Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-29965012-20161221055011/@comment-26104757-20161230104129

AsianReaper wrote: Tsunade was acting behind the scenes in the Konoha Pain arc. She might as well have been looking at the situation as a chess board. She was detached. Kakashi was in the middle of his situation and required much faster reflexes/presence of mind.

She had met in conversation with Pain moments before he expelled a wide-scale Almighty Push. In this confrontation, Tsunade was not detached. No one, even the intel Katsuyu provided, could foresee something of that level. How was she to know what he was going to do as did Kakashi with Kaguya? Expect the unexpected, yes? This situation presented a problem in which she acted upon. It was because of her presence of mind, as you have said, that she was able to save thousands, not just two.

AsianReaper wrote: Also, Jiraiya barely lost to Pain. Tsunade with the rest of Konoha should have been able to take him down without as many casualties. Her choice may not have been the best one.

Jiraiya did not experience the full effect of Pain's power; Konohagakure did. I don't consider his defeat as 'barely lost' when he exhausted all of his strength into three of six pains before they assembled. He fought valiantly, of course, but how can you weigh Jiraiya's effort compared to Pain's effort when he attacked Konohagakure and destroyed an entire village? That seems trivial to me.

Let me reiterate; Tsunade saved the lives of thousands. It was her choice that assured this.

But Kakashi?

He died fighting one Pain, and this is with the Sharingan. Deva Path hadn't even put much effort into this fight, and yet, with the help of two Akamichi and several Shinobi, he still died.

AsianReaper wrote: Tsunade's biggest redeeming factor is her Strength of a Hundred Seal. That's her. She's strong and she heals a lot. So of course take away one and she's much weaker. But Kakashi? He's known for being the all-around. Take away his Sharingan, he still has his mind, his jutsu, etc. He has more to use.

He has more to use but less to gain.

Tsunade's durability, as I've said, is a skill in it's own. She took a direct, point-blank blow from Madara's Susanoo, right after taking out a Susanoo spear, and survived without becoming dismembered or suffering extensive damage upon impact. This is not a healing feature courtesy of The Strength of a Hundred at the time; this is her body's physical make-up. She can take a hit, multiple times, and continue fighting. This is her demonstration of deception; taking people off guard with the appearance of death, only to strike back and deliver a fatal blow. We've seen this numerous times; with Kabuto, Orochimaru and Madara. But this is almost equivalent to Kakashi and his one-stab kill through the heart. Where Kakashi usurps time, concentration and analytical planning to deliver a kill, Tsunade, however, uses deception through appearance and uses that to one punch, or kick, her opponent.

But to Tsunade, this would be a last resort and requires less time to do so, when her every display of Taijutsu grants successful victory.

AsianReaper wrote: Tsunade's healing is inferior to Hashi's. It only matches it when she activates her seal. But even with Hashi healing, a stab to the heart seems to be a kill.

You're overlooking her durability and vitalism. This is without the seal and it's healing factor activated. She has a very strong life force, especially when her genetic pairing consists of %25 Senju and ℅25 Uzumaki. Tsunade's body was severed in two, something that should of killed her, but remained conscious long enough to summon Katsuyu and heal the other Kage without her seal keeping her alive. Obito's body does not hold the same lineage as Tsunade and performs at a weaker level than hers. If she was stabbed in the heart, I'm convinced the damage will not be as extensive as Obito, or any other organ for that matter, and it is at this point where she can strike back, appearing dead, and kill her opponent before the seal is activated.

Possessing regeneration capabilities like Hashirama does not guarantee your life force is the same. For Tsunade, it does.

AsianReaper wrote: Regarding summons, I actually didn't think it through. Kakashi is a master of Raiton. Katsuyu is a slug, which is mostly water. Kakashi sends a strong attack her way, and it'll get conducted through her hard no matter where he hits her, which could incapacitate her.

Katsuyu's body is not water, but the ability to alter and deconstruct into bodily fluids. This a action and not her original form.

I must, once again, reiterate that Katsuyu, like Tsunade, is extremely durable. Her body at it's most smallest size survived the enormity of a Tailed Cloak and it's corrosive chakra; this should've evaporated her in the same aspect that lightning can use her body's inter-connection as a circuit board to shock. As a complete summon, Katsuyu is easily as large as a Bijuu. With Tsunade protected inside, Kakashi cannot directly severe her without Katsuyu constantly reforming. That method will consume a lot of chakra — chakra that Kakashi cannot use carelessly.

AsianReaper wrote: Now imagine this scenario. Kakashi activates Hiding in the Mist. How does Tsunade have any idea where he hits? He's a master at silent killing. Tsunade isn't a sensor. Maybe she hits the ground really hard? But all that does is leave lots of boulders and cracks everywhere, doesn't really help her locate him. What then? Kakashi could just locate her by scent or hearing and take her out from long range with Purple Lightning through the heart.

A master at Silent Killing?

True.

But I don't think there is a marginalised difference between his sense of sound and hers. When Tsunade and Orochimaru confronted one another, she was able to observe his heart beat at a distance. The mechanics behind this mist is widely known, but for you I'll give an arbitrary response; Tsunade summons Katsuyu and has her perform the Slug Great Division technique to act as a diversionary tactic and search party. With their thought process shared telepathically, Tsunade can identify Kakashi's location and lower in with her introductory Heavenly Foot of Pain. Thus, obliterating him and anything in her immediate strike zone.

AsianReaper wrote: But the point is that Kakashi more than makes up for any physical shortcomings with his tremendous strategic mind and versatility.

That's subjective because Tsunade doesn't require those attributes to win. She compensates a lack of complexity and listed Ninjutsu for deception, one-hit kills, physical endurance and the pinnacle resolution to Medical Ninjutsu. The thing is, Kakashi has nothing that can kill her faster than she can kill him, in that time, Tsunade has to spend less effort for a greater effect. He'll be overwhelmed.