Talk:Dust Release

Uhhhh
How in the heck is dust an element, and why is it different than plain old sand? lol--SkyFlicker (talk) 12:29, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
 * I would guess that the difference is that dust is smaller. Other then tat, I have o idea. Although the most logical guess would be that dust is earth and wind. --Rikudou Geass (talk) 22:38, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
 * I second your logical guess :) T0rw0ri (talk) 11:23, June 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yep, it islogic that dust = earth + wind. 87.244.196.158 (talk) 19:26, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

If it is molecular based, earth and lightning is more reasonable. 207.6.161.131 (talk) 21:05, June 5, 2010 (UTC)

Dust=Earth + Wind
Isn't it obvious? All the other elements make up other advanced natures except for lightning and dust cant be made of earth and lightning--Moiz1224 (talk) 04:56, October 3, 2009 (UTC)
 * But since this isn't a forum, we won't ad speculations and will wait for the series to explain. Jacce | Talk 05:41, October 3, 2009 (UTC)
 * But we also aren't sure if water+lightning=storm, yet we have that listed on it's page don't we?--76.127.68.140 (talk) 01:04, January 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * We have a lot more evidence supporting Water + Lightning = Storm then we do supporting Earth + Wind = Dust. --ShounenSuki (talk 01:10, January 4, 2010 (UTC)

And you don' know fire+lightning=blaze. I mean whos the idiot who put that up. It even says in the series blaze is Amatarasu+shape transformation.
 * It's an advanced nature, and if you actually took the time to understand that, you'd know we have to point that out, Blaze is an unique case, and there's even the question mark, saying it's not something certain. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 18:18, January 31, 2010 (UTC)

What about Wind+Earth=Diamond Dust or even glass? Of course this is fan idea but it would make some sense as Diamond being from the earth but yet sharp like wind.99.237.250.157 (talk) 20:47, March 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * This is a page on Dust Release. Are you saying Dust is Earth + Lightning?--GoDai (talk) 02:42, March 25, 2010 (UTC)

Dust release is definitely combination between earth and wind.
 * Until the Tsuchikage uses Wind Release or there' an official release from Kishimoto then it'll remain as earth + an unknown nature transformation--Cerez365 (talk) 12:18, January 18, 2011 (UTC)

Jinton
Why is this and Swift Release listed as Jinton Seriously go check. Please Somebody fix this Movie Nature Calamity--Nintendo-Fan (talk) 07:06, October 18, 2009 (UTC)Nintendo-Fan


 * Different words can have the same pronunciation, I was checking my cousin's English-Japanese dictionary the other day (she's thinking about learning Japanese) and saw that "Kami" can mean "God", "hair" and "paper". Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 13:40, October 18, 2009 (UTC)

What+what=what
How do we know dust release is(part)earth I don't see it being stated in the manga or that it capable of pulverising anything it touches into molecule-sized dust. If its true where is the proof it read the manga chapters and I don't see any proof of alot of things on this page.--Nintendo-Fan (talk) 20:59, November 29, 2009 (UTC)Nintendo-Fan
 * We know it is part Earth Release, because Earth is the only other nature the Tsuchikage showed and it makes perfect sense. We also know it pulverises whatever it touches because the Tsuchikage said so after he used his technique on Sasuke.
 * If you find something without proof and you think is wrong, note it on the talkpage of the article in question. It can only make the wiki better. --ShounenSuki (talk 21:25, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * But technically he never stated that it is part earth. I admit it does make sense, but I don't think putting it there before its comfirmed is a good idea, and its also speculative. At least wait until they comfirm that its part earth--Nintendo-Fan (talk) 23:20, November 29, 2009 (UTC)Nintendo-Fan
 * We use all information available to us, including common sense and logical reasoning. However, I do agree that there is a small chance it might not be Earth-related. I'll rephrase the article to reflect this uncertainty. --ShounenSuki (talk 23:29, November 29, 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank You--Nintendo-Fan (talk) 00:11, November 30, 2009 (UTC)Nintendo-Fan
 * Ok, please stop creating new sections with the same name, keep everything under the same topic. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:12, November 30, 2009 (UTC)

