User talk:Omnibender/Elemental recomposition table

Oil
Fire + Earth + Water = Oil release. I know Jiraiya used oil and he turned chakra into oil. With Kishi rectoning Amatersu into Blaze and Deidara's techs into collaborative Explosion and Earth its possible Jiraiya could have been using an elemental nature.Water And Earth creates a solution which is then give combustable properties through fire aka oil. I know Jiraiya didn't use and Water element tech but he knew enough to teach someone else about it.Umishiru (talk) 07:26, February 21, 2011 (UTC)

Blood Release
have u ever thought about a blood release as a possible three element combo possibly like water-yin-yang or as water-yin/yang-and another element. u know prolly something with water 01:38, February 25, 2011 (UTC)Muguruma69 (talk)
 * I have thought about it, but I'm a bit conflicted over the idea. My current idea for water + yin + yang is ocean, but that maybe too similar to wave, which I use as yang + water in the two element combinations. I can see how the three can make blood, and it sort of makes sense, but there's this unease about it. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 22:13, February 25, 2011 (UTC)

Triple Elements
I like the triple elemental combinations you came up with so far. I don't know if you need it, but here's some help on the names:


 * and.
 * and.
 * and.
 * Technically 炭 means charcoal (also written as 木炭, mokutan), but it can also be used for all kinds of coal. Normal coal is usually called.
 * and.
 * 汞 is a rather uncommon kanji for mercury, but still used in certain compound words and it's the standard word for mercury in Chinese. It's pronounced as 'mizugane' on its own. 水銀 literally means 'water silver' and the kanji you're using for mercury at the moment is simply the kanji for silver.
 * and.
 * and.
 * and.
 * and.
 * and.
 * and if you mean the drinks or  if you mean the basic substance.
 * and.
 * Just wanted to add this: and.
 * and.
 * For star, I personally prefer over, but that's just my personal preference. 星 is more poetic, but also more broadly defined, as it can refer to practically any celestial body.

—ShounenSuki (talk 11:32, March 5, 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks. I already had some of those, but you did point out some stuff I didn't have. The one I intend to use is 石炭 indeed, because it's mineral coal, not the you get by heating wood. The uncommon kanji for mercury is welcome. I do mean the substance in alcohol's case, though I can see the nature being used to make beverages as well. I think I'll stay with flesh, since that incorporates muscle as well as other soft tissues. I specifically used the more narrow term for star because I want to focus on the plasma of it. I originally had this as Plasma Release, but then someone pointed out I could use star. The combinations I'm having most difficulty with are the ones with lightning, yang, and wind. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 16:14, March 5, 2011 (UTC)
 * Glad I could help. I would like to point out, though, that since 心 can also be translated as 'heart', it is now finally possible to summon Captain Planet ^^
 * Also, would you like some icons with your new elements? —ShounenSuki (talk 00:22, March 6, 2011 (UTC)
 * "By your powers combined, I am Captain Planet!". Make them only as you're willing to make. Ideas on stuff with wind, lightning, or yang (the most problematic ones) are also welcome. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:24, March 6, 2011 (UTC)
 * Not bad idea, the Captain Planet thing. Wind-Yin-Yang combination could be Spirit or Soul Release since you already have health, mind, flesh, and blood. Deva Path and 3 of the 5 treasures manipulate the soul. --Sorrel (talk) 07:01, March 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * The problem with soul is that there are (I think) various kanji for it, and several can also mean other things. I also want to have a good reasoning for that, and so far what I can come up with is unsatisfactory for my standard. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 17:03, March 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * I glad you like the icons ^^ If you're looking for a nice kanji for soul, 魂 is the most common one. 霊 is mroe related to the deceased. —ShounenSuki (talk 18:48, March 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * Will probably use it, but I still need to come up with a viable reasoning for the combination. Is there some cultural connection between wind/air and the soul in the Japanese culture? I know the kanji used for Gas Release can also mean spirit. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:34, March 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * Not really, as far as I know. 風 can be used for concepts like manners, customs, and style — e.g. and  — but that's about as close as you can get. I do think that 魂 encompasses these concepts, though. Although similar to the English words spirit and soul, 魂 and 霊 have very unique meanings. Read this for more detailed info. —ShounenSuki (talk 20:06, March 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * So it's something that kinda reminds one from habit/personality. I see there's also a relation with the word soul that three of the tools used by Kinkaku and Ginkaku use to curse and seal others. Yeah, I'm using it. Just a question before I add it. 魂遁 would be Konton or Gonton? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 20:12, March 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * Konton. —ShounenSuki (talk 20:24, March 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * You might find this interesting:
 * There's a word for soul in Japanese,, that is written with 魂 — the kanji we talked about above — and 魄, which is a kanji that means roughly the same as 魂. However, both have a subtle difference to them. 魂 is said to refer to that part of the soul that governs the mind — the Yang energy — whereas 魄 refers to that part of the soul that governs the body — the Yin energy. —ShounenSuki (talk 20:38, March 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * So, in a way, Kishimoto may have switched some characteristics from Yin and Yang? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:18, March 9, 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, odd isn't it? I wonder if it was a mistake or done on purpose... Here's a little list from the Japanese Wikipedia, showing some examples of the duality of Yin and Yang:
 * {| border="1" cellspacing="1" class="wikitable"

