Talk:Summoning Technique

Hand Seals?????
Ok so in issue 51 (I think it was 51) When Sasuke and Danzo fight, Sasuke summons a hawk but only weaves the sign Ram. Also, Danzo summons his tapior, tapiar, tapier, whatever. Anyway he takes his blood and smears it against his palm, while the hand being smeared on has a half tiger sign. Should i change these?
 * Manga often skips hand seals unless the have relevance to the plot. Don't stress over it. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 03:00, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

What Omni-sensei said, not to mention that a different sequence of seals can be used for the same technique, in case of skilled users just 1 or even no seals at all--Elveonora (talk) 19:24, September 3, 2012 (UTC)

Control?
Should we put that if u have something like a tailed beast under ur control,like tobi did with kurama, u can summon it w/out a contract. Riptide240 (talk) 20:24, March 20, 2013 (UTC)

I'd advise not to because Its already stated that you can summon animals, Their would'nt be a point of adding that because It simply states that you can summon things tools animals etc so no -- Jean Daichou Loves Naruto 20:31, March 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * actually, I think the question is quite interesting. I completely forgot that one has to sign a contract with the animal one wants to summon. In case of a tailed beast, I would have said at first that it could only be summoned because it was under a genjutsu (since it would have never accepted becoming a summon). But Madara tried to summon Kurama during the fourth world war and Kurama was absolutely in his right mind. Seems to be actually different from usual summons.Norleon (talk) 20:55, March 20, 2013 (UTC)

Not really, quite sure that a blood contract has to be signed with a tailed beast as well. Hell even people can be summoned. Contract Seal supports there being one, otherwise there would be nothing to remove--Elveonora (talk) 21:47, March 20, 2013 (UTC)

Actually, the contract seal only removes control a summoner has over a summoned creature so u dont neccesarily have to sign a contract so the question is still out there Riptide240 (talk) 15:04, March 23, 2013 (UTC)

Plus, when Minato did it to tobi, he didnt sign a contract with the nine tails, he just put it under his control and summoned it. Riptide240 (talk) 15:05, March 23, 2013 (UTC)

And, when Madara tried to summon Kurama, it didnt work beacuse the nine tails already had a jinchuriki. Riptide240 (talk) 15:08, March 23, 2013 (UTC)

You can't summon something without a contract, he could have done it off-screen--Elveonora (talk) 19:23, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

Im not even sure if he can write lol, u really think kurama would sign a contract with madara Riptide240 (talk) 19:48, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

All it needs is blood on a scroll and some formula--Elveonora (talk) 19:59, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

No, u need to sign ur name and fingerprint and u have to be willing to be summoned which kurama (im sure of) would never do or agree to. Riptide240 (talk) 20:07, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

faceplam, you might have overhead the whole being under control part--Elveonora (talk) 20:13, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

So basically wat ur saying is that they put it under their control and made make a contract with them?Riptide240 (talk) 20:20, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

Well that settles that but waht about how tobi just summoned the nine tails in the game and it was automatically under his controlRiptide240 (talk) 20:24, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

Videogames aren't canon, the makes can do anything they want, like altering the story even--Elveonora (talk) 20:26, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

Ok forget tat but there was one last thing i was confused about: When the nine tails attacked the leaf, tobi put it under his control and then presumably told it to stay there so he could go into the leaf and summon it from there. but when he did, he just summoned it, no contractRiptide240 (talk) 20:32, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

This argument doesn't need to go on further you've both made your points so stop -- User:Jmootam1999 Loves Naruto 20:33, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

It was never an argument i was just confused so if u could stay out of this that would be great Riptide240 (talk)

As I said, things happen off-panel. We never see Minato signing contract with toads either, yet we know it happened--Elveonora (talk) 20:39, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

No i won't stay out of It because all members of the wiki have to reason with each other You were confused I understand but do you understand what User talk:Elveonora has explained ? -- User:Jmootam1999 Loves Naruto 20:42, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

Ok so with the reincarnation jutsu, when kabuto uses the reincarnated shinobi on the battlefield to summon reinforcements, that counts as summoning a person right? lol srry had to ask Riptide240 (talk) 20:47, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

And yes by the way thank u for trying to help but it was just a little misunderstanding that we worked outRiptide240 (talk) 20:50, March 25, 2013 (UTC)

