Talk:Sharingan

Pair
Shouldn't we add that the Sharingan requires two eyes to bring out their true potential as noted by madara in chapter 602
 * We should shouldn't we.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 11:18, September 20, 2012 (UTC)

We don't know what was meant by that, either Susanoo/Rinnegan or something new--Elveonora (talk) 23:37, September 20, 2012 (UTC)

If the Sharingan requires two eyes to bring out their true potential does that mean that if obito had his other sharingan he'd have the same abilities he does now expect he would be to suck things in the other dimension without physical contact like kakashi's version of kamui and his own current kamui would be strengthened? --82.39.201.72 (talk) 17:54, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

No point in discussing it, that's forum talk. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 17:59, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

What do you mean that's forum talk? why shouldn't we discuss it? --82.39.201.72 (talk) 19:01, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

Discussing the topic of an article just for the sake of discussion is considered forum talk. Topic is meant to be discussed only as far as needed to determine how to list the information. If Sharingan does X, we simply say it does, and unless that goes against anything previously established, in which case discussion should be restricted in pointing that out in the article, no point in discussing why it does X. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:27, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

I don't get what you mean... --82.39.201.72 (talk) 21:42, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

Basically, if you want to ask something just for the sake of asking, don't. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 21:45, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

I'm a massive naruto fan and not a vandal I do lose my cool from time to time just thought I'd let you know. I just wanna like know more so I can help more. --82.39.201.72 (talk) 22:14, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

The only instance that we know this could refer to would be "a 3rd power" an example of this being Amaterasu/Tsukuyomi requirement for Susanoo use. Simply A Mangekyou tech. in left along with B Mangekyou tech. in right in order to use "C" with both. But since we don't know if this is what was referred for, it's soon to conclude as such--Elveonora (talk) 23:25, October 12, 2012 (UTC)

Copy Kekkei Genkai
it should be noted the Sharingan can decipher kekkei genkai techniques if the user has the kekkei genkai in question, Madara can use all of the first's jutsu because of his first hand experience reading the techniques after his reincarnation because of this. 75.172.178.82 (talk) 07:52, November 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * Speculation beyond the realm of necessity.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 10:36, November 9, 2012 (UTC)

Hey Cerez, this one might actually have a point. It's noted the Sharingan can't duplicate bloodline abilities, but at the same time, It doesn't seem like it can copy any technique the user can't perform. For example, Sasuke's sharingan copied Shadow of the Dancing Leaf from Lee, but he himself didn't possess the speed to duplicate Lee's other moves until he trained for the 3rd stage of the Chuunin exam. In this case, Madara didn't have the ability to perform wood release when he was alive, but when revived he duplicated abilities of Hashirama's he couldn't have seen less than 50 years ago. If phrased properly, I think it's worth noting that if in possession of the capacity to perform a bloodline, the Sharingan can duplicate it. --Hawkeye2701 (talk) 16:35, November 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * I never said the person is wrong. I said it was speculation beyond the point of necessity. We do not know how the Sharingan functions with regards to kekkei genkai whether or not it can decipher them but it's because they don't have the capability to do it that they can't reproduce it or Madara simply remembered Hashirama's techniques and then practised them etc. When Madara transplanted Hashirama's DNA into his wounds he noted that nothing happened with regards to the Rinnegan, he never said anything about Wood Release.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 17:13, November 9, 2012 (UTC)

Bloodline/Eternal
Does it really require the person that gives the Eternal Mangekyo Sharingan to be a sibling or someone of close relation? Kakashi got his sharingan, though not in Mangekyo form, and has had no side effects in his vision. It seems like you just have to get another eye, not one related to you. 192.183.30.172 (talk) 03:15, February 4, 2013 (UTC)Adam

I don't fully understand what you are trying to say... but Kakashi doesnot have Eternal Magekyo Sharingan.~ Ultimate  Supreme  03:20, February 4, 2013 (UTC)
 * Kakashi has shown signs of debilitating sight it's just that he does not use the MS nearly as much as an Uchiha does. And so far we've only seen a sibling transfer their eyes to another. Along with what Itachi said to Sasuke during their battle, that's the only basis we have to go on.--Cerez 365 ™Hyūga Symbol.svg(talk) 14:50, February 4, 2013 (UTC)

Not to mention each MS technique puts a different amount of strain on an eye--Elveonora (talk) 17:01, February 4, 2013 (UTC)

Kyuubi Control
How did obito put the nine tails under his control while it was inside kushina, because he stared at kushina and somehow the nine tails got put under his controlRiptide240 (talk) 18:06, March 24, 2013 (UTC)