!　!Yin !Yang !Fundamental characteristics !Inclination !Function !Movement !Oscillation !Direction !Location !Weight !Light intensity !Humidity !Density !Form !Shape !Sense of touch !Particles !Chemical elements !Enviroment !Climate !Biological characteristics !Sex !Respiration !Organ structure !Nerves !reinforce/reduce (acupuncture) !Attitude, sensitivity !Work !Culture !Dimension !In-/exterior !Martial arts !Battle !Orientation !Spouses !Parents !Sides !Heavenly bodies !Weather !Day/night !Heaven/Earth !Temperature !Numbers !Business !State of affairs !Human beings !Mathematics !Spring/Autumn !Summer/Winter !East/West !North/South !Back/abdomen !Emotions !Internal organs !Human body structure !Portions !Height !Sound pitch, tone !Light/dark !Mountains !Rivers
 * centripetal force
 * centrifugal force
 * contraction
 * expansion
 * scattering, dispersion, disassembly, separation
 * adhesion, assimilation, gathering, formation
 * lethargic, slow
 * vigorous, quick
 * short wave, high frequency
 * long wave, low frequency
 * descending, horizontal
 * ascending, vertical
 * inside, centre
 * outside, circumference
 * heavy
 * light
 * dark (dim light, moonlight)
 * bright (bright light, sunlight)
 * damp
 * dry
 * dense
 * thin
 * small
 * large
 * deflating
 * expanding
 * hard
 * soft
 * electrons
 * protons
 * nitrogen, oxygen, phosphorus, calcium, etc.
 * hydrogen, carbon, sodium, arsenic, magnesium, etc.
 * waves　―　air　―
 * ―　water　―　earth
 * cold climate
 * tropical climate
 * plant
 * animal
 * female
 * male
 * exhalation
 * inhalation
 * solid organs, condensing
 * Hollow organs, swelling
 * central nerves, parasympathetic nerves
 * peripheral nerves, sympathetic nerves
 * reinforce
 * reduce
 * calm, negative/unmotivated, defensive
 * active, positive/assertive, offensive
 * physical, social
 * psychological, mental
 * material
 * mental
 * space
 * time
 * interior
 * exterior
 * gentle
 * strong
 * Defence
 * Offence
 * below, behind, right
 * above, front, left
 * wife
 * husband
 * mother
 * father
 * reverse
 * obverse
 * Moon (Great Yin)
 * Sun (Great Yang)
 * rain
 * clear
 * night
 * day
 * Earth
 * Heaven
 * cold
 * warm
 * even
 * odd
 * loss
 * profit
 * quiet
 * changing
 * Body
 * Spirit (mind)
 * - (negative)
 * + (positive)
 * Autumn
 * Spring
 * Summer
 * Winter
 * West
 * East
 * North
 * South
 * abdomen
 * back
 * constraint
 * excitement
 * Five (six) zàng: liver, heart, spleen, lungs, kidneys (and pericardium)
 * The six (five) fǔ: gall bladder, small intestine, stomach, large intestine, urinary bladder (and Sān Jiāo)
 * skin, bones
 * muscles
 * lower part
 * top part
 * low
 * high
 * low
 * high
 * light
 * dark
 * north
 * south
 * south
 * north
 * }
 * —ShounenSuki (talk 10:16, March 9, 2011 (UTC)


 * If I didn't know Yin-Yang applied to so many things, I'd say that this list fails to grasp to show "little". Still, there's stuff here I never heard of. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 17:49, March 9, 2011 (UTC)
 * Yin–Yang applies to everything. It is what the Universe is made of. —ShounenSuki (talk 20:37, March 9, 2011 (UTC)
 * Taking this table into consideration, I'd say coming up with properties and ideas will be far simpler, well, at least for the Yin and Yang combos. Vik0z0z (talk) Kami da! 13:52, March 13, 2011 (UTC)

