Talk:Naruto Uzumaki

Mode
So, which Mode did he use in 700+4? Right now, I see the article mentioning both Six Paths Sage Mode and Nine-Tails Chakra Mode in different sections. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 12:47, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * There's no way of knowing for certain, but the lack of eye pigmentation would indicate it was Six Paths Sage Mode, would it not? Even though the magatama and horns are missing, but those have been a part of all of these modes.--BeyondRed (talk) 12:50, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * I'd say it could be Six Paths Sage Mode (with both halves of Kurama) because of black undergarments, no pigmentation near eye, no glowing skin. The design looks like Tailed beast Sage Mode because he lacks Magatama markings. In the Last he used something like tailed beast mode, so this is something different.--Mecha Naruto (talk) 12:53, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * No way to know for sure. But he lacked the horns and the Truth-Seeking Balls so I'm going to assume Nine-Tails ChakraMode.--TheUltimate3 Akimichi Symbol.svg (talk) 12:55, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * Aww come on its clearly six paths sage mode, the pigmentation not present already determines it. The magatama not present is not really important in determining the mode cause actually al the modes has it and the horns are not present cause naruto has cropped his hair now.BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 13:05, May 21, 2015 (UTC)User:BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 9:02, May 21, 2015
 * Would lack of TSB be a reliable indicator though? Naruto got fewer and fewer when fighting Madara and Kaguya, and they didn't regenerate. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 13:07, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * I see there's thick markings on his face, no Sage pigmentation, but that doesn't seem to be his Six Paths Sage Mode. Look at his shoulders, body and his hands in the chapter and compare it to this image. Looked more like his Tailed Beast Sage Mode. 13:32, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * guys come on the no pigmentation was the six paths sage modes first sign. and by the way when did naruto ever enter his TBSM without sage mode pigmentation. BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 13:41, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * @TheUltimate3, How lack of horns is pro Nine-Tails Chakra Mode argument because Naruto had them in this mode too, i think this lack is due his short hair cut. Magatama thing: yes he lacks RM markings on back but same time he lacks KM markings on neck. Now eyes and skin thing: in Last we seen that when Naruto uses KM+SM he has pigmentation and his skin glowing so this speaks against KM+SM mode. ./ Rage gtx (talk) 13:56, May 21, 2015 (UTC)