Even Sasuke could suppress it's chakra simply by using a genjutsu on Naruto, entering his mind and interacting with Kurama. Obito likely did the same, entered her mind dimension or what s*** that is, took control of fox and opened Kushina's seal--Elveonora (talk) 18:35, March 24, 2013 (UTC)

Receiving the Sharingan
What I'm about to say is not cannon material but well, it is in the world of Naruto, so yea.. I just saw the Inheritors of the Will of Fire movie and in that Hiruko seemed to want to absorb Kakashi to obtain the Kekkei Genkai, Sharingan. So is it like once the sharingan is transferred from one person to another, it can't be transferred again? I mean Hiruko could have just taken out the eye, but instead only wanted to absorb Kakashi...so how does this work?

Oh and also if that's true, should the info be added there?

In theory, yes, a simple eye transplant should do it, but the whole point was to absorb them with the Chimera Technique. I mean, the whole point of developing that technique was to get stronger by absorbing other's abilities. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 01:04, May 30, 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, he wanted to absorb the users because Kekkei Genkai such as the Dark/Shade Release, Storm Release, Swift Release and Steel Release can't possibly be transferred from one person to another as they are more or less of Bloodline limits. Whereas the Sharingan can be transferred with eye transplant, so why not do that? Or maybe like you said, he just went with the flow and absorbed everyone he chose anyway.. so now there are two ways of receiving the sharingan?
 * Absorbing it with his technique probably had some upsides. For example, if he transplanted the eye, he'd have only one Sharingan. With the Chimera Technique, he'd probably "transplant" the the very genes responsible for the Sharingan to himself, getting both eyes, improved control (able to turn it on and off), and probably lessened chakra cost as well. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 05:32, May 30, 2013 (UTC)
 * Right.. And thanks for clearing that up! :)

Re Awaken
Should we mention that the Sharingan and Mangekyo Sharingan need to be re-awoken if the possessor is unaware of it awakening previously as shown by Sasuke and Kakashi? TricksterKing (talk) 09:28, April 1, 2014 (UTC)
 * IMO, yes. I agree mentioning that. ~IndxcvNovelist (talk 09:29, April 1, 2014 (UTC)
 * It has to be carefully worded though. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 17:00, April 1, 2014 (UTC)
 * Very careful. Especially because, of those two isolated cases, we still don't know how Kakashi "re-awoken" his Mangekyō Sharingan. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 19:49, April 1, 2014 (UTC)

The only possible stress able to cause the re-awakening of his Mangekyo was probably when he found Naruto at the Valley of the End. It may not have been shown on screen, but I think that is when he re-awakened it.. can't be proven though. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 16:02, April 2, 2014 (UTC)

What is this business with "Re-awakening"? Can someone explain it. Until reading this, despite having read every chapter of the manga and most of the anime, I had not heard anything about it. --Taynio (talk) 16:13, April 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * Sasuke awakened his Sharingan unconsciously when he chased Itachi. Kakashi awakened his Mangekyo Sharingan unconsciously when Rin died. Both needed to awake it while being conscious to make use of it. If you don't remember that you've already awakened it, you can't use it. Seelentau 愛議 16:44, April 2, 2014 (UTC)

Sasuke awakened his Sharingan unconsciously when he chased Itachi. - is that even correct? I mean, he obviously remembers it later, saying he locked those memories away. He obviously can only lock them away if he can remember them, right? Seelentau 愛議 12:20, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * Did he recall himself having used the Sharingan or chasing Itachi tho?--Elveonora (talk) 12:51, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * Ya. Also, he had to use the Sharingan to read the naka stone monument. Seelentau 愛議 13:05, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * If I remember correctly, didn't Sasuke have more tomoe the second time he "awakened" it?--Soul reaper (talk) 13:08, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes. Seelentau 愛議 13:09, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * Wasn't Sasuke shown reading the tablet without his Sharingan? Trvia somewhere around at least used to say so--Elveonora (talk) 13:13, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * No. Seelentau 愛議 13:16, April 7, 2014 (UTC)

The reason I bring up the tomoe is that, while we have stated that more experience with the Sharingan allows it to mature, I'm fairly sure Sasuke's was shown maturing when he went through periods of strong emotion. To me at least it seems as though the whole "strong emotions" aspect of the Uchiha's power permeates every aspect of their Kekkei Genkai.--Soul reaper (talk) 13:18, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * Could be, yes. Seelentau 愛議 13:20, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * It's not really something we can cite though is it?--Soul reaper (talk) 13:21, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * I... don't really understand how it's related to my question? Seelentau 愛議 13:22, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * The whole subject of Sasuke awakening and reawakening his Sharingan just jogged my memory. I may have gone off on a tangent.--Soul reaper (talk) 13:29, April 7, 2014 (UTC)