Wind and earth combination
Man, it's annoying to see that empty spot for the wind-earth combination >< How about something that combines wind with the ability of Earth chakra to change how hard or soft something is? Perhaps a wind that can make anything it touches brittle, soft, or dull, pliable or hard? —ShounenSuki (talk 17:46, June 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh I already have something in that spot. You need to take a raw look at it to see. It's one of the combinations I speculate on the most in the page. I hope Kishimoto will confirm it in coming chapters. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 01:12, June 8, 2011 (UTC)
 * Ah, of course. Te be honest, I still believe that's the best solution as well. Especially considering Dust Release. I even made an icon for it a long time ago already ^^ —ShounenSuki (talk 10:11, June 8, 2011 (UTC)

Fire, Water, and Yang.
Could this make steam release? Because when fire and water come together, steam happens, and yang is like making things more powerful... That's just what I was thinking. And would Mirror Release be like genjutsu? I think it sounds like a really cool idea. --Ampm123 (talk) 23:22, June 9, 2011 (UTC)Ampm123
 * I'm not considering steam as an option since Han is already known to use it, and his isn't even implied to be an element. I haven't imagined any of the combinations in this page as genjutsu. I see Mirror Release as something that can be used in many ways, though the easiest ways which come to mind are defensive and supplementary. I have one idea for fire, water, and yang, but I haven't put it down yet because I hope to find a better alternative, since the one I thought up doesn't sound very offensive, it looks like a element version of medical ninjutsu, something like hot springs, since Yang Release has to do with energy and life. I tried finding something liquid and powerful, kinda like napalm, but nothing seems to fit, and when it sort of does, there's no native word in Japanese for it. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:44, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

I like the hot spring idea. And the reason I thought Mirror Release would be a genjutsu is because like one person would use a mirror release move, and the opponent would like see there self in the "mirror" and it would make an illusion... But that's just what I thought. Thanks for replying. --Ampm123 (talk) 00:14, June 10, 2011 (UTC)Ampm123

Mirrors do have a ring about illusions don't they? One example of what I think would be a good portrayal of Mirror Release is imprisoning something that is reflected in the mirror. In some cultures, mirrors show one's soul, and when someone dies, reflective surfaces are covered so the deceased one's soul isn't caught by accident and is able to move on. Negating an attack by doing the same with a Mirror Release technique is one example of what I think it can do. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:35, June 10, 2011 (UTC)

I never knew about the soul not moving on, that's really cool. I really like all your combonations on the table. --Ampm123 (talk) 01:38, June 10, 2011 (UTC)Ampm123

Lightning Yin fire...Power release?
I dont know about your power release theory... I mean raiton its self is power. You shouldnt wast this spot on Power Release, I think you should make something better. Im not forcing your I just think power release is really really lame.And I dont think thats even close to what masashi would say. Ill try to give you scientific ideas for other elements to.--Black-Light (talk) 05:16, June 12, 2011 (UTC)Black-Light
 * I'm not saying power as in electric power. I'm saying power as in work performance rate or energy conversion rate. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 05:25, June 12, 2011 (UTC)

The Original Techniques
I came across this article on the Japanese Wikipedia and I thought you might be interested. It's about the techniques that the elemental jutsu from Naruto were based on. Below is the translation. —ShounenSuki (talk 01:25, June 17, 2011 (UTC)

Tonjutsu
Within ninjutsu, are techniques used to hide or escape from the enemy. Also called the, there are a total of thirty techniques, consisting of the , the , and the.

Ten Methods of Heavenly Escapes
Methods using the weather to escape. To effectively use these, a ninja must be trained in telling what the weather will be from the look of the sky.
 * : Utilising the sun. For example: blinding the enemy by having the sun in your back.
 * : Utilising the moon. For example: taking the opportunity to escape when the moon is hidden behind clouds.
 * : Utilising the stars.
 * : Utilising the clouds.
 * : Utilising mist. For example: Advancing when heavy fog causes a poor field of vision.
 * : Utilising thunder. For example: predicting a thundercloud and using the diversion of the thunder to do reconnaissance.
 * : Utilising electricity. For example: taking the opportunity to escape when the enemy is caused to falter by static electricity.
 * : Utilising the wind.
 * : Utilising rain. For example: Waiting for an evening shower to cause a poor field of vision before escaping.
 * : Utilising snow. For example: preparing a special outfit designed to protect against the cold, so you can escape during a blizzard.

Ten Methods of Earthly Escapes
Methods using objects and the terrain to escape.
 * : Utilising wood. For example: making timber that is leaning against something fall down.
 * : Utilising grass. For example: binding up grass to someone stumble.
 * : Utilising fire. For example: causing a fire.
 * : Utilising smoke. For example: raising a smokescreen.
 * : Utilising earth. For example: throwing earth at the opponent.
 * : Utilising buildings. For example: taking refuge under the floor.
 * : Utilising money. For example: coiling up money and escape while the enemy is picking it up.
 * : Utilising stones. For example: hitting the opponent with stones.
 * : Utilising water. For example: averting the opponent by grabbing their attention, especially with the sound of water.
 * : Utilising hot water. For example: throwing boiling water at the enemy.