Nagato's summons?
It shows that Konan can be summoned by Nagato. Is this true? --Freedom Wall (talk) 08:03, June 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, what about it?--Elveonora (talk) 11:03, June 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I wasn't aware. I just found it strange that he could summon people. --Freedom Wall (talk) 11:11, June 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Anyone can summon anything. Nowhere it's been said it must be animals. Iruka was summoned as early as Part I. Chunin Exams, although in a different manner.--Elveonora (talk) 11:49, June 12, 2013 (UTC)

Choosing Which Summon
Was it ever stated that a user could choose the summon beyond the amount of chakra they send? I ask because this relies on such information being provided. — S im A nt 21:36, June 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * More like observed. Naruto obviously intended to summon Gamabunta, but ended up with Gamakichi, who now seems to be in the same power level as his father, so to speak. Why Gamabunta wasn't summoned, and what he was busy with, I don't know, but it seems that in the event you try summoning someone who's not available for whatever reason, you get someone in the same power level. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:42, June 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't see how knowing from previous experience that a lot of chakra gets a strong toad explains a method beyond the amount of chakra used as a means of choosing the summon... — S im A nt 01:38, June 13, 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, way back when Naruto was first learning to summon frogs, he was only managing to summon tadpoles at first, and when he managed to tap into Kurama's chakra, he summoned Gamabunta. Chakra does seem to correlate with summon strength. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:16, June 13, 2013 (UTC)

Yes it does and if you read the second Fanbook you would know!66.211.134.194 (talk) 16:45, June 14, 2013 (UTC)Carignan

Reference
Why the chapter 170, page 4 reference have to be with "Manda believes Orochimaru summoned him" instead of being with " " to be a hidden comment?-- Placido  NB  23:07, June 20, 2013 (UTC)
 * Does anyone have any answer?-- Placido NB  11:41, June 30, 2013 (UTC)
 * Because hidden comments are used to stop people from changing information. That addition to the reference is to point people to the exact instance its referring to.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 13:44, June 30, 2013 (UTC)

The abilities of summons
I was wondering whether or not a summoned animal character's abilities section should be constructed simlarly to a human's, in regards to adding subsections like "ninjutsu" "Genjutsu" "other abilities" etc? I've seen it done on pages like Gamabunta, Fukasaku and Gamatatsu, yet the partern does not extend to other pages like Shima, Monkey King: Enma and Katsuyu. --Tzao (talk) 08:05, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

They already are done the same. Some are not as extensive as others however due to a lack of work/effort or just information. There isnt really a style either. If you check some other character pages, the ones that arent popular, you'll find they're the same. A lack of information revealed in either the anime or manga leaves the ability section emptier. Skarrj (talk) 08:26, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for clearing that up, I'll get to work on those pages in a jiffy then --Tzao (talk) 08:37, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Summoned Creatures
Ok so I was wondering if we should create a new page for some animal summons? I think that we should create a separate page for summons, like sharks. We could add info on how they are used as messengers and how they can be incorporated into jutsu. Since we seen two users who can summon sharks in the anime Kisame and Ruiga from the Land of Greens Arc. We could also create a page for chameleons summons since they are mentioned in the series too. And then list the specific chameleon summons and shark summons if needed. Tuxedo12 (talk) 16:48, January 1, 2014 (UTC)

i thought the yare linked to wikipedia whats the pointIloveinoxxx (talk) 18:21, January 1, 2014 (UTC)

We do have pages for summons and you can go ahead and make some if you like. --Mr Easter (talk) 11:58, January 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * The only time we generally create an article for a summoned creature is when they have a name, or else, we need unique things documented about them. Sharks, to the best of my knowledge, haven't really done anything so the Shark article simply redirects to the Wikipedia article on the creature.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 13:30, January 2, 2014 (UTC)

Time Limit
Should we not mention the need to actively maintain the summoning and the supposed time limit mentioned in chapters 635 and 642? Even if said information creates huge conflicts with earlier parts of the series, it should still be noted in some way.--BeyondRed (talk) 00:17, July 14, 2014 (UTC)

Combined Summoning technique?
Is it worth making a "Combined Summoning technique" page? From my memory there have been 2 times when this has happened. The 1st time during the Invasion of Konoha where numerous Sunagakure and Otogakure ninja summoned three giant snakes and the 2nd time when the deceased kage summoned team 7 and the tailed beast. There is a 3rd example in which Sakura and Tsunade attempted to summon Katsuyu together in the war but was unseen i believe. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 12:55, October 15, 2014 (UTC)