And there was no magatama nor Rinnegan markings on the back either, so it can't be SPSM. Jesus, Kishi. Gonna go do something real quick. 15:00, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * There is actually another possibility as well, but it's confusing. According to the databook entry, the mode Naruto entered when he kicked Madara's Truth-Seeking Ball -- which looked just like regular Sage Mode with no pigmentation -- is Six Paths Sage Mode. The chakra cloak that didn't cover his skin is not Six Paths Sage Mode, it's just something he can do while in Six Paths Sage Mode. We never saw either of his regular chakra cloaks after that point in the manga, so for all we know they were permanently replace by the new chakra cloak, just like the form in The Last replaced them. Based on all of the forms being called "Kurama Link Mode" or some such in Retsu no Sho, it seems like Kishimoto doesn't really distinguish between them the way we do. They're all basically considered the same thing.--BeyondRed (talk) 15:06, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay. In Retsu no Sho, all of Naruto's modes (save SPSM), whether it be Nine-Tails Chakra Mode, Kurama Mode, Kurama Link Mode, Tailed Beast Mode, Tailed Beast Chakra Mode, or Tailed Beast Sage Mode, are all classified as "Kurama Chakra Mode" in that book. At least we know he used that. 15:15, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * @WindStar, with same reasoning i can say: no magatama on neck, so it can't be "Kurama Chakra Mode". let's call it New Chakra Mode then :D. ./ Rage gtx (talk) 15:24, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * I just realized that Naruto body pattern is most similar to Naruto's Kurama-Asura chakra avatar from second VotE fight. ./Rage gtx (talk) 16:06, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * @Rage gtx: The movie. Naruto had Sage Nine-Tailed Chakra Mode, with no horns. Pulling straight from the new, it's simply the complete Nine-Tailed Chakra Mode that we saw in the film, just now he has a cloak on that also starts to glow.--TheUltimate3 Akimichi Symbol.svg (talk) 16:09, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * @TheUltimate3, you understand that Naruto can't have horns with short hairs and evens so why horns are indicators of anything? He had them since gaining of Nine-Tails Chakra Mode. And then again when he uses Sage Nine-Tailed Chakra Mode he has eyelid pigmentation and skin glow ./Rage gtx (talk) 16:14, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * I always assumed the "horns" were made out of chakra, but if they were hair that may actually be the reason. As for his form in The Last, what was it that made everybody (myself included) assume that form was the incomplete "Nine-Tails Chakra Mode" rather than the complete "Kurama Mode"? It has the full black circles, the thick lines on his face, the slitted eyes, and he enters it when manifesting Kurama. The only thing it has in common with the first chakra mode is that its design is simpler, but that cold just be a stylistic choice. I haven't seen the movie yet, so was there anything in it that made people believe that?--BeyondRed (talk) 16:34, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * come on guys tell me youre not seriously pointing out that its his normal kurama mode just because hes missing 'horns' and stuff of course its gonna change and Its clearly his SPSM cause just the eyes indicate it already. BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 16:50, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * We don't just add our own speculative opinion to articles, that is really not how it works. Also, fix your signature, since it includes an unnecessary link and a useless date. --Sajuuk talk 16:53, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * Comparing to the image that Windy just showed it, it clearly looks like Kurama Mode Although we can't say he has glowing skin because the manga is B/W and the lack of pigmentation around his eyes does indicate it is Six Paths Sage Mode but as BeyondRed said we are differentiating it Kishimoto didn't differentiate like how we do, so it could mean that it is just the effect of power that Hagoromo gave so that's why he doesn't have pigmentation, no glowing skin etc. Horn aren't good indicator for differentiating the modes every mode has this, in SPSM it is small in length, last 3 TSB were lost in VOTE2 so no they are also not indicators.--Mecha Naruto (talk) 17:05, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * like i said the mode looks clearly like the SPSM how could it be a kurama chakra mode. When we al know that the only way we can differentiate KCM from SPSM in an uncolored chapter are the eyes and in this case the pigmentations out so obviously its SPSM right. BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 17:16, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * It looks like we already came to a compromise, it is reflected in articles and added that it is a mix of several modes. I agree it has Kurama mode designs no denying that (except the magatama and horn portion) but it also has characteristics of SPSM no pigmentation, so it is a mix of SPSM + KM.--Mecha Naruto (talk) 17:34, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * I still think its just Six Path Sage Mode, the difference from the War is now that Naruto has Kurama's full power behind him, instead of just Yin or Yang. More chakra from that would change the appearance. But it still has the traits of Six Path Sage Mode, no pigmentation around the eyes is a dead give away.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 18:21, May 21, 2015 (UTC)

No pigmentation can just mean he isn't using Senjutsu chakra. I mean, can you see his eyes well in the chapter?--Elve Talk Page 18:41, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, they are crossed, just like in Six Path Sage Mode. Six Path Sage Mode lacks pigmentation around the eyes, Elve.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 18:48, May 21, 2015 (UTC)
 * I know that, I was asking about the cross. Well if it's there, it's Six Paths Sage Mode without a doubt. Also as was stated, Truth Seeking Balls don't regenerate, he has used them up.--Elve Talk Page 18:52, May 21, 2015 (UTC)

Then that should settle it then, that its the six paths sage mode. BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 00:45, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Nope. Still undecided. 00:48, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * ughhhh. BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 00:50, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Also, just type in ~ to sign your posts. The rest is not necessary. 00:52, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * May I ask, where do we get the sense that all of his skin does not glow yellow? It's a black and white manga picture, for crying out loud. Again, look at his hands in the recent chapter and compare it to this image. His hands do indeed glow in the image, no?
 * Unfortunately, I foresee us debating this for days. I think it's best to say that he accessed a mode with characteristics of his Nine-Tails Chakra Mode, Kurama Mode, and Six Paths Sage Mode, rather than definitively picking which mode it is and ignoring characteristics of other modes. 01:09, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * wait what? BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 01:13, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Windstar, its obviously Six Path Sage Mode. Know why it has more characteristics to the other forms? He has more of Kurama's power than he had when he first obtained it. He's also changed his own appearance since then, he lost the 'horns' due to cutting his hair. The eyes show its Six Path Sage Mode. there's literally no debate.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 01:55, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * And the consensus seems to be that it IS Six Path Sage Mode, not the lower forms.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 01:58, May 22, 2015 (UTC)

