanks! --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 19:01, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

Obito and Hagoromo's chakra
Kakashi while being possessed by Obito phantom said Six Paths chakra stuff. So unless Six Paths chakra doesn't equal Hagoromo's chakra, then Obito and by extension Kakashi had Hagoromo's chakra.--Elveonora (talk) 13:15, September 20, 2014 (UTC)
 * He does? In that case take back what I said then... but what is Six Paths Power again? :D Sasuke had Six Paths Yin Power, Naruto had Six Paths Yang Power, but what kind of power did Obito have and more importantly from where? :O--Elveonora (talk) 13:19, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

Question
Based on here, do you believe that the TSB is a tailed beast skill (which requires TB chakra)? Simple yes or no and an explanation will do, thanks. -- WindStar7125   13:22, September 20, 2014 (UTC)
 * I don't believe the TSB is a tailed beast skill either, because of chapter 690, when Kaguya remember Hagoromo and Hamura sealing her, Hagoromo was clearly using a TSB without having Tailed Beast chakra (due to facing the original Tailed Beast). I'll elaborate further on what I think a TSB is now made of after you give me your opinion on what happened in 690. -- WindStar7125 WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 13:36, September 20, 2014 (UTC)
 * I think he was using one TSB, instead of multiple. -- WindStar7125 WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 13:37, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

Just pointing out that young Hagoromo with a TSB was shown in chapter 680, was that a pre-jinchuuriki?--Elveonora (talk) 13:46, September 20, 2014 (UTC)


 * Hamura and his staff is a different subject altogether. What I'm getting at is that, like you, I don't think the TSB is a tailed beast skill, but because of Hagoromo. I say the TSB is made of the five natures, Yin-Yang, senjutsu, and the Six Paths Power/chakra. Not tailed beast chakra. For Naruto, I believe the tailed beasts gave him the elements necessary to use the TSB. I also believe that the TT gave Madara the elements necessary to use the TSB as well (with him pulling that lightning technique out of nowhere). But because Hagoromo mastered the five elements, Yin-Yang, and used the TSB without tailed beast chakra when facing the TT shown in 670 and 690, that is where I agree with you on the TSB not being a tailed beast skill. Correct me if I'm wrong on what I think, please. Thank you for your time. -- WindStar7125 WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 13:48, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

My bad for creating debate on your talkpage @Tau, I just wanted to ask a simple question and point out that I agree with your assertion that the TSB isn't a TB skill. Sorry if I needlessly invaded your talkpage. -- WindStar7125   14:06, September 20, 2014 (UTC)
 * But it is a Tailed Beast Skill for Obito and Madara, because Six Paths chakra comes from Kaguya/the Ten-Tails. Hagoromo is an unique case, since he is her son.--Elveonora (talk) 14:14, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

TSB
Howdy, on the Truth-Seeking Ball talkpage, a user brought up the question if the name should be plural or not, but nothing came of it. Ten told him to ask you, but since I saw no one asking, I took it upon myself to ask. Could it be plural? &#34;Let go your earthly tether.&#34; (talk) 21:26, September 20, 2014 (UTC)

would you please
Upload an official and full version of this image? It comes from one of the chapters' covers of the fight between him and Uchiha brothers.--Elveonora (talk) 11:08, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, thanks. Do you think it could be used as an image for Jugo Clan's KKG? It shows both the transformation and absorption of natural energy in one.--Elveonora (talk) 11:17, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, but there's not a single scene with Jugo which shows natural energy entering his body I believe--Elveonora (talk) 11:25, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

U sure? 0_o http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/File:Naruto_the_Sage.png looks the same to me--Elveonora (talk) 11:29, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

Two questions
Not trying to argue with or revert your decisions, but:

1. Is it plausible to say all TSB use the Six Paths Sage Chakra from the SPST? Kaguya was able to use it without the SPST.

2. Why remove the notice? You never know if an editor who thinks he or she is correcting incorrect info could add wood release there again.