Hashirama and Tobirama
Both are now listed as users of this technique due to their "summoning" special characteristic in the fourth databook, but we don't know if it actually refers to the Summoning Technique itself. Both of them have already demonstrated variations of Summoning in the form of Summoning: Quintuple Rashōmon and Summoning: Impure World Reincarnation.--BeyondRed (talk) 21:58, January 17, 2015 (UTC)
 * But that's what the summoning technique is isn't it? I think I understand where you're coming from here, but there's no need to overcomplicate things. In the end, it's a summoning jutsu. Looking back, it probably should've been added a while ago in my opinion.--Minamoto15 (talk) 22:33, January 17, 2015 (UTC)
 * The Summoning Technique itself is meant to summon a species that the user has a contract with though. Neither Hashirama nor Tobirama is known to have any such contract. Though I do get that it could be argued they are technically using this technique by using its derivatives--BeyondRed (talk) 00:20, January 18, 2015 (UTC).
 * You answered your own question, we don't know what its referring to and nothing more can be done about it. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 00:54, January 18, 2015 (UTC)

If we're going with "Summoning characteristic = Summoning Technique user", then Shino also needs to be added. However, doing so automatically adds Kikaichū and Kidaichū as his summons, since the insect articles are currently considered contracted to the Aburame that use them. It's a logical assumption, but seeing as we've never seen an Aburame actually summon their insects before, not entirely sure what to do about him.--BeyondRed (talk) 01:29, January 18, 2015 (UTC)
 * The Summoning Technique does literally only summon stuff. The contract stuff is just for some of the living beings. So "The Summoning Technique itself is meant to summon a species that the user has a contract with though." is entirely wrong. If you summon weapons, you use this technique, if you summon other people, you use this technique, if you summon gates, you use this techniques and if you summon animals, you also use this technique. • Seelentau 愛 議 01:35, January 18, 2015 (UTC)

Kinkaku and Orochimaru
Kinkaku and Orochimaru both are able to pull out weapons from their mouths which i presumed were always inside themselves. But Kinkaku was reincarnated and had a "new" body which wouldn't of had the treasured tools inside of him which leads me to think it was some kind of summoning he used to get the tools. So what is this exactly, a technique, an ability or some kind of regurgitation summoning technique? --Sarutobii2 (talk) 14:35, March 3, 2015 (UTC)

Human Summoning Technique Formula
Well, I wanted to put this in the talkpage of Episode 428, but there is no talkpage so here we are. In the episode the Ninja of Amegakure used what Hinata called Human Summoning Technique Formula or Hitoyose Jutsushiki, anyway even though that was a dream world, shouldn't we mention this somewhere, here or a new article just like Izumo's technique? --MERCURIOUS (talk) 01:36, September 17, 2015 (UTC)

Kakashi first summon technique
Well, not sure if it could be really considered 'summoning' but, there was a difference the first time they put the summoning technique, unlike Jiraiya that used the seals to summon, the first time it appeared was in the second battle between Zabuza and Kakashi, if I don't remember it wrong, I think Kakashi did not use the seals, he just cut himself, made blood and put it in a scroll, summoning not a simple dog but many dogs at the same time, but the other times in the show that we see summoning, they don't use a scroll and it's a singular summon. So... It could be a special type of summon, or it could be a fail that the author made and forgot?

Setokayba (talk) 07:08, October 31, 2016 (UTC)
 * What Kakashi did there was a combination of summoning and Earth Release I believe--Elve Talk Page 09:34, October 31, 2016 (UTC)
 * I'm sure there was a reason for that scroll, but not sure if all that playing with it before using was necessary. --Rautamiekka (talk) 14:25, October 31, 2016 (UTC)

Boruto
To our knowledge, Boruto doesn't have a contract with that snake. And, as stated by the same episode (and as far as chapter 92 of the manga), a Summoning of an animal cannot be performed without a contract. So... Why do you keep adding him there, Saru? :D--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 11:10, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * Actions are louder than words and if you wanna go by statements he literally said Summoning Technique and was credited for summoning that thing. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 11:53, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * And yet Konohamaru said that he couldn't summon it with his chakra. Again, the creature's influence is at work, seeing as we saw the same seal seconds after the summon as we saw with Denki and Lee. He doesn't have a contract, and even if he did, he was stated to not be able to summon a creature this size, considering that he learned the basics on the exact same day. It took Naruto a month to even use it, and with Kurama's help at that.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 11:55, April 26, 2017 (UTC)

