Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-30426414-20170602005649/@comment-32177363-20170603050955

QuakingStar wrote: Itachi has chakra enhanced strength among other things. Have you read the Itachi Shinden or watched the Anime adaptation? they expand on him some and he is much more diverse and deadly than was shown to us before hand. Also as they were going away Kisame said quite clearly he knows Itachi didn't have to flee from Konoha or Jiraiya, so Kisame wasn't falling for Itachi there.

Without Sharingan Itachi has

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Clone_Great_Explosion

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Crow_Clone_Technique

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Fire_Release:_Great_Fireball_Technique

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Fire_Release:_Phoenix_Sage_Fire_Technique

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Fire_Release:_Phoenix_Sage_Flower_Nail_Crimson

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Shadow_Clone_Technique

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Water_Release:_Starch_Syrup_Capturing_Field

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Water_Release:_Water_Bullet_Technique

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Water_Release:_Water_Dragon_Bullet_Technique

http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Water_Release:_Water_Fang_Bullet

So he has enough Jutsu, right next to Kakashi's miniscule amount of non Sharingan related jutsu.... Kisamé originally questioned why Itachi was fleeing but he never actually stated they did NOT have to flee at all; soon after (according to the Manga), he and Itachi do both end up agreeing that Jiraiya is too dangerous for them both.

Also, I never attacked the idea that Itachi has chakra enhanced strength; I'm going to assume that you mentioned that to imply Itachi has superior taijutsu, to which I would agree. That still does not mean that Itachi will easily beat war Arch Kakashi in the realm of taijutsu, it would take effort, and again there would be so much more to the battle than taijutsu alone. It's not like Kakashi is going to be forced to fight Itachi in a 1 v. 1 martial arts match, in the naruto verse ninjas in general rarely use taijutsu except to gain distance, stun, and perform more ninjutsus. Some ninjas don't even like to use taijutsu at all when they fight like Orochimaru, Sasori, and Deidara.

The jutsu's you listed by Itachi are known by Kakashi as well, and more, and Kakashi has more advanced versions. Kakashi has hundreds of jutsu's and more chakra natures, including weaknesses to to the limited arsenal that Itachi has. Itachi has fire, water and air (and we've never even seen a pure air technique used by Itachi). Kakashi has the weaknesses to all three of those. Itachi doesn't have a weakness against Kakashi's earth or lightening techniques. Technically he does have the weakness for kakashi's lightening but I doubt it will be effective since we've never actually seen Itachi use a strong pure wind release move.

Of the list of Jutsu's you gave that Itachi has (which pales in comparison to Kakashi's), the only A rank jutstu is Clone Great Explosion, which Kureinai in season 1 was able to avoid with relative ease (even though it shocked them all) when Itachi tried to use it on her.

Crow Clone Technique is only a C rank and just another shadow clone technique

Great Fireball Technique is only a C rank

Phoenix Sage Fire Technique is only a C rank

Phoenix Sage Flower Nail Crimson is only a B rank

Shadow Clone Technique is only a B rank and just a basic shadow clone technique

Starch Syrup Capturing Field is only a C rank basic water technique

Water Bullet Technique has no rank, but it's a pretty basic technique

Water Dragon Bullet Technique, again just B-rank offensive technique.

Water Fang Bullet this technique is just a B-rank offensive technique

Kakashi on the other hand knows all the water techniques that Itachi knows & more (and he has defensive techniques too), including an A-rank water technique (The great waterfall technique).

He knows Itachi's fireball technique, and even though Kakashi hasn't been shown using any other fire techniques, when considering that he's the renowned copy ninja reputed to have copied over 1000 jutstu's & taught Sasuke a lot of what he knows, it can reasonably be inferred that he knows multiple other fire techniques.

Obviously Kakashi knows the shadow clone technique, and has a greater variety of shadow clone techniques.

In regards to wind, seeing as it's not even Itachi's natural affinity, it can be inferred that any wind technique that he does have is no higher than a B-rank just as the rest of his chakra nature jutsus. Meanwhile Kakashi knows the rasengan (A-rank) and established that his nature was wind when helping naruto create new techniques.

Also, who the cares if Kakashi learned the majority of his jutsu's through the Sharigan, the point is Kakashi has them and Itachi doesn't. According to Kakashi's page, he learned many of his techniques through the Sharigan NOT the MS. According to the sharingan page, the user can copy any jutsu and taijutsu through memorizing it with the aid of the sharigan, nowhere in the narutoverse is it suggested that the sharigan needs to be active for a user to continue using a copied technique; it actually suggest the contrary: "The user is able to copy almost any jutsu they see, memorizing ninjutsu, genjutsu, and taijutsu with near-perfect accuracy. They can then either perform that jutsu or modify it to suit their needs, as when Sasuke Uchiha bases his Lion Combo on Rock Lee's Front Lotus. Again, Sharingan users need the prerequisite abilities before they can mimic a jutsu they have seen, and for that reason they cannot, for example, reproduce kekkei genkai abilities they do not have or nature transformations they haven't learned to perform."

By the way Kakashi is definitely able to, and has possibly learned his lightening and wind techniques without even using his sharigan. According to Kakashi's page, he displayed great skill and knowledge of ninjutsu as a child before even entering the academy. So obv Kakashi was adept at ninjutsu before getting his Sharingan. Kakashi outmeasures Itachi in the realm of jutsu in both quality & quantity.

Rachin123 wrote: Quality over quantity. It doesn't matter that Kakashi has more jutsus (via copied). Also, Chidori and the Lighting Cutter are no good to use without the Sharingan. If you did your research as you said, you would know that. Nobody said it can't be used. According to the page for the chidori/lightning cutter, it says the chidori cannot be used safely by most ninja mainly because of the tunnel vision needed to execute it which puts the ninja at a vulnerable state since they're also running in a straight line and thus will not know if they need to dodge an attack. That does not mean the Chidori is "no good" it means it is extremely risky. Also Kakashi does not need to use his MS to use a chidori/lightning cutter. Moreover, I doubt Kakashi would even try to hit Itachi with the lightening cutter if they were fighting unless Kakashi was 100% sure it would land. I've already covered why Itachi pales in comparison to Kakashi in terms of jutsu quantity & quality.