But the rest of the body shows Kurama Mode, as I've shown with the image. 02:01, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Since he has more of Kurama's power than he had before. The full power of Kurama dwarfs the small pieces of the rest of the Tailed Beasts. And as people pointed out before, Six Path Sage Mode is the form that was first used against Madara, the cross eyes.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:03, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay? And his Tailed Beast Sage Mode also has cross eyes. 02:04, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * But that has the crucial pigmentation around the eyes. Tailed Beast Sage Mode has the Sage Mode pigmentation. Six Path Sage Mode lacks the pigmentation even with the chakra cloak.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:07, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * This is just going to go around in circles, I suppose. Hm... 02:09, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * From the looks of his mode, and appearance, He used Kurama beast mode, cause of the patterns on him, and the way he had the form look. If it was Nine tail Chakra mode, it could have looked like Minatos a bit where he had everything yellow. This is Kurama's mode.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 02:10, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Dude, the Kurama Tailed Beast Mode is just a normal or slitted pupil. Six Path Sage Mode has the cross pupil without the Sage Mode pigmentation around the eyes.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:15, May 22, 2015 (UTC)


 * Let me also point out that Kurama in some Manga translation states that Naruto was finally going to use Kurama's chakra to stretch and cut loose, plus remember, Kishimoto forgets to add details to a lot of things. — Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 02:16, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * So can we just agree its Six Path Sage Mode now? The traits of the eyes were the dead give away.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:17, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Or this is his new Six Path Sage Mode. What 'forgets details', its clearly Six Path Sage Mode. If there was no cross in the eyes, it would be just Kurama mode.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:20, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Kishimoto can forget to add more details, he done it before. But the mode resembles greatly of Kurama Tailed beast mode. From the patterns and all. It looks nothing like Sage Six path mode, as Naruto didn't have the patterns on the back like that form, he could have used the "normal" Form of the six path mode, where he had no pigmentation., but used Kurama tailed beast mode at the same time.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 02:25, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * ughh so do you mean that just cause a form changes you already imply it as KCM how may times should this be repeated, KCM shows the eye markings and SPSM dosent deal with it. BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 02:31, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * KingLinks, your comparison doesn't work. Looks nothing like Six Path Sage Mode? Six Path Sage Mode is just the eyes. Naruto was in Six Path Sage Mode in chapter 672. The trademark is the cross eyes WITHOUT the Sage Pigmentation around the eyes. This chapter showed the eyes having the cross pattern lacking Sage Pigmentation, the trait of Six Path Sage Mode. Thus, Six Path Sage Mode.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:32, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * I am saying as stated above before, that he could be using KCM with the SPSM Normal form that only involves the eyes, like when he fought Madara before all Yellow.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 02:36, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * And according to the databook, THAT form which he engaged Madara in was Six Path Sage Mode.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:40, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * I am not going against that, I am jsut saying he could be using both at the same time. IS that a problem to agree with? — Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 02:42, May 22, 2015 (UTC)

Either it's Kurama Mode with Sage Mode or Six Paths Sage Mode, not whatever you're suggesting. 02:43, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * And why can't it be both? It looks like it can.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 02:45, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * it cant be both cause what the KCM can do can also be done by SPSM but with greater powerBoltUzumakiXD (talk) 02:51, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * This is going to go on and on and on.... 02:52, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Windstar, it explicitly can't be Tailed Beast Sage Mode. The pigmentation lacking shows its Six Path Sage Mode utilizing Kurama's power.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 02:53, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Cool. 02:54, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Seeing how this will not end, I suppose the only thing to do is to wait for the next time he goes into that form, or Kishimoto tells us what it is. Because I thin kit can be both, due to KCM has more appearance to it than it being SPSM in the chakra cloak.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 02:55, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Look, do what you want, SuperSaiyaMan. You're much more willing to argue than I am, so go ahead. 02:56, May 22, 2015 (UTC)

Um, I never thought I would see this coming, but I completely agree with SuperSaiyanMan now. It's obviously SPSM.--Elve Talk Page 02:57, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * so what, we just go with KCM just cause he looks like his previous KCM form and just disregard the fact that he lacks the pigmentation which clearly indicates that its SPSM?! come on BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 03:02, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Call it SPSM with KCM chakra cloak, cause the cloak looks of it.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 03:04, May 22, 2015 (UTC)

