Talk:Lightning Cutter

Raikiri
Shouldn't this article be called "Lightning Blade" because that's what they call it in the English dub? Madara uchiha99 14:57, 3 December 2007 (UTC)Madara uchiha99
 * Probably, which makes me think we should probably start a proper name discussion. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) current discussion Dec 3, 2007 @ 17:46 (UTC)

Why not merge it to Chidori? It's better then a bunch of small pages. Chidori

Because it's not the same technique. And while they're similar, the way they are used and the jutsus that come from them are completely different--Yondaime1987 (talk) 14:43, October 5, 2009 (UTC)

I don't think so, watch episode number 67 and hear Might Guy's explanation, he says that lightning blade is just another name for chidori.--Sasukeayush (talk) 11:08, November 28, 2009 (UTC)

I always thought Raikiri was stronger than Chidori because it used more shape manipulation. As in, Chidori was just nature manipulation with high speed and killed somebody. But Raikiri was lightning chakra molded into an actual shape to make it stronger. (Sometime during Rasenshuriken training Kakashi said Elemental + Shape is stronger than them separate)If that's not the case, then Raikiri uses MORE shape manipulation than Chidori, making it stronger. - Zaxbeez

Flapping Chidori
And this is not the only page. Rasengan and others has a lot of mini pages related to then that would be better together. They should be divided only if the page is big, or has a lot of varieties (like Clone Technique). Rasengan has a lot of varieties, but most of their pages are small. They can be divided after being improved in the main Rasengan page. --201.36.253.70 13:39, 4 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Mainly because this wiki wanted to have separate pages for each jutsu. At first I wanted a compelte list like Wikipedia, but I guess this way grew on me. --TheUltimate3 23:51, 4 December 2007 (UTC)


 * We're going to be using a set of Jutsu infoboxes to put jutsu info on the articles. And those are automatically going to insert Semantic data about the jutsu when Wikia installs Semantic MediaWiki. At that point we're going to be creating the lists like List of Ninjutsu automatically using the SMW function (or  if that part has not been released yet. If we put any jutsu on the same page, then that will break it and all the jutsu which are grouped like that will be considered a single jutsu. By all means, we can stick a area for a summary of the jutsu and stick the section tags   around that area and we can always use DPL to transclude those into another page to give a short summary of related jutsu. If you take a look at the article section at Jutsu, you'll see headers of sections, with a summary below them. That text there is actually a transcluded summary of each of the types of Jutsu, from the page that the section links to. ~ NOTASTAFF Daniel Friesen (DanTMan, Nadir Seen Fire) (talk) current discussion  Dec 5, 2007 @ 06:46 (UTC)

New form of Lightning Blade?
Hey, Hey, hey, me and Shikamaru1994 found something really interesting. In Chapter 421, Kakashi uses Lightning Blade, but turns into a form of a dog! The outcome was not figured out as Pain repelled it. But, Kakashi used this for a long-range fighting. Anyone knows from this kind of information? YOU BETTER ANSWER TOO!!! --Rasengan888

The jutsu that kakashi uses is another variant of it called lightning hound or so my friend says. Don't know quite well myself. let's research it out.

Don't worry I am here, and if you guys want proof here it is! http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/421/13/ If anybody has information on it, make a new article or put it in conjuction with Lighting Blade. It would be useless to put up any information on the technique if a name is not found. (Dantman told me this!)

Thanks! Shikamaru1994 00:05, 13 November 2008 (UTC)Shikamaru1994

Rank
At the moment the lightning blade is listed on this page as a Rank S technique, but i'm pretty sure when Kakashi is training Naruto for the Rasenshuriken, he says that the lightning blade is only a Rank A technique--Yondaime1987 (talk) 14:46, October 5, 2009 (UTC)


 * If I'm not mistaken, Kakashi only talks about the Chidori during Naruto's Wind Release training. --ShounenSuki (talk 15:02, October 5, 2009 (UTC)
 * I think a data book gave Raikiri the S-rank and the Chidori the A-rank. Jacce | Talk 15:06, October 5, 2009 (UTC)

Lightning Blade/Lightning Cutter
Okay, what is up with this!? I thought that the articles weren't supposed to be called their literal english names, but the names given in the anime! And in the english anime, it is explicitly called "Lightning Blade"! If you're calling jutsus by their literal english names, you might as well call the Rasengan "Spiraling Sphere"!--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 23:19, November 15, 2009 (UTC)


