Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-26005711-20150512133037/@comment-4061125-20150720100306

In my opinion, although we were originally told that Hiruzen knew all the jutsu in konoha, that statement has a lot of flaws. First of all, many of the jutsu in konoha were clan related jutsu, which he wouldn't be able to use. Second, Hiruzen cannot use The Flying Thunder God Jutsu or many other high class jutsu. He is able to use a large number of jutsu but none that are on the power level of the rasenshuriken or Amaterasu for example. The only jutsu that Hiruzen has used that is on that power level is the dead demon consuming seal (aka the reaper death seal), which is self sacrificial. So yes, although he is a powerful shinobi, I wouldn't say that he is as powerful as Tobirama. Tobirama has been stated in canon to be just slightly less powerful than Hashirama and Madara when they were all alive. Hiruzen has never been close to that level. In short, my point is that Hiruzen has more quantity than Tobirama but Tobirama has a good deal of quantity and a ton more quality than Hiruzen.

Sorry to all the Hiruzen fans. He is a worthy Hokage and powerful shinobi. It's just that Tobirama has the tactics we saw in the war, unmatched water element, the flying thunder god jutsu, the summoning impure resurrection jutsu, and he created the shadow clone jutsu.

Minato 87 wrote: I don't see how Hiruzen or Tobirama can beat or be equal to EMS Madara. Madara has more chakra than second and third, and he has Perfect Susanoo. Hashirama and Naruto is only Hokages who can defeat EMS Madara. Hiruzen all five Nature Transformations, but he is good only in Earth and Fire Style, Enma, Dead Demon Consuming Seal, Shuriken Shadow Clone Technique; Tobirama all five Nature Transformations, but he is good only in Water Style, Flying Thunder God Technique, Flying Thunder God: Slash, Summoning: Impure World Reincarnation; They can't break Madara's Perfect Susanoo, and Madara can keep Perfect Susanoo enough to win this battle. Maybe Hiruzen and Tobirama together, but in one on one battle I doubt.

Yeah, I agree with you. I feel like Tobirama could maybe be equal to Madara if Madara didn't have a perfect Susanoo, but with it in place, there's really no way for Tobirama to equal it out, much less win. And honestly Hiruzen just lacks quality in his techniques. He has many techniques, but none anywhere near strong enough to take down Madara.