Ten Methods of Human Escapes
Methods using humans and animals to escape.
 * : Utilising the male gender.
 * : Utilising the female gender.
 * : Utilising aged people. For example: as disguise.
 * : Utilising children. For example: using a child as a decoy.
 * : Utilising people of high social status.
 * : Utilising people of low social status.
 * : Utilising birds. For example: using a falcon as a decoy.
 * : Utilising animals. For example: causing a horse act violently to raise an uproar.
 * : Utilising insects, reptiles, and amphibians. For example: throwing a snake at someone.
 * : Utilising fish.

Awesome. What exactly is the "hot water" one? I had this idea for fire, water, and yang, sort of hot spring, associating yang to healing baths and all, but I never actually listed because it doesn't feel like it has any offensive potential. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:07, June 17, 2011 (UTC)


 * The 'hot water' one is . The same as in Hidan's hometown Yugakure. It's the same word that gave rise to the ゆ sign often seen on onsen and the same kanji used in.
 * I personally don't see why an element should necessarily have mainly offensive potential. Defensive and supplementary potential can be just as handy. Still, hot water can hurt like hell, trust me. —ShounenSuki (talk 02:35, June 17, 2011 (UTC)


 * Is there another similar kanji for hot water or spring which would include that meaning? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:55, June 18, 2011 (UTC)


 * I think 湯 already carries the healing aspect enough, if that's what you mean. One of the first things a native Japanese person would think of when seeing 湯 is onsen and healing baths. —ShounenSuki (talk 01:08, June 18, 2011 (UTC)


 * Similar to 灼熱, is there an equivalent expression using "scalding"? Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 03:27, June 18, 2011 (UTC)


 * There's and . —ShounenSuki (talk 14:00, June 18, 2011 (UTC)

Magnetism Release.
I am guessing Wind + Lightning or Earth + Lighting.Umishiru (talk) 15:11, July 6, 2011 (UTC)
 * Same. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:34, July 6, 2011 (UTC)
 * I know it's a bit farfetched, but Earth and Wind could be a possible combination, not just out of convenience because you need it. Electricity can travel through the electrons in air molecules (and obviously metal, ie: gold, copper, etc.) which is the common day shock that we get when near televisions or door knobs. Their ability to manipulate metal may actually be connected to positively charged minitature barriers around certain objects and/or the air around them, and the 'spark' would be more like converted chakra, similar to Tsunade-sama's Ranshinshou technique. Just food for though. 68.98.148.216 (talk) 02:20, July 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * In Naruto, Lighting is generated by the lighting element, otherwise it would be a derivate of another element like in The Last Airbender, since that is the case the magnetic properties are mostly likely generated by Lightning release since they tie into it As for the other element in the mix either one can be argued. Also Omni I know you want to declare your theory Debunked but how about instead declare it semi-confirmed. It is the first canon element that you guessed the name too before its reveal name wise. You can still try to guess the combo and hope for a complete verify.Umishiru (talk) 02:30, July 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * If that's the case, remove the '(presumed)' comment next to the lightning release symbol on Tsunade's page. She converted her chakra into electricity, according to the site anyway (which I believe to be true), so what's so strange about a spark of chakra being strong enough to create a barrier through the polarization of gaseous and metalic atoms/molecules. Besides, that's what magnetism is. It's a barrier. I know I'm really proving the point of Lightning+Earth/Wind, and not Earth+Wind, but I'm just being biased. I don't want to see Swift Release moved from the chart. :P 68.98.148.216 (talk) 02:39, July 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * Because your trying to over scientize something where the author is known to not being good at science. Good luck though, just don't get mad when Kishi does something again that goes against established scientific law. As for the Tsunade thing, this isn't the place for it, I would bring it up at or go read the proper talk pages for the site's decision for it. I can tell you though if your looking for me to defend the other side of the argument when it comes to her I am not the person for it. Its not ultimately up to you about what you want to see, keep and so on on the chart, its Omni's. All I do is type up suggestions and at the end of the day he decides what to do.Umishiru (talk) 02:54, July 7, 2011 (UTC)
 * I know, which is why I was suggesting an idea just like you, and trying to support it so that Omni would see it. Besides, weirder things have been on here before. See'ya! :) 68.98.148.216 (talk) 02:59, July 7, 2011 (UTC)