I know it always seems like there's a debate about the TSB or Six Paths, but I just have questions. That is all. -- WindStar7125   22:21, September 22, 2014 (UTC)

Thanks...
For removing the TB skill from TSB. But may I ask what was your reasoning? I thought it was because of Hagoromo. You say it's about the Six Paths power. Can you please further elaborate on why it isn't related to a TB? Thanks! -- WindStar7125   11:14, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

So Kaguya copied later users you say...?--Elveonora (talk) 11:18, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * No, but it doesn't change that the first confirmed time of use comes from Hagoromo, not Kaguya. And even if she used it earlier, it doesn't prove that it's a TBs. • Seelentau 愛 議 11:20, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * Okay, so let me ask you this: where do you think Six Paths Chakra comes from?--Elveonora (talk) 11:21, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * No idea. If it really comes from the TT, aren't technically all jutsu and everything that uses chakra TB skills? • Seelentau 愛 議 11:24, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * Windstar made the same point and I guess so? 0_o The thing is, Six Paths Chakra isn't something that people and otherwise in Narutoverse commonly have, or so it would seem. Becoming a TT jinch grants this chakra, that's why it's a TBS to me--Elveonora (talk) 11:26, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * I did make that point. @Tau, if you can get by the duo of @Elveo and @Foxie, that'll be impressive. -- WindStar7125 WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 11:31, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

What defines a Tailed Beast Skill anyway? Was such term ever officially used in the first place?--Elveonora (talk) 11:33, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * No, it wasn't. And we don't have prove that becoming the TT's Jinchuriki grants Six Paths Chakra. • Seelentau 愛 議 11:40, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * Clarifiacation: Tailed Beast Skill was made to separate "Ninjutsu" from "Tailed Beast Ball" which at the time of it's creation wasn't considered an actual jutsu but more of a thing tailed beasts could just do. It is in no way official and there are enough holes in the concept that it could very easily be done away with in full.
 * Carry on with whatever.--TheUltimate3 Eye of Rikudō.svg (talk) 11:46, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * @Ulti, thanks for clarification. So it's basically fanon I guess? 0_0 Maybe we should change some things if that's the case. @Seel, if becoming TT jinch doesn't grant SPC, then where did Obito and Madara get it? ;)--Elveonora (talk) 11:47, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * No idea. I can just say what the manga says. • Seelentau 愛 議 11:53, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * Well you do have an idea, they got it from the Ten-Tails obviously :)--Elveonora (talk) 11:57, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * Can you provide proof for that, other than "They only got it after becoming TT's Jinchuriki"? • Seelentau 愛 議 12:00, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

But ain't that 'nough proof?--Elveonora (talk) 12:01, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * Considering that Naruto, who never was Jinchuriki of the TT, has the orbs, too? No. • Seelentau 愛 議 12:03, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * But was given chakra from Hagoromo, who not only is Kaguya's son but also was the Ten-Tails' jinchuuriki. If you go backwards, the origin of all chakra is Kaguya--Elveonora (talk) 12:11, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * He was given chakra from Hagoromo, not from the TT. You're making the Hagoromo-Kaguya-TT connection seem way too easy, man. • Seelentau 愛 議 12:18, September 23, 2014 (UTC)
 * ^^^^Again, thanks. You somehow got by @Elveo, but you'll have to find a way to get by @Foxie as well, for this is one of the rare topics @Elveo and him agree on. @Foxie may come at add the TB skill thing there all over again. -- WindStar7125 WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 19:26, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

And here I thought Hagoromo's chakra came from his mother, but whatever...--Elveonora (talk) 19:45, September 23, 2014 (UTC)

This is late and may be fruitless but..
http://i.imgur.com/qE8cj3e.png This is the supposed official spoiler for 693. Can you translate it please?? ItachiWasAHero (talk) 23:17, September 24, 2014 (UTC)

Darn.. damn internet trolls. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 01:28, September 25, 2014 (UTC)

My theory on how nature releases work
Once you said that you are interested in mechanism behind chakra, so you may be interested in what I think.

