Board Thread:Versus Debates/@comment-36006024-20180727165341/@comment-34194151-20180808180427

@LegionZero

How do we know that they were in mid air? Naruto was in the air yes but there is no evidence that I currently see showing that obito was in mid air. Obito is falling on his back in the kamui dimension. Even if the rasengan didn't finish him, he is very finishable. I know we didn't get to see what happened, so its speculation, but it does seem very suspect to be honest.

@LoneNinja

That's not what I meant. If naruto could hit him with a rasengan in the kamui dimension as he did in Chapter 598 pg 15, he could have used a chakra arm and rasenshuriken in its place, but instead he only prepared a rasengan.... Obito's regen and durability is hax i know, but he got a hole blown in his chest from raikiri. There is absolutely no WAY he is surviving a rasenshuriken from naruto. At the very least, he isn't fighting anymore, not even the full blown hashirama could keep fighting after that. I don't think naruto necessarily had 24/7 killer intent towards obito. I mean, wasn't it established during the Pein Arc that naruto wasn't gonna kill his enemies and continue cycle of hatred? Even after they extracted the tailedbeasts from obito, naruto did't try to finish him. I'm pretty sure naruto is one of those personalities that only will kill if there is no other choice. Isn't this the same naruto who called Obito the best guy ever? The same dude who killed his parents in cold blood lol (even if obito turned a new leaf, there is no way that atones for everything else he has done to the point where naruto basically puts this guy above iruka sensei )? I'm not trying to say that Naruto absolutely wasn't trying to kill him, but its not that black/white imo. He did express interest in who he was as well.

@LegionZero and Loneninja

See, bullet time I'm pretty sure means that time is slowed down. Like in the matrix move. or when minato faced tobi in the anime during their final clash during Kyuubi attack. With the speed minato and tobi were moving at and with the speed minato threw his kunai at, and then teleported to it they had to slow it down for us to see. I can picture in my head how it would look like if bullet time was off, it means ninja have above average reaction times. it means all objects appear to be moving slower than they actually are. So that said, Obito is really fast. But at the same time, there is also distance considerations.

Look at chapter 598 pg 1. Naruto using his top speed should have been able to easily close the distance if he was using his topspeed between himself and obito. Yet we can see him running a few steps and he has barely closed the distance. And opts for a chakra arm to try and flatten obito. Obito didn't even move, he used kamui to avoid it, so we know obito hasn't changed his position. If naruto was using his "top speed" then why was he so far away even after running for a panel? Even V2 ayy would instantly close that distance. Also, another consideration that I don't think anyone has brought up is shadow clones. At this point, naruto has made tons of shadow clones for other battlefields. So hasn't he been losing stamina since the fight with Ayy? Shunshin uses chakra, and even if naruto is a chakra beast, surely he has way less chakra than the fight with Ei, so that could explain why obito and the others can keep up with him.

Also, i don't understand your description of Ayy. Ayy was considered at minimum to be the third fastest shinobi alive when Minato was living. What does his top speed have to do with his opponent seeing him? A MS user in sasuke had trouble tracking Raikage's movements. Minato didn't track Ayy, ayy simply ran in a straight line. Minato was quick enough to assess the situation after the blitz initiated and Raikage closed the distanced and throw his kunai, and avoid getting tagged in the process and counter attack Ayy using the instant speed of Flying rajin. Karin also said The raikage was "impossibly fast" So Raikage is just that fast. He is shown to disappear because he is using the body flicker technique. I'm pretty sure even fodder ninja have disappeared using that. Also, even V1 Ayy covered a huge distance in one panel, just look at chapter 467 pg 1. To me the situation of speed is pretty complex, so I'm a bit confused.

There are other times though when bullet time can be seen clearly. Like when Deva path killed two naruto clones and dodged two rasenshuriken on like the same page. We know that rasenshuriken is like rediciously fast so we know Pein was fast enough to avoid it, and we can see that the rasenshuriken was barely moving in that panel. So it must mean things were happening in slow motion. I know its possible bullet time was being used in the obito fight but i don't see it clearly yet.