Abilities
Where does it say that it gives the user to manipulate molecules? --Enoki911 (talk) 05:01, December 15, 2009 (UTC)Enoki911
 * Dust is typically that size. Simant (talk) 05:03, December 15, 2009 (UTC)
 * I thought that dust was bigger than that, but I guess I'm wrong... --Enoki911 (talk) 05:07, December 15, 2009 (UTC)Enoki911
 * Dust comes in a variety of sizes. Also, this particular tidbit is from the second fan book. ~SnapperTo 05:16, December 15, 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks --Enoki911 (talk) 07:49, December 15, 2009 (UTC)Enoki911
 * Wait, we don't officially know the abilities of dust release. Just because a dust release jutsu was used, it doesnt necessarily mean all dust release jutsu are like that. I think all the abilities listed on the Dust Release page should be speculation. --75.2.217.57 (talk) 02:39, December 18, 2009 (UTC)

The Second Fanbook gives a brief explanation of the abilities of Dust Release:. --ShounenSuki (talk 10:43, December 18, 2009 (UTC)

You may have heard me say this before somewhere else, but the names of Advanced Natures are usually rather symbolic, and not literal. Their names are designed to be traditional, while their effects are considerably different. So in this case, Dust Release doesn't exactly manipulate dust, it manipulates molecules. --GoDai (talk) 07:38, March 21, 2010 (UTC)

'Molecules' isn't a size anyway. Everything's made up of molecules, and polymers can become huge. I suspect what it means is if there's not a lot of dust around, it'll still grab 'small pieces of Earth' from surrounding material. ZeroSD (talk) 23:11, March 25, 2010 (UTC)

Maybe it is misnamed by the shinobi themselves? If this jutsu disrupts molecular bonds (and that would imply lightning justu due to electrons but lets save that for another section) and breaks it up, would it not look like it had broken into dust to the observor if they knew nothing about physics? Naruto science is a tad haphazard after all, with the bulk being orientated around combat (radios, poisons, knowledge of cells) but where do they show knowledge of the atom? It would not help them in combat unless they were aware they could make atom bombs (and they have not which implies it is at least pre-1930ish compared to us). Even if they did know about atoms KNOW though, back when he was young it would still look like it broke down into dust, and the name probably caught on and no one felt like changing it (what would you call it, if you had the gall to say that to a kage?). Thomas Finlayson (talk) 01:39, June 2, 2010 (UTC)

Well, if you see my "Elements and recomposition" theory on User Talk: Omnibender's wall, you will see that Dust and Lightning are related. I think Dust Release just manipulates molecules broken off surrounding matter, but in a way different from other natures. One of my guesses would be that it can't put molecules back together to form complicated constructs. Also, it said molecules, suggesting it can't break molecules into ions and /or atoms. I think the atom bombs are just matter decided by the plot. Masashi Kishimoto already humbly mentioned he is not an expert on physics. --GoDai (talk) 02:03, June 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * The atom bomb part was meant as comparison of their physics to put into perspective how relatively uneducated they are on it, and how they could have misnamed the jutsu believing that it turned items into dust as opposed to severing the molecular bonds. You are correct that this kind of detail was not mentionned by Kishimoto, but ions and atoms are the build-up of molecules so they would have to be related; plus as you mentionned he is not an expert on physics so confusion on his part is to be expected. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 20:41, June 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * This is not a misnomer. This is dissatisfaction with the translation as "dust". ~SnapperTo 07:38, June 4, 2010 (UTC)

Just to clarify, I am saying that the Shinobi themselves misnamed this jutsu. And you are saying that we have mistranslated what was written down, right? Thomas Finlayson (talk) 20:53, June 4, 2010 (UTC)


 * It might be worth noting that there is a Japanese-Buddhist term referring to the smallest possible unit of matter: . This word is used in terms such as . The kanji for dust itself has an additional meaning of "something extremely small" and is an archaic way of writing 10-9. By the way, 10-9 metre would be a nanometre. That is, molecule-size.
 * In other words, Dust Release is in no way a misnomer. It fits perfectly. --ShounenSuki (talk 01:19, June 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * ... So no, I was not saying it was a mistranslation. I was saying you want "10-9 Release". A matter of word choice, not accuracy. ~SnapperTo 01:59, June 5, 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough, thank you. You may want to add this information though. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 02:08, June 5, 2010 (UTC)

Are we even sure Jinton is a Kekkei Genkai? Recently, Deidara refers to his jutsu as Bakuton and they are all hijutsu. So is there something other than the name that we are basing the assumption on? --Dragonus Nesha

There is evidence of Deidara's jutsu being hiden, unlike the Tsuchikage's. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:05, November 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * But is there evidence for Jinton being a Kekkei Genkai, other than the name? --Dragonus Nesha

