Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-34656247-20180528093116/@comment-33286580-20180529053919

Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: Conditions are: '''*Obito doesn't have Hashirama's dna (so limited use of kamui)  *The obito that fought Minato. '''
 * All Uchiha's has mangekyou
 * Itachi is healthy.
 * The Hiruzen that fought Orochimaru
 * Mangekyou Madara doesn't have his Gunbai.
 * Kakashi is limited to 3 kamui. (then he drops)
 * Hokage Minato.
 * GNW battlefield.
 * Leaving the battlefield is allowed. (reverse summoning, teleporting away)
 * The sasuke that attacked the 5 kage summit.

Knowledge:
 * Team Minato obviously knows about the uchiha's sharingan abilities (except for non-eye contact genjutsu, tsukuyomi, totsuka and yata)
 * Team Madara knows about the flying raijin and how it works. (all of them knew minato, madara knew tobirama)
 * Team Madara have 0% knowledge on Jiraiya's abilities

Who stomps? the OP is contradicting himself here.

Obito without Hashirama cells, yet the one who fought Minato. both dont exist. most of the feats are because his Sharingan and MS are boosted from hashirama cells. Danzo showed how Hashirama cells boosted his use of Shisui's Sharingan, same way it is for Obtio and it is agreed by all.

in that sense Obito can not only be limited to the use of Kamui, but his Kamui speed will also drastically reduce. you can be sure of the latter part because when Kakashi was buffed by Kurama's chakra, not only could he use Kamui more and on bigger objects, but he could also do it real fast.

also non-eye contact genjutsu is normal genjutsu.

...

onto the topic.

why is everyone making pairs and making everyone fight. it is not one man for himself, it is a team effort.

the healthiest we know of Itachi is him from part 1. in that he only used 1 of Tsukuyomi and Amaterasu and yet it was clearly noted that using them put a toll on his body that he himself states that he needs to rest his body for a while (chapter 148). in that sense his limit is probably no more that 3-4 MS jutsu at best. (and dont say he spammed more in his fight against Sasuke, because at that time he simply didnt care about his health any longer. he was there to die anyway.).

nothing of MS Madara is known other than that he can use Susanoo. even what stage of Susanoo can he produce is also a mystery here. can he only do half body or go full body mode. as far as MS users are shown other than Obito who was boosted by six paths chakra everyone as in Sasuke and Madara to show full body Susanoo are when they possess EMS. even then he has the most destructive power of them all.

Obito will be a lot weaker. his Kamui slower, but definitely better than Kakashi. other than that he really doesnt have any other really powerful offence.

Sasuke cannot spam his MS jutsu either. Sasuke also has his limit. the guy was healed and replenished of his chakra by people like Jugo, Zetsu and later Karin throughout the Kage Summit attack. around Kage Summit he had only gotten basic hand of FLame Control and could only use skeletal Susanoo to at most form a sword.

Kakashi is probably the weakest link here. but he has a wide variety of jutsu under his belt and he can use the copy ability of Sharingan in more useful ways, something no Uchiha until Sarada showcased.

Hiruzen will be the wildest trump card. not only he knows hundreds and thousands of jutsu and can combine them effeciently. above all he is the most analytical. he can grasp what a jutsu is capable of by seeing it only once and can drop major holes in his opponents jutsu.

Minato is the overall MVP here. with his FTG he can run rounds around all his opponents. even Madara who did dodge FTG before cannot do it this time because he is not enhanced by hashirama cells, rinnegan and SM from Hashirama. the fact that Izuna could not counter Tobirama with his MS means Madara cannot do it either, especially to a better version of Tobirama. Above all Minato can mark the other four with FTG marks and can get them out of danger, especially if they get caught in Kamui.

Jiraiya will be te wild trump card. he has a variety of jutsu and at this stage only likes of Madara and Itachi can truly match him. but with unending SM with the toad duo (yes, i know Minato has a perfect SM, but it only lasts for seconds so no use there) he will have the firepower to even break through Susanoo. and just for the count, Jiraiya will be able to get into SM because no one knows about his SM abilities and he has three people defending his ass, while he can also summon a toad as extra help.

this is Minato-Jiraiya-Kakashi-Hiruzen win. a tough one, but their win.