He might have locked away his memory of chasing Itachi and recalled it later, but we don't know if he was aware of the fact that he had the Sharingan on then.--Elveonora (talk) 13:47, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * There is no reason to believe he wasn't. Seelentau 愛議 13:58, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * What about Kakashi then? Well, both have in common that they passed out afterwards, it could have seemed like a dream to them or something.--Elveonora (talk) 14:15, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
 * Sasuke didn't pass out. He chased Itachi and even threw Kunai at him. Kakashi awakened the Mangekyo Sharingan while passing out, so there's a huge difference. Seelentau 愛議 14:17, April 7, 2014 (UTC)

Source
Okay, 671 may have provided us with a certain information. We know that Kaguya had the Sharingan, which in her case looks like the Shinju's eye. We know that Kaguya ate the Shinju's fruit, and gained power from it. I find it highly unlikely that she already had the Sharingan third eye that just happened to look like the Shinju's eye. I tried looking at the mural-like depictions of her in 646, but the angles are bad, so there's no way to tell if she already had the third eye before eating the fruit. My question is, do we have enough to state that the Sharingan originally stemmed from the Shinju? By consequence, is Hagoromo's classification of that eye a reason for us to list the Shinju as a Sharingan user as well? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 16:43, April 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * I'd list the Shinju as a Sharingan user, yes. However, I would only point at how both eyes look the same, not stating that Kaguya got her third eye from the chakra fruit. Seelentau 愛議 16:44, April 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, the Shinju's eye looks like a mix or Rinnegan and Sharingan, so why would it be called just Sharingan? She ate the fruit and got the Sharingan apparently and her son was born with the Rinnegan. Both eye stem from the Shinju and its eye just happens to look like both, that's why I don't get why would it be just the Sharingan and not Rinnegan coming from it--Elveonora (talk) 20:28, April 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * Because the eye was called Sharingan, not Sharinnegan. Seelentau 愛議 20:54, April 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * You missed my point, I think. Why is the Kaguya's eye stated to be Sharingan since it also resembles the Rinnegan?--Elveonora (talk) 21:04, April 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * I don't know, ask Hagoromo. Seelentau 愛議 21:19, April 2, 2014 (UTC)
 * My view on this? Purely speculation, but here it is: Why do we assume that the three tomoe Sharingan is its most mature form? Well, obviously because all the Sharingan we've seen only gain three tomoe, but nowhere in the manga is it actually stated that three tomoe means it is fully mature. It could just be that Kaguya, being the original human user, matured her Sharingan far beyond that of current Uchiha. Her prowess with it (and the Byakugan) were stated to have been the reason she was able to rule the planet. So, that logic included, suggests her Sharingan was much better than any of the current ones. Anyways, this isn't a forum so excuse my blurb. Speculation aside, the Shinju has a Sharingan, so yes, it should be added. It doesn't matter how it looks. It was flat out said to be a Sharingan. ~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 23:42, April 2, 2014 (UTC)


 * Considering that Tsukuyomi is a Sharingan technique, and that both Kaguya and the Shinju can use the amplified version of Tsukuyomi (Infinite Tsukuyomi, yes?) and that both presumably have amplified (or in this case, "more matured") versions of the Sharingan, it's fair to state that both Kaguya and the Shinju are Sharingan users. WindStar7125 (talk) 23:57, April 2, 2014 (UTC)WindStar7125
 * Alright then. Everyone, so far, seems to be on the same page. I'mma go ahead and add the relevant information.~ Ten Tailed Fox Yamagakure Symbol.svg 00:21, April 3, 2014 (UTC)

Please don't add that Kaguya got her Sharingan from eating the fruit, ya? That's (reasonable) speculation. Seelentau 愛議 08:13, April 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * Not sure if sarcastic or... Anyway, why would her Sharingan have the Rinnegan rings? Also why would her son with watered-down power be born with an apparently superior doujutsu (the Rinnegan) an eye that's "final stage" of what even the Shinju has? Doesn't make any sense. The Shinju doesn't have Sharingan guys...--Elveonora (talk) 09:44, April 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * Hagoromo called Kaguya's third eye a Sharingan, and that is the exact same eye Shinju has. What is it supposed to be then? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 15:46, April 3, 2014 (UTC)