Idea
Wind + Earth + Yin. I was maybe thinking of a Desert/Age Release. Basically it ages an object but rather than regular aging the object turns into sand, kind of like desertification or as it is culturally known sands of time thingy. Like in the mummy where Hamunaptra(City of the dead) turns to sand or ages when they flash forward it to modern time.Umishiru (talk) 03:03, July 7, 2011 (UTC)

Bump.Umishiru (talk) 04:32, July 15, 2011 (UTC)

From the desert angle, I wouldn't use it, because Desert feels like something I'd use for stronger counterpart of Sand Release in the stronger counterpart table. Aging seems rather similar to the rotting idea you gave me in Rust Release. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 14:14, July 15, 2011 (UTC)

Volcanic Lightning?
Lightning+Earth+Yang. Dirty Thunderstorm or Volcanic Lightning. Idk if this is been suggested, but I can't find it as far as I saw. Electrical charges caused by ash and soot. Or maybe even 'Electrical Discharge' instead of Volcanic Lightning. ~Food for thought :) Sorry if my suggestions are lame. 68.98.148.216 (talk) 05:56, July 7, 2011 (UTC)

Smoke Release
Instead of smoke release being Fire+Wind+Yin, why not use Fire+Wind+Water since fire and wind already make smoke but if you put water in the mix (like dousing a fire) it also creates smoke (sorry for the lousy description)? Joshbl56 (talk) 04:56, July 11, 2011 (UTC)
 * Smoke is defined as the airborne product of combustion. The smoke which rises after a fire is doused is the smoke that was already forming when the fire was doused. No new smoke is produced. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:27, July 11, 2011 (UTC)

Black lightning Release
Instead of the Lightning + Yin combination giving Dark Release (冥遁, Meiton), it should give Black lightning that the Third Raikage and Darui are known for using, just like fire+Yin give the blaze release.
 * Blaze Release was explicitly called something that indicates a new nature. Darui's black lightning wasn't called a new nature, it was called "Lightning Release", indicating it's not a new nature. My guess is that black lightning is some sort of hiden Lightning Release style. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:27, July 11, 2011 (UTC)

Plasma Release
I was looking for something that would work with the fire+water+lightning and instead of finding that, i found this instead. In the scientific explanation section it says that the phenomenon is a mixture of gas and plasma. Since you already have star release as a Fire+Lightning+Yang combination and a star is plasma, why not use Fire+Lightning+Wind for this release? If that doesn't seem to work, why not use Fire+Lightning+Water? I know it seems like a stupid idea but if you go by the way Storm release looks, its not as bad as it seems. Since storm release makes energy that can move like water, why not make this one plasma that can move like a fluid but can also pierce objects instead of just hitting them?Joshbl56 (talk) 03:53, July 12, 2011 (UTC)
 * You're not the first person to suggest something like that. Out of all suggestions, they all have something to do with an ethereal energy of sorts. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 21:46, July 12, 2011 (UTC)
 * I was going to suggest Fire+Lightning+Wind put you already have dawn release for that one (I'm confused on how that would work) but on a better note, I have another theory: Pyrocumulus clouds, Since this uses fire to evaporate moisture to make the cloud. Not sure this is a good choice either since you already have a cloud release but its the only thing i could find that doesn't have to do with plasma.Joshbl56 (talk) 00:19, July 13, 2011 (UTC)
 * If you read the reasoning for Dawn Release, you'll see that the original idea was Aurora Release. The most basic thing I can use as an example is Pokemon's Aurora Beam attack. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:53, July 13, 2011 (UTC)

Theoretical Natures
First of all, I would like feedback for the Fluid (流), Shatter (破), and Gravity/Weight (重) Release ideas mentioned on your talk page, hope your triple combinations are working out. Also, some new ideas: Also, do you think Wind Release gives natures the quality of passing through things and floating (I think I mentioned this before)? For Scorch, Dust, and Ice Releases, all of the produced elements either "phase" through targets and/or float in mid-air. --GoDai (talk) 02:50, July 13, 2011 (UTC)
 * Since the kanji for Blaze (炎) was the simplest upgrade possible for the kanji for Fire (火), I find it possible that "Electricity/Thunder" (電) could be an upgrade (either Yin or Yang) for Lightning (雷).
 * The kanji "震" is used in the word for "earthquake" (地震) and can mean something around "thunder" (as in the sound) on its own. It is also used for "vibrate/shaking" (震動). "Quake Release" (震遁; Shinton)?