 * Rasengan and Chidori are gray areas that can be brought up in the forum or talk page at any time. My personal opinion is that those two iconic jutsu are the only two jutsu that went completely unchanged from Japanese to English, therefore they get past the Literal English thing here. Lighting Blade however does not fall under that. And it has been a mistranslation that has been bugging me for about a year (yes I am just that lazy to actually ask ShounenSuki about it). It was called "Raikari", Lighting Blade, Lightning Edge, back to Lighting Blade, back to Raikari again, back to Lighting Edge, then Lighting Blade, until I finally realized "I know this is wrong" and asked ShounenSuki.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 23:24, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

So it's been called alot of names. Just name the article by what it's been called the most (Lightning Blade, if I am correct), mention the other titles as alternate names, and make the appropriate redirects. Seems simple as that to me.--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 23:31, November 15, 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually to call it "what it's been called the most" would mean we name the article "Raikari", which we are not going to do. Because like I said before, it's not in the gray area like the other two jutsu where. This was just a mistranslation that had been used for far to long.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 23:35, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

Ehhh, still not convinced. You can't always call something by the literal translation. I learned that fact in my Spanish lessons.--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 23:40, November 15, 2009 (UTC)


 * That is true. That doesn't matter though. Because as ShounenSuki told me when I asked for the translation, Lighting Cutter makes the most sense in context. The context being "Kakashi's justsu cut a lighting bolt. Thus Lighting Cutter." So even in a context battle, Lighting Cutter comes out on top.
 * It's not something that everyone can like. I personally can't stand the thought that Ultimate Absolute Defense: Shield of Shukaku is actually read as Ultimately Hard Absolute Defense: Shield of Shukaku. But I just /shrug and move on. The point is, we had the name wrong, it is now correct.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 23:47, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

Still not sold on it. But, seeing as I barely come on this wiki anymore, I guess I'll just have to leave it be for now.--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 23:51, November 15, 2009 (UTC)

I think that the word lightning blade sounds the most appropriate coz' that is the word heard most commonly in the anime, as well as the english subtitles in the episodes with japanese dialogue's. Anyway there is no need to find the true translational of Raikiri since it has already been done by profesional's and cannot be possibly changed to the general public out there --Sasukeayush (talk) 10:57, November 28, 2009 (UTC)

For God's sake,the anime is canon as it follows the manga.The translation for Raikiri=Lighting Blade.See my point?188.27.96.82 (talk) 19:27, December 11, 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes. I see your point. No. It still doesn't matter. We use literal translations for techniques, the obvious differences being the Rasengan and Chidori which I mentioned before. Lighting Blade is what Viz decided to call the technique. refer to link for the actual translation of 雷切.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 19:31, December 11, 2009 (UTC)

Your comment about the "Lightning Cutter" being the most appropriate because of the context doesn't quite make sense to me. A blade is used to cut. While technically, a cutter is also used to cut, the term is very rarely used. Therefore, blade would fit the context better. --Enoki911 (talk) 20:28, December 27, 2009 (UTC)


 * The emphasis is different. Lightning Blade implies a blade that is made of lightning. Lightning Cutter implies something that cuts lightning. --ShounenSuki (talk 20:38, December 27, 2009 (UTC)


 * And, indeed, the story behind the ability is that Kakashi once used it to split a bolt of lightning, giving it its name, making the proper name for the technique Lightning Cutter.

I've done several translations for the kanji. From my results, 雷切 can be translated literally to Off lightning, The thunder ardently, Running out of thunder, Thunder earnest, and Thunder truncated. Now seeing as Rai can mean both thunder and lightning, and in this case it is lightning. Off lightning can mean that it is a piece of lightning therefore a jutsu made of a piece of lightning which doesn't apply. Running out can mean depleting and running from the inside therefore lightning depletion or exiting lightning. Ardently in its root, ardent can mean full of ardor (great warmth of feeling or spirit), fervent, and passionate or in a second definition burning, glowing, or shining meaning one of the following: lightning warmth of feeling, lightning spirit, lightning fervent (1.Exhibiting enthusiasm, zeal, conviction, persistence, or belief. 2.Having or showing great emotional warmth or passion. 3.Glowing, burning, or very hot.) passionate lightning, burning lightning, glowing lightning, or shining lightning none of these really apply either. Earnest can mean 1. Ardent in the pursuit of an object; eager to obtain or do; zealous  with sincerity; with hearty endeavour; heartfelt; fervent; hearty; -- used in a good sense; as, earnest prayers. 2. Intent; fixed closely; as, earnest attention. 3. Serious; important. Taking number 1 into account it could mean pursuit of lightning, which put with the story, pursuing the lightning to cut it. Finally truncated, the past participle of truncate which can mean to shorten something as if by cutting off part of it. The three important ones piece of lightning, pursuit of lightning, and cutting off part of lightning pertain to the story. The winner would be truncated as it has to do with the actual cutting of the lightning therefore "lightning cutter".WolfMaster (talk) 23:56, February 13, 2010 (UTC)