Clearly we both understand what each of the chakra natures is (heated chakra, thin sharp chakra, vibrating chakra, density manipulation chakra, state manipulation chakra) so the question may be: how come then the resulting techniques appear as actual fire, wind, lightning, earth and water? Note: you may disagree, because the explanation has less to do with magic but more with chemistry, but I see it like this:


 * To exhale fire, they do so by kneading Katon Chakra into gases inside of their bodies, exhaling said gases as fire.
 * To make wind, there are multiple ways to do so. For example Temari, she kneads Fuuton Chakra into her fan and with the motion of it, she creates air movement and pressure that is like blades, thus wind. Danzo for another example did it by kneading Fuuton Chakra directly into his breath and then exhaling it.
 * To make lightning, they knead Raiton Chakra into actual electricity in their bodies, notably from brain and nervous system.
 * To spit earth, they knead Doton Chakra into their bodily fluids and other chemicals, spitting it up as a substance. You probably wouldn't want to touch or smell that.
 * To spit water, they knead Suiton Chakra into actual water inside of their bodies. No wonder Suigetsu has to drink so much.

Most people probably think, that for example Wood Release is actual earth mixed with water, but that would be mud. It is just the chakras mixed together, not substances.

Do you agree with at least some of these? I hope so ._.--Elve Talk Page 15:01, September 26, 2014 (UTC)

So you prefer a much simpler explanation then I guess :P Would heated chakra be a fire? I don't think so, it makes more sense to me that it's the heated chakra igniting bodily gases thus producing fire. And for example Naruto's Rasenshuriken doesn't produce wind like Temari or Danzo's techniques do, that's because he infuses rotating chakra with thin and sharp chakra rather than the air. Also Tobirama can create water out of nowhere as well, rather than just from his body. There are water particles in the air, infusing them with chakra could explain that--Elve Talk Page 15:13, September 26, 2014 (UTC)

I got the idea from Shizune kneading chakra into chemicals inside of her body and exhaling them as poisonous gas, so such a thing indeed is done in Narutoverse.--Elve Talk Page 09:22, September 27, 2014 (UTC)

Naruto Tankobon omitted cover text
Is it possible to still purchase old magazine prints of the chapters that have the text?--Elve Talk Page 11:21, September 27, 2014 (UTC)

The chapter cover with Yamato on it which says that Hashirama died 50 years prior to Part II. can you confirm?--Elve Talk Page 12:06, September 27, 2014 (UTC)

My memory sucks to simply put it, so I may repeat myself often :P I should train my brain more often I guess. And I see, I would take that statement as him dying 50 years ago. That would fall in with Hashirama's flashback of Tsunade. I'd put his death as 34 bNB rather than 38.--Elve Talk Page 14:21, September 27, 2014 (UTC)

I believe Naruto was still 15 when that chapter cover said that, so he died 35 years before Naruto was born right?? ItachiWasAHero (talk) 01:02, October 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * Nope. The Cover is for the chapter titled "Sai's Betrayal". • Seelentau 愛 議 01:15, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

"his cells live on even 50 years later" 50 years later, that clearly means he died 50 years ago. It doesn't specify month or day of course.ItachiWasAHero (talk) 01:23, October 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes, 34 bNB. But for some reason I didn't include it. Can't remember why^^ • Seelentau 愛 議 10:28, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Danzo as a full grown adult is 170cm tall and as studio pierrot shows Danzo was 168cm when Tobirama died that means Danzo grew 2cm after Tobirama's death and males don't grow in height after turning 21 biologically. I think if Kishi is following general biology like he has seemed to be doing this entire time then they were all 20 years old when Tobirama died, it was also said somewhere in one of the books that Hiruzen was hokage when he had his team and we know they were 6 when they became genin.. and the fact that Tsunade had to be at least around a year old to be able to do "gamble".. I think at the very EARLIEST Hashirama died in 37 bNB with Tobirama becoming Hokage immediately after his death and as we saw in naruto and naruto shippuden, A LOT can happen in a short amount of time( part one of Naruto lasted roughly a year from 1/01/13-12/22/13 and look how much shit happened in that time) in this manga. I'm willing to bet Tobirama died in 36 bNB because it was shown that he died during war times against Kumogakures Ginkaku Force, Tobirama was also the kind that would fight back against Kumo even if it was the gold and silver brothers who attacked him and not them... ItachiWasAHero (talk) 10:45, October 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * I don't take biology into account here. As for the rest, I know that it's somewhat like you say. As I said, I have no idea why I didn't include it. I think I even did once, but deleted it again. • Seelentau 愛 議 10:53, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Well, I guess we can conclude that Hashirama and Tobirama died very close to each other, matter of months.--Elve Talk Page 11:31, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah it makes more sense that way, since Tsunade would be around 1 years, when Hashirama died and my son is smart as hell at 1 year old, I know Tsunade would of been able to be taught to gamble at 1. So this makes it fit so much better ItachiWasAHero (talk) 11:59, October 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * If he died 50 years back, that would have made her 4 not 1--Elve Talk Page 12:00, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