Its a Kekkeri Genkai till said other wise at it was said that Element fusions(which the -ton donates and its not one of the 5 basic ones). Kisame said they are rarely seen outside Kekkei Genkai and the outside methods of gaining have been shown only to be through Tailed Beast or dna transfusion. Kishi hasn't hinted at either for Onoki.Umishiru (talk) 00:07, November 18, 2010 (UTC)

Be cautious here but it maybe possible that this Explosion Release is in fact a Kekkei Genkai and the original user died. They saved his cells or studied his/her body and learned how to replicate it. Do to its potential power made it a hijutsu of the Village keeping the details of how to gain it or whatever under lock and key and only Deidara is known to have gained it since then. Thats just speculation.Umishiru (talk) 00:07, November 18, 2010 (UTC)

Advanced Element?
I know it sounds more logical that Dust is Earth + Wind. But can we be certain every of these advanced elements is made that way???

We know Blaze Release is not a mix between Fire and Lightning, but Sasuke who controls his amaterasu. And some kekkei genkais are a product of special abilities (Kimimaro's bones, Neji's byakugan) how can we be sure, every special elemental jutsus are a mix of chakras?

Sidenote: I don't think we should count movies and filler acts chakras, jutsus, etc. as cannon. - KenjiNitari.


 * Hmm well, there are three ideas for Blaze, although there are equally good arguments for all of them:
 * 1. Sasuke was only boasting, comparing this "Amaterasu control" to an actual element.
 * 2. Blaze is Fire+Yin, using the Yin's "creation of form" to turn Amaterasu, which is Fire (Third Databook says it is Fire Release), into different shapes. The Uchiha Clan Ancestor was mentioned to have inherited the Sage's spiritual energy (which would give him a "Yin affinity"), and the Uchiha use Fire, so this would make lots of sense. Normal Shape Transformation might not be enough to control Amaterasu.
 * 3. Blaze is Fire+Lightning. If Amaterasu is hot as the sun, it means it is ionized (divided into charges). Lightning could take advantage of this and control Amaterasu with its movement, making it into things like spikes (like how Lightning is forked; Blaze Release: Kagutsuchi). It's not that weird nothing about Amaterasu besides its shape was changed, as Ice is frozen Water, Lava is molten Earth, Storm is fluid Lightning, Dust looks like a solid Wind, etc. In this case, Blaze would be a forked Fire.
 * Also, beause it has "遁; ton" on it, we consider it some kind of combination because only five basic natures (seven if counting Yin Release and Yang Release) were mentioned, and it was specifically mentioned every other element was formed from two or more simultaneous Nature Transformations. So that's what we go with so far, but who knows, we don't have info yet, really. --GoDai (talk) 10:08, November 14, 2010 (UTC)

Is it safe to say?
Is it safe to say that dust and sand are the same thing. I think this recent manga just fortified that theory in the case of Mu and his "sensor sand". The reason i think this is cuz ppl say that the sand is only a power given to gaara by the 1 tailed beast. But the 1 tails is the wind demon, and gaara has natural earth manipulation. earth then wind chakra should make dust, and in his situation it makes "sand". So i think they are the same Side note: has gaara ever said "sand release" or "sand style"? If he hasn't then that should lean towards this also. Dj q-pid (talk) 01:34, January 22, 2011 (UTC)
 * Apart from me getting confused after you first sentence...No that's speculation so it's not safe to say. The sand belonged to Gaara as well...i think o.o--Cerez365 (talk) 01:37, January 22, 2011 (UTC)
 * What you said is completely wrong as far as we know Dj q-pid. Sand control is an ability Gaara has solely because he was the Shukaku's jinchūriki, the Third Kazekage even used Iron Sand to emulate it after studying a previous host. Shukaku being wind natured changes nothing, and as far as we know, sand falls under wind, because there is a technique Gaara used which is explicitly called a Wind Release, yet it uses sand. Gaara has never ever shown or mentioned to be earth natured. The only thing remotely related to earth ever said relating to Gaara is that he can use his own sand to make more sand by grinding rocks with it, which was explained during his fight against Kimimaro. No, the term Sand Release has never been used anywhere in manga, anime, OVAs, movies, games or even in the TCG. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:06, January 22, 2011 (UTC)

Jintons Elements Revealed Sadly
It appears 525 listed the elements that made up Jinton to be Fire Earth, AND Wind... crap...