Are you guys purposely disregarding what was said? The cloak isn't indicative of SPSM, the eyes are.--Elve Talk Page 03:06, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * What I am trying to say, It is SPSM, with KCM chakra cloak.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 03:08, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * sigh* it cant be like that one cant be joined with the other cause the SPSM is already the greatly enhanced form of KCM it would pe really ridiculous if you think that the two are in the form togetherBoltUzumakiXD (talk) 03:10, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * And yet the the chakra cloak looks nothing on how it's suppose to, but seeing I can't make both sides agree, I give up, I'll wait for the next time he jumps into that form.— Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 03:12, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * *sigh* why cant people just accept the obvious evidence of it being SPSM *sigh* BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 03:14, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Because SPSM not an entrenchment of KCM, it's its own form that Naruto can use and allows him to go to his tailed beast chakra mode because Kurama was his only true tailed beast. SPSM is the Sage's power, not Kurama's, Kurama is with the power due to naruto being with it now. But of course no one will listen because "eye is the answer" When the cloak is no where near what it needs to look like. So I stil suggest it being a SPSM with KCM cloak around it. But of course, with facts pointed on how the SPSM needs to look like, I can't argue much. IT has no truth seeing ball, nor the Rinnegan on the back of the cloak. So What ever, It's completely SPSM, and the cloak as well. SO as I said to make it easier it is SPSM but with KCM Chakra cloak appearance. Because SPSM Chakra cloak looks nothing like it did in the Manga. — Kinglink15 (Kinglink15) 03:20, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * then the simpiest explanation is that the mode changes just like how TBSM changed from the war to the last naruto the movie. And about the rinnegan marking on the back, he transformed his cloak which approbabbly altered the markings BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 03:26, May 22, 2015 (UTC)

The Rinnegan-like pattern on Naruto's back was the Six Paths Ten-Tails Coffin Seal that Obito applied on Naruto to seal Shukaku and Gyuki's chakras into him. Naruto replaced the seal with a different one by the time of The Last, hence why there's no Rinnegan like pattern on his back anymore, use head people.--Elve Talk Page 03:35, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * wait wait. Since when did naruto changed the seal onhis back or rather how did u know he replaced it? BoltUzumakiXD (talk) 03:39, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Observation and filling the gaps.--Elve Talk Page 04:30, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Isn't it just Kurama Mode with Senjutsu influence? Just look at his arms. In Kurama Mode, his arms have markings, in Six Paths Sage Mode - they don't. In 704, the arms had markings. Also, in SPSM, Naruto's outfit, with the exception of the cloak, becomes black, in Kurama's Mode - only his top part becomes black, with the lines going through the lower part. Based on these descriptions, I looks to be more like Kurama-enhanced Nine-Tails Chakra Mode. Even the seal is different. In Kurama Chakra Mode it's a circle within a circle, same in 704, while in Six Paths Sage Mode it's a plain circle xD--Omojuze (talk) 06:15, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * While I do believe Elve pulled that straight out his ass (Ten-Tailed Coffin Seal sealing pieces of the One and Eight-Tails. Okay then.) the lack of the Six Paths Senjutsu mark is interesting, but at the same time he does lack the pigmentation of the eyes that denotes normal Sage Mode. Of course then there's the added fact that Kurama specifically stated "Hey glad you're actually using me again." and we know Naruto using Kurama's chakra = Nine-Tails Chakra Mode.
 * So instead of letting this pissing match continue further, I say we end this debate because until we see Naruto in that form and in color we're never going to know exactly which form he's in and just stick it under Nine-Tails Chakra Mode like we did every form he's got that seems derived from it.--TheUltimate3 Akimichi Symbol.svg (talk) 09:46, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Or we just name it as combined form of Kurama Mode+Six Paths Sage Mode which is his powerful new mode, KM (design-see circle and legs), SPSM (no pigmentation around eyes) I see people arguing that there can't be both, of course it can it is powerful form than just normal Kurama mode or lone SPSM, @TU3 I don't see any resemblance to Nine-Tails Chakra Mode The lines are thick he got three thick whiskers and you do know Kurama mode is upgrade for NTCM, when Kurama is inside him he can give large amount of chakra for Kurama mode because now there is no seal and it was removed by Naruto.--Mecha Naruto (talk) 10:47, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * 2 Things.
 * 1) He's glowing. That's about the bare minimum of Nine-Tails Chakra Mode. As I said, we won't know exactly what that form is until we see it in color, but at the very least we have an article that can serve as a "base", where all his forms are located anyway.
 * 2) There is a seal, that's why the Nine-Tails is still in Naruto. The fact that the Nine-Tails is nolonger "locked in a cage" is the new circular opening on his stomach, which opened up the first time we saw him in Tailed Beast Mode (ignore the image in the infobox, that is an anime mistake. The one further down from the game is more accurate.)--TheUltimate3 Akimichi Symbol.svg (talk) 10:57, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay then. Agreed, it should be under Nine-Tails Chakra Mode article.--Mecha Naruto (talk) 11:10, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Still ignoring that Six Paths Sage Mode is the crossed eyes without pigment disregarding cloak. The cloak is dependent on the seal used.--Elve Talk Page 11:54, May 22, 2015 (UTC)