Maybe with a presumed tag then? There is no information in the CURRENT episode to suggest it was anyone other than Boruto who performed the summoning. Konohamaru's comment seemed more to me an exclamation of incredulity rather than a note to the audience that's it wasnt Boruto who summoned the creature. Similar to how Naruto shouldn't have been able to use Multiple Shadow Clone or learn Rasengan in only a week. Not to mention I think Boruto would know if he performed the summoning or not, and he should've known he'd have to sign a contract as he was told so this episode, so he would have had to have done so in order to even attempt the jutsu. Like I said, there is no officially released information as of THIS episode to suggest otherwise, but since it wasn't 100% comfirmed, he should be added as a presumed user.--ScruffyC (talk) 14:23, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * We don't use presumed tags no more, and definitely not for such reasons. No, Konohamaru's comment was an indication that he's suspicious of what's happening around Boruto. And, not to repeat myself again (and I will not do that anymore, just read the rest of the comments above): There's the seal that appears when that creature does something, as it did with Denki & Lee, so clearly it's at play here. Aaaaaannnnd.. We don't see Boruto making the contract, and the animal he refers to when wishing to use the technique is a toad, not a snake. So yeah.
 * And Naruto had Kurama's chakra. Boruto does not.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 14:27, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * Where did he ever mention a toad? Watch the episode again. Boruto clearly said earlier in the episode he would like to summon a snake. And lo and behold later on he summons a snake. Agreed something is at play here, but there is no current evidence to suggest it was anyone else that summoned it. We never saw Sasuke sign a contract with any of his animals, and to this day there isn't a mystery surrounding that, but he was seen summoning them so he is a user.--ScruffyC (talk) 14:38, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * "Even if we summon a small toad, it'll be enough to scare them away", something along the lines of that. We don't need to see everyone make contracts because we already know how the Summoning jutsu works. And even Shikadai said that it would be impossible to summon a sizeable creature, and Boruto did not deny that.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 14:41, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * Seeing a user make a contract isn't a criteria for listing users, we list them based on what they say and or do. Anyway, Boruto was informed he needed a contract, so it's illogical he would attempt to perform the technique if he hadn't made one off-screen.
 * Kakashi also said genin can't perform fire release and following your attitude of Konohamaru and Shikadai said this we should remove the nature from every genin's article. Actions speak louder than words...--Sarutobii2 (talk) 19:01, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * "To (be able to) perform the Summoning Technique, one needs a contract". I don't understand how much clearer this has to be... If you don't have it - you can't use it. Literally said in both the manga and in this episode. If your argument of adding him is "Oh, he can use it, but doesn't have a contract", then it's immediately wrong because the material specifically states that it's wrong. And about Kakashi, he says that, yet he could use Earth Release as a genin, so this is more of a retcon. A retcon would work in this case as well, had the rules not been specified again.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 19:06, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * and he was able to perform the technique making it evident he has a contract at that time. Why else would he have a scroll and perform the technique knowing full well it was impossible without a contract. It's not rocket science. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 19:19, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * Again, not him who performed it. Boruto tried, but failed again. He could've made a contract with a different creature, or, let's just say, the snake. It still wasn't him who summoned it, and since we didn't see two creatures appear, Boruto couldn't use it properly. I really don't feel like repeating myself again...--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 19:24, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * What I'm trying to say is, is that if Boruto really knew how to use it, but made a contract with a different animal, we would've seen two animals pop up. And we know that he could not have conjured that snake, and it was the only animal that showed up. You still need proper training, seeing as Naruto needed a month to use it.--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 19:26, April 26, 2017 (UTC)

Why are people even talking about the snake while it was clearly the snake-tail of the mysterous dark creature shown in the earlier eposodes? Ravenlot 27 (talk) 19:36, April 26, 2017 (UTC)
 * Good catch. Though I refer to it as snake because Shikadai called it a snake :D--BerserkerPhantom (talk) 19:39, April 26, 2017 (UTC)

Should it be acknowledged he use the hand on which the rhombus-shaped seal is located, as shown in the Manga?Lokker G (talk) 16:54, May 1, 2017 (UTC)

Shino's Summoning.
Shino's jutsu list marks his Summoning as the Kidaichū and Kikaichū. But that is wrong. His summoning is a much different looking and obviously bigger insect. Also, the two former bugs don't need to be summoned as they are already with him inside of his body. This should be changed to list his Summon as the big insect.--Steveo920 (talk) 15:58, May 12, 2017 (UTC)
 * That's due to the way the infoboxes are coded to show such insects. The same code used to show summoned animals was leveraged for the Parasitic Destruction Insect Technique when multiple insect species were introduced. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 16:57, May 13, 2017 (UTC)
 * I understand, but I still say it should be corrected because again, he isn't actually summoning the Kidaichū and Kikaichū.--Steveo920 (talk) 20:12, May 13, 2017 (UTC)