 * You are showing a lack of deeper understanding of both the English and Japanese languages and a complete inability to use dictionaries properly. Your post also lacks a point. --ShounenSuki (talk 00:02, February 14, 2010 (UTC)

The point is if we use literal translation it can have many results even ones not related to the accepted meaning. WolfMaster (talk) 00:15, February 14, 2010 (UTC)

Yet another reason why I hate this wiki, and no I'm not just being a troll, this is my honest opinion. True, the literal translation for the kanji is Lightning Cutter. Ok. So. Great, you figured out how to read the flipping kanji. The anime subtitles, as well as the English dub, Viz, and not to mention most of the translations we read online call it Lightning Blade or Raikiri. But since we use the English version here on the wiki, I suggest Lightning Blade. This should be a wiki that the fans can recognize, and easily be able to find information on right? Well, I hate to tell you, but there are a lot of English fans who don't do all this kanji research, and who don't go looking for the manga online, therefore they would recognize this technique better as Lightning Blade. A simple Trivia note that the actual kanji means Lightning Cutter would be sufficient. Geez, you guys treat this as if it's a flipping art, or as if someone is gonna come along and applaud you for all this reading into the kanji; it doesn't happen that way, use the established canon to name the techniques, not your kanji research. ~ NOTASTAFF Ryun Uchiha (Ten Tailed Fox, Getsueikirite-taichou) (talk) 12:03, March 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * I was about this close to making a long response. Then I realized, I'd be wasting my time. Raikari translates into Lightning Cutter. This wiki uses literal English. Thus, the article is called Lightning Cutter. Boom. Simple. Thank you. Farewell.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 12:53, March 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * As expected. Typical. ~ NOTASTAFF Ryun Uchiha (Ten Tailed Fox, Getsueikirite-taichou) (talk) 20:36, March 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * Typical? TheUltimate3 simply spoke the truth, this wiki uses the literal translation of jutsu names, so why would it be any different for this one? --ShounenSuki (talk 21:28, March 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't think someone who operates a fanon wiki could find faults with so many things. Or, even odder, dislike that anyone can "treat this as if it's a flipping art". What does that make fanon if the main series isn't art? ~SnapperTo 22:47, March 9, 2010 (UTC)
 * Woah woah woah, hold up. First, when did I imply fanon was an art? Secondly, where the heck did fanon come in to this? I'm pointing out how liberal you all are with translations when you could just go with the canon's name and deal with it? Lastly get your facts straight, fanon is an enjoyment, not an art. ~ NOTASTAFF Ryun Uchiha (Ten Tailed Fox, Getsueikirite-taichou) (talk) 00:26, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * As much as I like ganging up on someone, lets keep this civil people. Now Fox, you say we could just go by canon name, but which is canon? The original Japanese, or the dub English? Which one would one prefer? Which would another? Why not take the road less traveled, and use elements of both: The original one, changed from Japanese to Enlgish. Thus, literal translations. No version is favored over the other, no bias. If someone comes looking for Raikari or Lighting Blade, they'll do a search and low and behold! Lightning Cutter! /readsarticle Oh, so Raikari actually means Lighting Cutter! I learned something! And that is what wiki's in general are about. Learning.
 * Also Fanon can indeed be an art. Fanon is usually so riddled with bad that no one thinks it's art, but when done right it can be. Case and point: do a search on Bleedman. A bunch of glorified fanfiction and damnit if that's not art than I don't want to see what what real art is.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 00:53, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * In the poem, the "road less traveled by" was not the one that [Frost] actually took. So, in this case, the less traveled option would be Lightning Blade. Although I don't care about the translation 99% of the time, I agree with using Lightning Blade in this one instance. Fox agrees with I, I agree with TheUltimate, and TheUltimate does not agree with himself. That's 3-to-1 in favor of Lightning Blade. I have moved the page accordingly. ~SnapperTo 04:02, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm confused. But I still hold on to Lighting Cutter. This jutsu is not special enough to go against what has been used.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 04:28, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * Confused by somehow not agreeing with myself I mean.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 04:30, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * You wander down the hall, looking for your team. You hear something. Thunder? Lightning? Yes, that was it. But wait! It is some kind of zombie. It is ambling towards you. You have learned previously that zombies have a +4 resistance to flashlights. You search for a weapon to re-kill the re-dead. You can find only hedge cutters and a razor blade. It seems like a simple choice, but you're confused. You have expressed a preference for things that cut, but in taking less traveled roads you have indirectly learned the majesty of all things blade. What do you do? Prune abomination with hedge cutters (pg. 78)? Use razor blade to send it back to hell with a clean shave (pg. 15)? Ask why simple question does not receive simple answer (pg. 103)? ~SnapperTo 04:58, March 10, 2010 (UTC)