I was trying to say maybe 50 years was a generalization of the length of time since his death like how they said 10 years for Kakashi Gaiden even though it was 14 years earlier that it happened in truth, and if indeed Hashirama died in 37 bNB and not 34 bNB, that would mean Tobirama most likely died in 36 bNB. It fits everything pretty much. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 12:37, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Six Paths Question
Sorry to bother you again, but I need some clarification. Can you give me your best explanation of the difference between the Six Paths Chakra and the Six Paths Power (even though you might not know the full extent of the latter)? Also, did Sasuke use the Six Paths Chakra or Power when he used his Chidori to damage Madara? And finally, doesn't the Six Paths Chakra = Indra + Asura? Or is that something else? I honestly think the Six Paths Chakra/Power comes from light-purple Rinnegan. Thanks in advance. -- WindStar7125   18:03, September 27, 2014 (UTC)
 * Bump. :/ -- WindStar7125 WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 00:05, September 28, 2014 (UTC)
 * Bumpity-bump. Please answer, I want to know, and after this, I will no longer ask you any questions again. -- WindStar7125 WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 16:45, September 28, 2014 (UTC)

six paths round 2 talk
seel, brutha can U please check the last part of that discussion & tell me Ur opinion...no one seems to give a fuck...thanx --DARK ZER06 (talk) 07:55, September 29, 2014 (UTC)

Help 2
hey buddy...how U doin...need a favor...would U kindly translate "bloodline purification" & "bloodline annihilation" to Japanese 4 me...thanx :] --DARK ZER06 (talk) 19:28, September 30, 2014 (UTC)

uuuuuuuhh...U alive seel... --DARK ZER06 (talk) 21:35, October 2, 2014 (UTC)

...hope I haven't crossed any lines... --DARK ZER06 (talk) 22:07, October 4, 2014 (UTC)

ok...
 * now would U...sry would YOU please translate those two 4...sry FOR me :D
 * besides... I'm not that hard to understand......or am I? --DARK ZER06 (talk) 23:14, October 4, 2014 (UTC)
 * You are a little difficult to understand. Please try to type out full words, okay? We're not texting here, lol. WindStar7125   WindStar7125 Task.svg WindStar7125's Task.svg 23:22, October 4, 2014 (UTC)

does EVERYONE in this forum have too be so cruel... Y U not appreciate my Rt T_T........
 * hhhhhhhh...ok...I'll try to tighten up my ass & minimize my laziness in writing...so that the green village citizens here can all be happy....happy.........because I'm HAPPYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY ok I'll stop don't get mad... --DARK ZER06 (talk) 23:31, October 4, 2014 (UTC)

oh :|...haven't thought about it that way...sorry...but at least you could've replied the first time or said so sooner so I could've stopped earlier...& why is my title of Help is changed into Stuff in your reply :D? --DARK ZER06 (talk) 23:36, October 4, 2014 (UTC)

strange...you consider that way of typing rude but use words like shit & etc :|...
 * anyway...2 tickets?...not sure how I've done that...doesn't matter...
 * are there any other translations for these two that are more suitable than the ones you gave? --DARK ZER06 (talk) 11:54, October 5, 2014 (UTC)

so could you give the more suitable ones too? --DARK ZER06 (talk) 12:05, October 5, 2014 (UTC)

suitable in accordance with the manga...but I think the ones U gave are perfect...how about bloodline enrichment? --DARK ZER06 (talk) 12:29, October 5, 2014 (UTC)

many thanks friend --DARK ZER06 (talk) 12:35, October 5, 2014 (UTC)

Chapter 694 Spoilers?
If you have the time, can you please translate the spoiler for chapter 694 here (in the box on the bottom): Also, if you wouldn't mind, what does the little message about Sasuke's new series say? --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 02:03, October 1, 2014 (UTC)

Neji
Does his name ネジ actually mean http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screw or is just the pronunciation the same?--Elve Talk Page 12:36, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Thought so and answered as such on Narutoanswers, but a guy changed it to what Neji's trivia section states here, that it means screw--Elve Talk Page 13:07, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