 * Who's to say that the original sharingan isn't superior to the rinnegan? MangekyoSasuke (talk) 17:17, April 3, 2014 (UTC)

@Omni, read at Kaguya's talkpage. I can't seem to make any sense of it, but perhaps I'm just too dumb for this thing. If Sharingan came first, what happened to "if you progress beyond the Sharingan, there lies the Rinnegan" more or less it's contradictory which came first and which is upper stage of the other--Elveonora (talk) 23:00, April 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * Kaguya's Sharingan, despite being called a Sharingan, is clearly not the same as the Sharingan most Uchiha developed. That progression as we know applies only to the three tomoe Sharingan. Whether Kaguya Sharingan is as powerful or more than the Rinnegan, we don't know. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:16, April 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * So since it's a Sharingan in name-only, why do you treat it the same way as the ordinary Sharingan? The to us known Sharingan is a watered down version of the Rinnegan, while the Rinnegan is either a watered down version of Kaguya's "Sharingan" or perhaps even superior to it. Also her eye in fact would be a closer thing to "Sharingan progenitor" than the eyes we thought Indra had.--Elveonora (talk) 23:25, April 3, 2014 (UTC)

Frankly, all of that doesn't matter. Kishi called it a Sharingan. We call it a Sharingan. End of debate until we know more. Its pointless to speculate on the "why" when we simply do not know. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 01:04, April 4, 2014 (UTC)


 * It's one of the only times I agree with your bluntness. It's a Sharingan. It may be called the same but function or look differently, but until we know more, we cannot say anything other than what we're told (a la Naruto and bijuu). --Taynio (talk) 01:31, April 4, 2014 (UTC)

An even more simple explanation.. She had Sharingan and Byakugan first.. then she ate Shinju fruit.. then Shinju eye fused with her third eye Sharingan, then Hagoromo was born with the Sharingans superior evolution the Rinnegan. That is more logical and makes more sense. ItachiWasAHero (talk) 02:59, April 9, 2014 (UTC)
 * She didn't have the third eye before.--Elveonora (talk) 10:05, April 9, 2014 (UTC)
 * We don't actually know that. The only depiction we have of Kaguya that we know is from before eating the fruit is a highly stylised mural depiction, and none of the angles show if she had the third eye. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 14:22, April 9, 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, if she had it there before, I believe that would serve as a confirmation of her having been an alien. The eye is... vertical 0_0--Elveonora (talk) 14:36, April 9, 2014 (UTC)

As of the new chapter we can be pretty much positive that the Third Eye is a side affect of the Shinju's influence and is essentially its own eye in human form. Also, Obito was planning on using the Juubi's eye in its Shinju form to perform the Infinite Tsukuyomi, showing that both eyes function identically. Madara obtained the same eye by absorbing the Shinju, instead of merely eating its fruit (which he was initially planning to do instead). In Kaguya's case, it was directly called a Sharingan. It could also be a combination of Rinnegan and Sharingan, if its in any way connected to Sasuke's Rinnegan that he received as his part of Hagoromo's power, who was also the Shinju's jinchuriki. However, at the very least, I think we can confirm that the Juubi's eye is a Sharingan (with potential to be a combination variant with the Rinnegan). I think we should add an "Eye of Shinju" into the Sharingan page explaining the eye and how it is different from the regular sharingan, and its capabilities, since its more of a Tailed Beast Skill rather than a Kekkei Genkai. Skarrj (talk) 05:22, May 15, 2014 (UTC)
 * Before Sasuke's new left eye was shown and called a Rinnegan, what's kinda what we did. It was reverted because despite the three eyes at the time (Shinju, Kaguya, and Sasuke) looking the same, one was called a Sharingan, one was called a Rinnegan, and the other wasn't called anything. Since this is a particularly confuse subject, people sort of agreed to refrain from drawing conclusions, and just say what the manga says. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 16:41, May 15, 2014 (UTC)
 * But to be fair, Sasuke has been using his Rinnegan with the same attributes it had while his Sharingan. It really seems to be a combination of the two -- It looks like it, and functions like it. And that would actually make sense, even though it hasn't been called a Sharingan directly. But that's not my argument. My argument is that the Juubi's eye has definitely been refereed to as Sharingan. Just because it might have the potential to also be Rinnegan doesn't mean it shouldn't be included as it is currently known into the pages. Skarrj (talk) 16:50, May 15, 2014 (UTC)