Board Thread:Naruto Discussions/@comment-26107879-20181004003653/@comment-6769189-20181202112615

CombatIQmatters wrote: @LegionZero Context. Obito was talking about his phasing speed. It's a battle of speed because once obito senses an attack, he can phase borderline instantly. Minato needs his FTG level 2, his fastest attack, in order to combat that effectively. That is a very different thing then running speed. there is zero evidence that they were using their top speed there. They were standing what? 18 feet away? Minato throws his kunai and then teleports to it like a few seconds after. Using your top running speed is also not critical if you have ever watched a boxing match or karate. If both characters are willing to come in close to each other for Close quarters combat, then running at your top speed is irrelevant because the fight switches to combat speed. Cool and all but this isnt a boxing or karate match. There was much more at stake and Minato's best/quickest win method would be to get behind Obito and get hit on him, which he needed FTG for. Because Obito could read his movements and keep up with them.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Like I said, be consistent. why didn't obito run circles into might guy's blind spot if he is as fast as minato? Having minato's running speed means you are faster than the 3 previous hokages. With that speed, base guy would have been warped away without any issue. Because he was screwing with Guy, Naruto, Kakashi, and Bee the whole time. He wasnt the least bit concerned about any of them.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Guy chased him down and stalemated him in CQC. On some realness, chapters.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Obito was never shown to be as fast as minato. He was when he and Minato fought and Minato couldnt speed blitz him or pull some "super speed suddenly appear behind the enemy" thing. If Minato was faster he would have been able to get around Obito or strike Obito without Obito realizing it.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Why isn't he running circles around Fuu and Torune? He punked them what are you talking about?

CombatIQmatters wrote:

why isn't he shit blitzing base kabuto? Chapter?

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Yes they are on the clock, which means there is no time for mistakes. Every second of analysis counts, and minato can't afford to be zipping around at his top speed when he doesn't understand the mechanics of kamui. He did understand the mechanics of Kamui, he analyzed it when he first swung at Obito and phased right through him.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

He needs to be close to obito when he intiates ftg level 2 otherwise obito would have time to phase out. He needed to bait obito into materializing and he can't do that if he was zipping through obito at blistering speed, tunnel vision at all. FTG doesn't cause tunnel vision because it's instantenous movement. If he was faster than Obito then Obito wouldnt have time to react and activate Kamui or even see Minato once Minato moved out of his line of sight. Zipping around into his blind spots and sneaking an attack is actually one of the best bets.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

The notion that raikiri boosts speed comes with a plethora of inconsistencies. Again, let's take a look at kakazu. Shikamaru was fast enough to escape kakazu's suprise attack. Izumo and kotetsu "kept up" with that same kakazu in speed. That same kakazu intercepted kakashi's raikiri before he could finish hidan. So now shikamaru is as fast as kakashi when he is wielding rakiri? izmuo and kotetsu are as fast raikiri kakashi because they ran at kakazu with the same speed and covering the same distance?Something is clearly amiss. They didnt keep up with him. In fact the 1st thing they did was stop him from moving his feet and he just punked them with some midrange stuff

Shikamaru managed to dodge the initial attack but after that Kakuzu was going to merc him before he could get up off the ground and he needed to be saved by Asuma.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Second of all, Minato should be faster than kakashi in running speed, raikiri or not, yet he does not experience tunnel vision, and last I checked base minato doesn't have any enhanced sensory abilities or a sharingan, so that also debunks that he was using his top speed against obito. why would minato do the very same thing he told kakashi never to do again if his life, his family, his village are all on the line against "madara uchiha" Because Minato's senses have grown alongisde his speed. Chidori's speed boost is not something the user would be accustomed to.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Of course he was gauging madara's abilities. Minato only knows of what madara can do from the legends, and clearly "madara" is immortal because he is still alive. He has no idea what "madara" is capable of in terms of jutsu and techniques, so he has to analyze. Minato knew dick all about A and his abilities and the 1st thing he did was go for the kill. He knew dick all about Bees abilities but he decided to taunt him.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Like I said, kcm naruto should have been running circles around him if he is using his top speed... By your own logic he should have been able to blitz slap roshi, not trade blows. Why not blitz into his blind spot and wack him in the head with rasengan, then pull the rod out while roshi is stunned/injured? What blind spot? His vision was connected to 5 other people and when Naruto was in the middle of mercing him one of the other Edo-jin sucker punched him. In a one-on-one he would have beat them easy, but the environment+their shared vision prevented that from happening.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