? 19:49, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * To me, the fact Naruto's pupil are in a cross shape with no pigmentation around the eyes is proof enough he's using Six Paths Sage Mode. I agree it's weird that there are no Rinnegan and magatama on his back, but unless you want to say that Naruto can now enter Sage Mode with no pigmentation (which doesn't sound possible, according to Fukasaku ), well…--JOA2020:08, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * Naruto was in Sage Mode the chapter before and you could clearly see the pigmentation. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 20:22, May 22, 2015(UTC)

Did you guys ever consider that the Sage only gave Naruto Six Paths chakra. Naruto mixed that with sage mode to make Six Paths Sage Mode. That's not the chakra cloak, that's what Naruto had right before he equipped the cloak The reason the chakra cloak looks different against Madara is because he had the other tailed beasts chakra or because he only had Yin-Kurama, which altered the appearance. So since he only has full Kurama, it's just Kurama mode with Six paths sage mode activated, hence the lack of sage markings.Riptide240 (talk) 21:21, May 22, 2015 (UTC)
 * BumpRiptide240 (talk) 00:19, May 23, 2015 (UTC)

What don't people get? SPSM ISN'T the cloak, it's crossed eyes without pigment. According to databook Naruto was using that form while he kicked Madara's TSB and that was without any cloak, point is, don't look at the cloak to determine if it is or isn't SPSM since it has no relevance because it is SPSM even without any cloak.--Elve Talk Page 12:56, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * Exactly, and during his fight with Sasuke, Sasuke said that he was running out of the TB chakras. So now that it's been years after, he's most likely using SPSM, but his cloak is Kurama Mode since he only has full Kurama now.Riptide240 (talk) 13:06, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * No one seems to care the articles have it wrong and what the databooks say, but oh well.--Elve Talk Page 14:58, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * I changed it on Naruto's page but....whateverRiptide240 (talk) 15:01, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * @Riptide240 and you changed wrong. In chapter 692 Sage stated about TB chakra being in Naruto, so with it, your edits are no good. ./ Rage gtx (talk) 15:28, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * Nope, look a few chapters after, Sasuke said they were beginning to fade away or that he was running out. Obviously, that was after the Sage said that so....Riptide240 (talk) 15:43, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * This was not about it, Sasuke compared his 8TB + half Kurama to Naruto's portions and half Kurama saing he has more and mentoned Naruto running low on chakra(not TB's overall) wich he had, you just making things up. ./ Rage gtx (talk) 17:43, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * No, you're ignorant. In chapter 696, Sasuke specifically says that he's running low on the chakra he recieved from the bijuus Riptide240 (talk) 18:32, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * So it's me ignorant lol, and not you who by simple running low on the chakra accusation(he can for exapmle run low on Kurama chakra so why he never lost - answer is simple chakra regenerates) decided that Naruto lost all TB chakra? Or even more funny wikia got rid of all TB mentions in SPSM page since we don't have any evidence of that. So you to know, you are speculating on Naruto's TB by saing he has lost it(we don't know), by your edit you create a contradiction(by saing that TB chakra affect Naruto's SPSM). And i am the one who is ignorant, seriously? ./ Rage gtx (talk) 18:51, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, because what happens to something that runs low?, it runs out!!!! How hard is that to understand. Not to mention that in 700+4, Kurama says your finally using ME after all this time??? How much simpler does it have to get? Not to mention that we only see Kurama in there.....noone else. Suspicious much?Riptide240 (talk) 19:07, May 23, 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay, this has gone on long enough now. Find something more interesting to discuss, instead of going around in circles with no end in sight. --Sajuuk talk 19:10, May 23, 2015 (UTC)