Board Thread:Naruto Discussions/@comment-34656247-20181008062436/@comment-34194151-20181010042844

@LegionZero

Having help =/=him needing it. I didn't see any signs of naruto or killer bee helping itachi land the blade, that was itachi soloing. you are probably referring to the chibaku tensei, but again, this is a common fallacy that some people use. Just because they used teamwork doesn't mean they are doomed without working together. Itachi literally has no way of calculating the minimum damage needed to destroy that core, so he did the wise thing which is pool all their energies together. Killer bee didn't even go all out, he fired one bijuu dama and we know he is capable of firing more than one. Itachi by himself would just throw as many yakasa matagama as it takes for that core to be destroyed. then smokecreen happens, then nagato gets soloed by the blade as per canon. I also believe minato can defeat nagato, so together itachi minato win without any issue.

I suggest you reread the panel where Orochimaru got stabbed. He clearly got stabbed in between words. the words "defeat" and you" are linked by a dash mark. Clearly indicating those panels are linked in time. That means no more than a second passed, because that is the speed of human speech. Orochimaru was also clearly surprised by being stabbed, as his facial expression was surprised and he also had a question mark in his speech bubble that indicated surprise. Orochimaru couldn't react in the first place. Your description is out of order. he only realized he was screwed after being hit.

I see no reason to believe that characters below A4 are lightning levels of speed. Reflexes, sure. but not actual running speed. You have to be faster than ayy to reach those speeds. Might guy and ridoku characters are probably the only ones at that level of speed. Kakashi, choji and chouza thought the 5 second interval between shinra tensei from deva path was almost unexploitable.

You severely underestimate the length of the totsuka blade. Relook at that chapter nagato got stabbed and then re-consider how long that blade is. Itachi, killer bee, and naruto are all about the size of nagato's head, that's how far away they are, and the blade seems to continue in length as it comes out of the page towards the reader.

Tsyukyomi won't kill hashirama but he isn't dodging the totsuka blade while he is caught in it. minato can distract hashirama with FTG level 2 and itachi can then use tsykuyomi and totsuka blade to finish him.

I don't see your point. Kakashi and itachi both improved in speed over the timeskip, and kakashi couldn't even overwhelm 30 percent itachi in speed. I have no reason to believe the speed difference between them has changed.

I never said Pain is slow, but he is certainly slower than both itachi and minato based on feats. Itachi can easily react to kakashi's raikiri imo, so I don't see how that puts pain in the same speed tier as itachi.

You are underestimating itachi's speed and tactics. People seem to forget for whatever reason that itachi overlays attacks when he is fighting. He keeps you guessing about how many moves he has made. Not only is there a noticeable speed difference in every way between him and the pains, i have no reason to believe the pains can react to a totuska blade blitz faciilated by a bunshin feint. Itachi has shown the ability to place clones behind his opponents in the heat of battle. Summons won't come into play. Here is why. The 6 paths of pain take a T- formation when they fight. Naraka stands in back, human path and animal path stand in front, and preta path stands in front of all them. then ashura path and deva path stand to the left and right of preta path to maximize defense and offense at the front of the formation. Meaning, at least 3 of the pains are standing one behind the other. that means at least 3 pains are dying at the start of the fight. If edo nagato who is faster than the pains can't react to the totsuka blade with preta path, then why would a slower version be able to react?

-Match starts, 16 meters away from each other. Itachi forms susano'o, and it takes a second for the the fully armored version to form. nagato uses summoning jutsu and a rhino starts running at him. unfortunately for pain, Itachi forms exploding shadow clone behind the naraka path just like he did to kakashi. Nagato senses it, naraka tries to counter-attack with a rod. itachi is faster and better at taijutsu, so he outmanuevers it and kills it with kunai. the other pains look back. when that happens, the totsuka blitzes through the rhino, and 3 of the other pains standing behind it one behind the other are dead. 4 down. deva and ashura left. the shadow clone blitzes towards deva as the other 3 pains are being sealed away and rhino are being sealed away. deva uses shinra tensei, cause the clone to explode. 5 second cool down begins. Itachi uses amaterasu on ashura path, after distracting it first with a katon. any lasers it fires would be blocked with ease by susano'o. then has like 2-3 seconds left to finish off the deva path. Yata mirror should be able to protect him from a massive shinra tensei in the event deva uses that as a last resort. That is all well within itachi's stamina range, and that is sick itachi. sick itachi used 3 shadow clones, multiple amaterasu, tsykuyomi, and then susano'o in the same day before he died. Healthy itachi is just fine to accomplish this. With minato as back up, its honestly no contest.

My point about naruto still stands. he outsmarted the pain's formation by overlaying attacks and using deception with bunshin feints and fake rasenshurikens, which is on the order of itachi's bread and butter when it comes to tactics as well.