For now, I'm not thinking about two element combinations. All the spots are filled with something already. Most of my lack of replying is because those are the last few weeks in collage for me in this period, so things are a bit hectic. I noticed the wind changing things so they pass through stuff. It's one of the reasons I considered wind and lightning a possibility to magnetism. Fluid/Flow is something I've always left benched because all things I can think for it are a bit too general. I don't quite get how Yang would be involved in shattering stuff. Gravity is specifically something I have avoided because of Nagato. I always tried to make something centred on mass, but it usually doesn't come out right. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:34, July 13, 2011 (UTC)

Well Yang would enhance the energy.Umishiru (talk) 07:01, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

Addition of Dokuton
A Dokuton(Poison)nature, yielding Poison release ninjutsu. Poisons or things of the poison nature causing various afflictions to an opponent's body. Poisons come in a variety of forms(i.e liquid,gas,etc). The poison release allows the user to perform poison based ninjutsu with various symptoms and such.

Would very much like it if you did a grid for a poison release(tried to help in it) and made a special tab/release icon for it :^D

Symptoms and disease are kinda already covered by Bacteria Release, and considering that there are poison ninjutsu which as far as we know aren't elemental techniques (for example, Poison Mist), I won't consider poison as a viable chakra nature. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 14:14, July 15, 2011 (UTC)


 * The only kind of poison we have seen is a gas. I think his idea of the poison release being more then just gas, which would make more sense since we haven't seen anyone make liquid poison with chakra.Joshbl56 (talk) 03:46, July 18, 2011 (UTC)


 * I see no reason for characters who are already able to use gaseous poison being unable to make liquid poison as well. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 12:01, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Dokuton would cover a large range of abilities, poisonous gas as stated, liquid poison, corrosive poison,etc. We can't assume that they can make liquid poison just because they can make gaseous poison, such thinking isnt enough to use for a valid argument in my opinion. Also poison chakra nature seems more viable then certain assumed/custom made chakra elements(i.e typhoon, wave,land,brine, which are covered in their respective elements of wind, water, earth. Then dawn release which makes no reasonable sense to me or star,sky. Not sure how Forest can even be considered different from mokuton). As stated Dokuton would cover a wider range of possiblities and jutsu, just because a few members can create certain poison jutsu doesn't necessarily mean it covers the field of poison nature since a number of characters use fire jutsus and such.

Plus think about magnetism release once thought to be restricted to the third kazekage only to reveal others also have the kekkei genkai but utilize the kekkei genkai in their own respective means using different methods. So just because some characters use poison jutsu doesn't mean poison nature cant be used in a more refined ability.

Typhoon, wave, land, and brine are pretty much what Blaze Release is to Fire Release. We still don't know what exactly Blaze Release is, so I based those four on what I think the mechanic is for Blaze Release. If you take the time to read the reasoning for Dawn Release, you'll see it's a proxy for aurora borealis-like techniques. I don't simply throw something random at a combination, I always take the time and trouble to find some degree of explanation for them. Forest is based on a different theory, in which there are no combinations with Yin or Yang, in which case, based on Blaze Release, each nature would have a stronger, or empowered version of itself. I don't consider using poison as a nature because characters were already mentioned as using poison without doing any nature transformation. Magnetism is different. From the first time it appeared, it was said to be a kekkei genkai, it just wasn't called a nature transformation. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 23:47, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Idea Pt.2
How about a Salt release. Wind + Earth + Yin. It seems the desert contains many minerals including many salts. Earth reduced to sand like particles(Earth + Wind) that are transformed by Yin into salt.Umishiru (talk) 06:27, July 16, 2011 (UTC)
 * That would have been a good idea, but I already the kanji for salt in Brine Release. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 06:33, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

Brine Release seems more like the use of water diluted with salt than salt itself.Umishiru (talk) 06:47, July 16, 2011 (UTC)
 * Hmm.Sugar release. Aww man, Salt and Sugar. Salt: Earth + Wind + Yin Sugar: Earth + Wind + Yang. Would have been perfect. Lets see a Gem release? Gem are cut(Wind)and refined/polished(sometimes)minerals(Earth). Uh a mineral(Earth)is cut by the Wind into a particular size and shape which is enhanced(Yang).Umishiru (talk) 06:59, July 16, 2011 (UTC)

