Board Thread:Naruto Discussions/@comment-29393962-20161111215453/@comment-734582-20170114095308

Georgio722 wrote: I've always thought that you needed something to manifest the Rinengan from (ie. upgrade the Sharingan), I guess Rinnegan is something that can be manifested from chakra alone. But if this also applies to SPSM, then what determines the manifested ability to be the Rinnegan for Madara? I'm not saying it makes no sense. I can completely understand the reasoning why people think that a dojutsu is needed for a stronger dojutsu. But sasuke's eye is irrefutable proof that Rinnegan and Sharingan are separate dojutsu. Ergo, you don't need Sharingan.

SPSM seems to require some prerequisite sage mode (Naruto has sage mode, Obito/Madara had juubi). Madara lacked a Sage Mode in his first life that would've given him SPSM. If Hashirama got Madara's cells, he would've awakened SPSM and eventually rinnegan. LegionZero wrote: When/where was it debunked about the Rinnegan being an evolution of the Sharingan?? I can write a more elaborate debunk if you want, but the basis is this:
 * Sasuke's Sharingan retracts in both eyes with overuse, turning his tomoe rinnegan into a regular rinnegan. This doesn't make him loose Rinnegan powers (IE amenotejikara). It does make him lose Susanoo and Amaterasu. Hence, they are separate dojutsu.
 * Black zetsu says he tried both transmigrant to get Rinnegan. If only Sharingan could do this, why not just say Indra?
 * Madara is unable to use MS techs with his Rinnegan