Board Thread:Naruto Discussions/@comment-36512555-20180814043009/@comment-34194151-20180908072454

1)

But you haven't explained how its possible for a distracted minato to react to obito who was striking to sneak attack and warp him, and have his kunai move through obito's head before obito's hand even moved. Without kamui obito was already dead in that panel. Obito's simply twisted his wrist, and his thumb simply caught minato's arm after part of it slipped through, and then obito grabbed the rest with his other fingers. Obito did a very minimal movement and obstructed minato's path, and the feat was faciliated by surprise factor + minato's hand already being in motion. Once you start an action you can't rescind it immediately. I would agree that the hand catching feat is impressive if obito's arm wasn't already in more or less the perfect position to catch it. If anything, minato's incredible hand speed back fired there ,as it is was a wild movement, much harder to control a wild movement like that after you already initiated it, and he fell right into obito's trap as a result. As Ninja of war said,that was more a feint.

2) if obito failed to tag minato without using kamui hax, why does it trump raikage failing to speed blitz minato? the situations aren't entirely comparable, but minato could at least see raikage coming. Obito sneaked up into taijutsu range and minato only noticed him last second. Raikage used his speed to get into taijutsu range. So let's stop right here. Now both characters are in minato's range. Minato only starts his counter-attack once Ayy already begins his punch. Minato likewise only is able to start his counter-attack once obito begins his hand grab. Minato easily countered both with his arm swing, but at least raikage could actually touch him in exchange using pure speed, even if barely, while obito relied on kamui and a twitch movement to obsruct his arm. minato didn't try to slice raikage's head, so the subsequent actions can't be compared so loosely. The way I'm seeing it, minato's hand speed was noticeably superior to both, in neutral conditions. Also, minato didn't even try to FTG out of the wrist grab, proving he was simply caught off guard. He easily did so once he started being warped.

3. Okay, I'm looking at it differently now. But this doesn't make sense to me. Raikage is moving to the left, the kunai at best is moving to the right, but even that isn't substantiated because the kunai has no movement lines, implying minato simply released it. We clearly see when minato's kunai have movement lines, simply refer to when he was spreading them across the field.If that's the case, the kunai isn't moving, horizontally, not even gravity is affecting it yet, So, plz explain how v2 raikage can't move faster than a basically stationary object? And even if the kunai is moving, they would be moving in different directions at this point in time, meaning the distance between ayy and the kunai should be increasing not decreasing. We then see minato teleport to that kunai, and it's hard to tell but it seems like he hit ayy's back with his right foot, and would have killed him with his follow up strike if not for bee's good timing. It's not that the kunai is fast it's that minato himself is too fast. So, the issue wasn't raikage being unable to outrun the kunai it's just that minato teleported it at the right moment, raikage is a lightning release user, so he processes the world around him faster than he himself can move it seems due to his neurons being super charged. FTG is instant and the manga is in bullet time so it's hard to tell, especially when characters have time to form thought bubbles when logically they shouldn't have the time to. I actually believe we are in agreement here, but when you say he can't outrun a motionless kunai it sounds confusing. But anyway, obito himself who is as fast as base minato couldn't outrun the same combo. So I fail to see how obito has outdone the raikage. But hopefully I can come to understand where I am going wrong here if I am in fact wrong. We can even factor in the kage summit thing, where obito seemed to be surprised by raikage's speed. And at the same time, Ayy's top speed was countered by minato but minato wasn't using shunshin there. It was his stragetic FTG placement and superior striking speed.

4. ok Killer bee can track his brother's speed it seems. it was an interception feat, meaning killer bee likely had precognition. right place right time. so you have a point there.

5. Well remeber, Tobirama showed incredible reaction feats and hand speed feats, but no running speed feats against juubito. also subsequent strikes were faciliated by FTG. It's actually nice that it works out this way, because tobirama's shunshin speed isn't that important when his hand/striking speed can actually allow him to trade a mutual strike with a god tier, and with a FTG marking, he doesn't need running speed to catch his opponent. Minato only proved he is faster in shunshin, he never was shown to have superior striking speed or even reflexes compared to tobirama, and we weren't given any other statements on the matter, but based on feats, I feel like tobirama has better reflexes and striking speed than base minato, because KCM minato faced the same mindless juubito and simply got kicked away and couldn't even get a marking in exchange, despite having himself and a clone available. So idk if we can actually prove that tobirama has a faster on foot body flicker than v2 ayy.