Mechanics again
I'm sorry for bringing this up since you probably have realized, but from what we have seen, I believe some of your natures could be a little more based on these, although these are subject to change over time also. This organization has become slightly refined in recent times as new natures were shown. Although we still haven't seen much of Yin and Yang, I am not sure about several things: Not too be overly critical, I just think some natures deserve a better clarification. I really liked your section for the Sand Issue, I hope you create more analyses like that one. I also personally think the triple combinations have some duality with one another when their combinations are identical except for Yin and Yang (e.g. Smoke/Gas, Implosion/Pulse, Alcohol/Hot Water). Also, did you base the Implosion and Pulse natures' directions on the inward/outward comparison of Yin and Yang? I thought that was really creative. --GoDai (talk) 07:03, July 21, 2011 (UTC)
 * Fire adds energy into things, making particles move faster and changes states of matter. (This also makes sense for the effects of Dust.)
 * Wind causes things to float and/or pass through solid matter.
 * Lightning (I am not exactly sure, since there aren't many confirmed combinations, nor common traits between the known ones) involves electromagnetic energies.
 * Earth seems to involve minerals (and maybe organic matter), and their characteristics.
 * Water either involves actual H2O, or fluid movement.
 * Brine Release implies that there's more salt in it, which in turn sounds more related to Earth, as Yin alone being able to change the quantities of salt seems a little sceptical.
 * Mirror Release seems too closely related to Glass Release, and Water seems to lack an actual part in the process ofits formation.

I know about brine, but since it's still mostly water, I don't feel such a strong connection to earth. Most other works which involve changing a water element in someway that makes it become brine, I don't remember any of them using earth to do so. It's always something which relates to negativity, so Yin takes that aspect. I have different takes on Glass and Mirror. I see Glass as something sharp, kinda like a solid wind. Maybe even glass dust. I put water in mirror because I saw I could use the reflection aspect of water. The reason I made the section about sand is because there has always been a lot of debate on that topic ever since we learned that advanced natures are made from basic ones. If I put the sand issue in the reasoning section of a table, it would completely overpower the table, so I gave it its own spot. I noticed the duality as well between Smoke/Gas and others, and that's somewhat to be expected, since two elements are shared between them, and we don't know much of what Yin and Yang do, so I had to make something different, but that still had more of a connection with the basic elements than triple non-Yin-Yang combinations. Implosion and Pulse were actually suggested to me. Whenever someone gives me an idea I end up using, I note it in the credits section of the page. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 13:20, July 21, 2011 (UTC)


 * So for Glass, it would be using the solid, transparent, sharp nature of glass, and Mirror would be focused around its reflective properties? I can see how you incorporated the reflection aspect of Water into Mirror, as it has also been noted in the effects of Ice Release, but I also find that a "Mirror Release" could be too similar to what we have seen in Demonic Ice Crystal Mirrors, although I guess its effects could be a little different.
 * I also like what you did with Dawn Release (being Aurora), the name being symbolic for the actual effect of a Release is something that has happened in the manga (Storm being fluid electric beams, Boil being an acidic vapour). In my opinion, you could always come up with the effect of the techniques first, name it symbolically, and then put what you imagine for the nature's effects. --GoDai (talk) 19:47, July 21, 2011 (UTC)

Ideas, although incomplete.
I also personally think there should be a Swamp Release somewhere, maybe in place of Mercury. I also had a short discussion with ShounenSuki about Pain's Deva Path powers on his wall, and it is a viable theory that the Deva Path's abilities may be "Heaven Release," as we have seen Explosion and Magnetism have their revelations too. --GoDai (talk) 09:21, July 25, 2011 (UTC)
 * Fire + Lightning + Water = I'm thinking of some kind of superconductive liquid, but nothing comes straight into my mind. Maybe something that corrodes and channels electricity. Also, if you've noticed, Fire-Lightning-Water/Ice is a very popular trinity in popular culture.
 * Wind + Earth + Yin = Pressure/Weight. It wouldn't be exactly the same as Nagato's abilities, since those revolve around himself. This nature would somehow add weight into things. The wind nature would allow the chakra to phase into the target.
 * Wind + Earth + Yang = Weathering. The earthen dust would act on solid materials, powered by Yang. Fills in for the previous dust ideas, although Water also is related to weathering.
 * Wind + Water + Yin = An advanced Ice, "冷" or "凍"; Cold or freezing. All three elements fit, even Yin with its cold theme.
 * Wind + Water + Yang = I personally think "wave" goes here, and Water+Yang should be something else. I keep imagining ripples across a pond for this triple combination, although you do already have pulse.
 * Lightning + Earth + Yin = Shatter (or something similar). Like how Lightning creates fissures in Earth, but using Yin to manipulate that form and applying it to other targets to shatter them instantly.
 * Lightning + Earth + Yang = Quake. "震" means "thunder," and "地震" means earthquake. The Yang would provide the force. It also forms a duality with Shatter. I'm thinking something similar to the Gura Gura no Mi in One Piece.
 * Lightning + Water + Yin = Something to do with electrolysis, obvious with the first two elements, and along with Yin to control the form of the dividing process. However, I have no idea how to express "電解" in one kanji. Th division into hydrogen and oxygen gases could be used for a wide variety of other things.
 * Lightning + Water + Yang = Something to do with the relationship between Water and Light. Storm also had a light-like appearance. Related to reflection and/or refraction. Refraction Release? Haven't looked into the kanji yet. Might end up not fitting.
 * Bump~ Any thoughts? --GoDai (talk) 00:45, August 2, 2011 (UTC)