Yup, I know the very basics ^_ but in that case the trivia should be a little bit more specific as not to confuse people--Elve Talk Page 13:38, October 3, 2014 (UTC)

re: Dude
Offensive? 0_o I'm my average self today and in a relatively good moon. People can't handle honesty, seriously... being a moderator means cleaning up the threads, those messages and threads that I deleted were pointless. Does that make me an asshole? Yes, but just doing my "job"--Elve Talk Page 17:09, October 6, 2014 (UTC)

This needs attention
User Kris.gilson.12 has been questioning the content of Kakashi's article and has made edits like this. (No, I am not asking that he be blocked) He has made a talkpage topic here, in an attempt to get attention to what he sees as chronologically inconsistent information. According to him, he has put a similar topic on Kakashi's talkpage and been waiting a month for someone to respond, but with no avail. I've personally told him that I will make sure this topic gets attention (in order to stop him from removing the information). Please go to Kakashi's talkpage and respond to it. He has a point he'd like to make. Thanks for your time. • WindStar7125     02:51, October 7, 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for the correction...
Thanks for correcting the WSJ schedule on my profile! If you wouldn't mind, up until the end of the series, can you please check the schedule every now and then, and either let me know about the recent changes to the schedule, or just fix it yourself like you did in this scenario? Thanks, and have a great day! --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 00:44, October 8, 2014 (UTC)
 * Also, on a related note, I heard a rumor that they were possibly planning on releasing the WSJ magazines every Saturday now as opposed to Monday- is there any truth to this claim? Specifically, is there any plans to have an early release on the day of the final chapter (November 6 for us)? Thanks!--KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 00:47, October 8, 2014 (UTC)
 * Take it with a grain of salt. I just heard it from someone over on Naruto Answers- Omega64. He knows his stuff, but I will admit (and he has too) that you guys (specifically you and Shakhmoot when he was still around) know more than he does about this type of thing. I will ask him where he heard these rumors and get back to you. --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 00:55, October 8, 2014 (UTC)
 * I asked FF-Suzaku the same question, as I personally believe you two are the ones who know your stuff the most. Ultimately, it doesn't really matter. I assume we will learn later that week whether or not the chapter will be released on Wednesday or Thursday, correct?
 * Also, I asked Omega where he heard the rumors, and he said it's just basic chat that's been going around. As I said, take it with a grain of salt. If you learn anything new during the final week, please let me know so I can be better prepared to decide when to take that personal day. Don't be surprised if I ask a lot during that last week for any updates or whatnot. --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 02:30, October 8, 2014 (UTC)

new idea
I would like to hear your input on the Appearance section forum thread please. Munchvtec (talk) 17:11, October 9, 2014 (UTC)

Deidara's Age
Deidara was shown in the beginning and the databook 3 came out stopping at the Itachi Pursuit Arc so Deidara would be 19 but he was 18 in the Kazekage Rescue Arc because his birthday is in March and Shino was in January yet he was 15 when he was shown instead 16 showing that he the half of year didn't reflect him and neither should Deidara. Deidara was 18-19. He approximately turned 19 between the Sai and Sasuke-Hidan and Kakuzu Arc. Rachin123 (talk) 19:08, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123


 * As much as I would like for the wiki to not add hypothetical ages, the wiki doesn't agree. ~SnapperTo 19:30, October 9, 2014 (UTC)
 * So the Book of Sho states that Team Guy was 16 in the beginning too right cuz I remember their ages being 17 for a while. We add hypothetical things in this wiki plenty of times. Rachin123 (talk) 19:31, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123
 * For you to change the age of Deidara back 18-19 or change everything around in the other infoboxes for Team Guy, Team Kurenai and Team Asuma. Rachin123 (talk) 20:04, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123