My point about sasuke and naruto is that it debunks the claim that the characters always use their top speed. Sasuke is completely irrelevant if naruto's goal is to use his absolute top speed. Forget amaterasu, leave sasuke in the dust, and charge at juubito with the rasenshuriken using his "yellow flash speed" Clearly, there are circumstances where the characters opt not to use their top speed. It wasnt his goal to use his top speed at that time. His goal was to cooporate and communicate with Sasuke

CombatIQmatters wrote:

As for handsigns, I can easily debunk this. Chapter 332 pg 11. We know for a fact Doton: domu requires at least one earth style handsign, yet he activates it with no shown handsign. Fast forward, and when the plot required it, we can see his hand seals when kakashi is watching him use it to protect himself from choji's attack. The characters can weave seals really fast and it's not always shown for cinematic purposes. Not debunked. It was explained on page 333 that he is fast enough that it typically cant be seen.

Ch 308 p5: Sasuke activated Chidori Nagashi while Naruto held one hand

Ch 308 p 7: Sasuke flows Chidori into his sword while holding said sword

Ch 348 p12: Kakashi activates Chidori with no hand signs

Ch 358 p5: Sasuke activates Chidori and then used Sharp Spear while holding his sword in one hand.

Ch 411 p17: B channels lightning chakra into his sword while holding 7 other swords

Ch 412 p3: Sasuke activates Chidori without even lifting his hand from the ground

A's Lightning armor doesnt even use handsigns. The series has made made it chlear that Chidori/Raikiri can be done without hand signs and implies that a variety of lightning jutsu dont beed hand signs.

There are more insances but im honestly bored of scanning damn near the whole manga to find it.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Furthermore, it's a piercing move. Piercing moves benefit from increased speed to ensure you stab through your opponent for a certain kill. But without a sharingan, if your opponent reacts your screwed. Punches, tackles, slashes etc etc, 90% of moves benefit from speed, Chidori is not special

I dont know how many times i have to say this but Chidori is shown capable of piercing just about whatever without running. The series has never said the speed increases its peircing power and has never shown less peircing power without a run.

The only thing i recall the series stating about the purpose of the speed is that it is to try to completely bypass reaction time.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

There is no evidence that sasuke is as fast as v1 ay. They both charged at each other and sasuke used his sharingan for combat speed to dodge the elbow. Ayy tanked chidori so that he could then transition into a body slam, because sasuke's hand was lodged into his body. They were legit swapping hands and A didnt start dominating Sasuke until going V2.

CombatIQmatters wrote:

Want more proof the characters don't use their top speed always? Killer bee shunshined across a mountain when he attempted to escape and jugo didn't even notice. yet the whole rest of time they were fighting bee wasn't "running circles" around them, proving my point that using your top speed isn't always applicable in the heat of battle. Bee wasnt taking them seriously. If he was he would have started his fight with his Bijuu abilities.

Ninja Of War wrote:

Not quite, Obito predicted the slash(MS) and knew he should counter after he used Kamui intangibility, with Kamui warping. All he had to do was reach out his hand and time the grab(closing his hand). Which he could gauge before since he knows Minato. There is no foot-speed involved. Predicted? The series established that the Sharingan is useless if the the user is too slow to react properly to an opponant back in the Chunnin Exams arc.

LegionZero wrote:

My point was that Minato was gauging Kamui then. He had already analyzed Kamui after his hand slipped through Obito.

If he wanted to guage Kamui he would throw things at him or use a shadow clone, not run face first and then get cought off guard. If those chains were like barbed wire or razor wire or if Obito decided to crush his throat he would be dead.