 * Fire/Lightning/Water is one of the toughest combinations to crack. The one thing I managed to think that had a viable connection to these three is something that is something that is very shaky, which is some sort of holiness. In different religions, you see Holy Fire, Holy Water, and in some, lightning is considered holy as well.
 * I once considered Pressure for something involving Wind Release. Maybe density?
 * Considering Yang in Wind/Earth/Yang, I'd think something that is either very strong or else related to some sort of creation, since Yang has to do with life-giving and all that.
 * I'm beginning to consider putting something like Fluid or Flow for Water/Wind/Yin, which is something I always left benched. I can't think of anything else that fits well enough. Wind would act in that "letting something enter something else" way on Yin, which would work with water to make things melt. Kinda like turning stuff into liquid, but not through heating, just making it melt.
 * I see why you would associate wind with waves. No idea on this one though.
 * Shattering is an idea, but I think it might be too close to Crystal Release, which was also used that way. Crystallise something and then shatter it.
 * I seriously have no idea on what to do with Lightning/Earth/Yang. I see where you come from with Quake (powerful vibration in the earth), but it feels too close with Earth for me.
 * If only hydrogen had good kanji for this situation, this would totally fit. Hydrogen is a charged particle made from liquid.
 * I think something with reflection is kinda covered with Mirror Release already.

The thing about a Heaven Release is that it would mean the Rinnegan allows the use of another kekkei genkai, or in another case a kekkei tōta, which I don't really see happening. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 02:10, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

Fire+Lightning+Water=Purification. I was thinking about what you said about holiness, and I thought about what those holy objects are often used for. Izanagi washed his face with sacred water after he came out of Yomi, and fire often has something to do with removing impurities, and along with lightning, it is associated with refining. Also, dōjutsu are also by-products of kekkei genkai, and Blaze Release apparently came out of Sasuke's eyes, so I wouldn't be that concerned with Heaven, although not entirely favorable, or even likely. --GoDai (talk) 03:38, August 2, 2011 (UTC)

Concerning Mercury
When I made that suggestion I never really meant you create the metal mercury. The user can manipulate any solid(Earth) object and liquefy it(Water) and manipulate(Yin) that liquefied object for whatever purposes. Another thing, that same combo can be Poison release. Earth is diluted in Water in which the solution is transformed(Yin) into Poison.As for the earth wind yin/yang, I am currently thinking of something involving free radicals in particular free radical oxygen, when I come up with something I will post.Umishiru (talk) 01:43, July 29, 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't remember you suggesting me to create a mercury nature. Ever since I began the three-element combination table, I fine-combed every conversation regarding opinions, and I don't recall mercury coming up. A quick text search doesn't show any mention of mercury in the wiki I don't know of already. I don't think I'll list a poison nature for reasons in a section above this one. Besides, mercury can act as a poison already. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 19:36, July 29, 2011 (UTC)
 * http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/User_talk:Omnibender/Elemental_recomposition_table/Archive_4#Concerning_Gaara I also gave you the current combo for metal but I don't care about that.Umishiru (talk) 05:32, July 30, 2011 (UTC)
 * Bump.Umishiru (talk) 00:14, August 1, 2011 (UTC)
 * Trust me, I know about free oxygen radicals. I had a subject in college two semesters ago, almost half of it involved free oxygen radicals in one way or another. The most immediate thing that comes to mind when thinking about free radicals have either something to do with metabolism or with decay in general, which you supplied me with Rust Release already. For natures involving wind chakra, I'm trying to think stuff in which wind would carry the other effects into something else, kinda like what I think happens in Scorch Release (wind takes fire into something, heating it up) or what might happen if Magnet Release turns out to be wind and lightning (wind carrying the electric effect without the electricity). The part about a poison nature, I already gave arguments to someone else about four sections above. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:52, August 1, 2011 (UTC)

Confusion
What is the difference between Freezing Release and Frost Release? Also, what kind of properties could Forest and Eruption Release have compared to their weaker counterparts? --私は何ができますか？ どうすればいいでしょうか？殺す. 14:13, August 1, 2011 (UTC)
 * They're pretty much similar things with different names really. All the "stronger counterparts" are basically what Blaze is to Fire. More powerful. Omnibender - Talk - Contributions 00:39, August 2, 2011 (UTC)