So your fine with me changing Deidara's age to 18-19 then? Rachin123 (talk) 20:10, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123 Let me point this out to you, you can't follow every single thing of the databook, that's one thing and tbh this is a fan wiki its not like Kishi created this wiki. Secondly the Databook 3 came out stopping at the Itachi Pursuit arc so likely more than half a year has past so people like Deidara would 19 around that arc, Tenten 17 too and so on. But we use the databook fine but going by our knowledge as far as we are concerned those were not their ages when they were shown in Shippuden but when the last arc stopped off at for the databook. But if you want disagree and will continue to change the age than someone needs to fix many of the characters ages. Tsunade was 54 around the Itachi Pursuit Arc but in the beginning she was definitely 53 so someone put 53-55 instead of 54-55 which it was before because logically following the story shed be 53-55. I'm not trying to start troubke ai'm just pointing out things. Rachin123 (talk) 20:23, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123 Exactly so Deidara should be 18-19. Rachin123 (talk) 20:44, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123 When you say "state" I hope you don't mean if someone say their age in the manga or anime because more than half of the characters age wasn't mentioned. If you mean in the databook all we know is that the databook stopped at the Itachi Pursuit Arc and Deidara was 19 when he died. But by being practical he must have been 18 at the start of Shippuden. The whole ages are gonna be a mess if we go with your way. Like is saod by the time of the Itahci Pursuit about a year would've passed and thus people aged and with the last age he published would be that age of that the last time but not the actual time they were shown in Shippuden. Rachin123 (talk) 21:06, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123

Seel take a look at the infoboxes of the characters. Most of them have been changed. Team Kurenai and Team Asuma were 16 according to the databooks that would obviously put as their age going off the Itachi Pursuit Arc. But two and half years they'd be 15 which someone changed which is right. That databooks age reflects the time of nearest it stopped that's what I'm trying to tell you that you can't go off the databooks all the time. Rachin123 (talk) 21:36, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123
 * I know that. Naruto was 15 when he arrived in Konoha. Its been two and half years. Sakura is 15 as well so looking at that Tenten would be 16 seeing how they are both in March but the databook states Tenten as 17 going by most recent like the stats. The stats go by most recent abilities up until the point it reached. Databook 3 reaching up to the Itachi Pursuit Arc. The Konoha 11 would all only be 2 years older than they were in Part 1 and between the Hidan and Kakuzu- Itachi Pursuit Arc they'd age a year. By the time of the war about another year has past. Covering Shippuden about 4 years have past from Part 1 and about 2 years from part 2. I'm getting tired of trying to get you to understand. Deidara was 18 from the start, up until his death with him being 19. Rachin123 (talk) 22:07, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123
 * Oh I'm stating what I say pretty clear, it's you who just doesn't understand. I don't have a problem in particular but that I think your reasoning is iffy. I know it ends with Sasuke awakening the MS which is the Itachi Pursuit Arc. Like you said the databooks go with most recent but we edit the characters to show them from start to finish. The Third Databook showed their ages going off recent but we place their age specifically of when they were shown. If you don't understand by now I smh. No offense but I don't get you. Deidara was 18 when he was shown in Part 2 and time obviously passed about several months where he would age 19 and die in the fight with Sasuke in the Itachi Pursuit Arc. And yes that battle was part of that arc. Rachin123 (talk) 22:35, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123

Exactly. The databook goes as far as recent activity. That's why ages were the way they were. I'm pretty sure stats would be recent as of the Itachi Pursuit Arc. I'm glad you understand but the only difference we wouldn't know what their stats would be from a certain time. But yes as of Shippuden he'd be 18-19. Do you want to the honors and change the age? Rachin123 (talk) 22:59, October 9, 2014 (UTC)Rachin123

Chat
Hey, able to come in the chat for a little bit please? Thanks! --Sajuuk Talk Page 20:14, October 9, 2014 (UTC)
 * That was a good chat we had last night! Wondering if you'll be able to come in chat again today. Need to talk about something with ya, thanks. :) --Sajuuk Talk Page 09:13, October 10, 2014 (UTC)

ORAS
Do you already own Nintendo 3DS in preparation for the game or do you plan on purchasing one along with it? I'd really like to play it too once it comes out, but frankly, I don't have cash to waste and buying a handheld for just a single game isn't the best investment. In case you already have a 3DS, how much did it cost you?--Elve Talk Page 19:07, October 10, 2014 (UTC)

I see. I suppose that you have sold XY by now, right? I heard they were quite bad compared to Black/White. Unless XY's good, in which case getting a handheld for 2 games would be slightly more reasonable :P--Elve Talk Page 19:16, October 10, 2014 (UTC)