Abda-ah-ga-unintelligible garble-gah..--TheUltimate3 (talk) 05:10, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * TheUltimate has died, apparently. You, apparently, find his body in a hall where he was looking for you and possibly others. Beside him lay hedge clippers, a razor blade, and what was some kind of zombie. You pick through the zombie's remains. On close examination you discover that it was more Frankenstein's monster than zombie. You think back to your days at cheesy-movie academy: flashlights are Frankenstein's monsters' worst enemies. TheUltimate need not have died making an entirely irrelevant choice. Oh the inhumanity! What do you do? Use the science of Frankenstein to make TheUltimate into some kind of zombie but actually not (pg. 159)? Leave him to rot, disappointed that he did not go all Naruto and make up his own answer (pg. 103)? Continue discussion of Blade v. Cutter, fully knowing nothing will change (pg. 1)? Wonder where this whole "choose your fate" approach to discussions came from (pg. 13)?~SnapperTo 06:00, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * This discussion has taken an interesting turn...
 * If you will, I'll say one thing about the translation Lightning Blade. It is completely and utterly incorrect and doesn't take into account the actual meaning of the kanji used, the real-life cultural connections and the in-universe origin of the name. It is wrong, plain and clear. --ShounenSuki (talk 12:27, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well I agree that it is the wrong interpretation of the kanji, I'm just saying that both the manga in english, and the english anime use Lightning Blade. Besides, we have an option on the infobox for literal translation for you to but Lightning Cutter, but the fact is, the Anime uses Lightning Blade, as does the manga, and canon takes precedence over our little translation wars. Btw, sorry for starting something up. Didn't mean to bug you Ultimate, I just think that we should use canon names, even if they are incorrect translations. That is why we have the literal translation option on the infobox after all. ~ NOTASTAFF Ryun Uchiha (Ten Tailed Fox, Getsueikirite-taichou) (talk) 18:31, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * My god, CANON names? The CANON name is not the name that the English Anime says, its the translation of the real meaning of the Japanese name. If you think that, youre saying that we should name EVERYTHING like in the English Anime, even if it is a bad translation? This is not a Wikia about the English Anime, this is a Wikia for Naruto which is in English. So we should name the thins like they´re really named.--Kind-Hearted-One (talk) 18:41, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * First of all, I do believe I said Manga and Anime, in fact I note two times in my last post where I said Manga and anime. Secondly, I can get your point without you constantly capitalizing. Before you post and try to make someone look stupid, you should probably read thier entire post, just a hint, but it helps. ~ NOTASTAFF Ryun Uchiha (Ten Tailed Fox, Getsueikirite-taichou) (talk) 18:51, March 10, 2010 (UTC)
 * First of all, Im really sorry about the capitalize, it´s childish and I may have offended you, sorry again. Secondly, I was just saying that we are a Wikia about Naruto, not about the English versions of Naruto. We can list the English names, of course, but we should stack to the reality. We already have a place for "English Anime-Manga" in the Jutsu box, so I dont see the poinT about this argument :S--Kind-Hearted-One (talk) 18:59, March 10, 2010 (UTC)

The canon is the Japanese version, which is also the version we use as a basis for this wiki. By using the most literal and correct translation as possible, we try to stick as close to the original Japanese version as we can. You say we should use canon names, well we are.

Even ignoring the many errors, using the 'official' English version poses a huge problem: which one should we use? The manga or the anime? The US, UK, Canadian, or Australian version? In fact, even if we could decide on which version to use, the translations and names used within a single version can vary as well, so which would we use then?

We established a policy that allows us to be true to the source, give the best possible information, and stay consistent without much problems. I don't see why we should change it because you dislike the name Lightning Cutter. --ShounenSuki (talk 19:03, March 10, 2010 (UTC)

I don't dislike the name at all, I actually quite like it. I figured since most versions use Lightning Blade, then that name should take precedence. I have yet to see a version that hasn't used Lightning Blade, but then again I haven't read too many versions, so I guess I see where you are coming from. ~ NOTASTAFF Ryun Uchiha (Ten Tailed Fox, Getsueikirite-taichou) (talk) 19:26, March 10, 2010 (UTC)

Debut
Wait, so Raikiri debuted before Chidori? It's like Ōdama Rasengan debuting before Rasengan itself! Just saying. --<font color="#405060" size="2px">Animeluvr | (Talk) 22:32, January 13, 2010 (UTC)


 * Kakashi used Lightning Cutter during the fight with Zabuza and Haku. Kakashi didn't teach Sasuke how to do the Chidori until Chunin Exams. Lighting Cutter appeared first.--TheUltimate3 (talk) 22:52, January 13, 2010 (UTC)