<p>"GUYS WE GOTTA PULL OUT ALL THE STOPS OR ELSE THE WORLD IS DOOMED!! </p><p>Except shunshin. Thats off limits" XD </p><p>Everyone who wasnt Obito/Madara strained themselves in every way the whole war but speed is the one catagory they were holding back on. Like, what? </p>

<p>One of the six paths has chakra absorption. Without intel, obito could get his chakra absorbed but if Obito plays his cards right, he might win. Other than that, I'm leaning to the 6 Paths of Pain due to them being 6 people and one of them being able to revive any dead members,and one that can absorb chakra. Obito has kamui,but it might not work and although he has taijutsu experience,it might not work. And he can't use ninjutsu, because it will be absorbed. If he manages to kill those 2 members that I stated, Obito might have a chance. </p>

<p>@Legion, the guy who ignored my comment..wasted my time. Tobirama was the fastest Ninja of his lifetime, which means he is faster than Hashirama and Hiruzen. Even if it wasn't a race he still noted that Minato had significantly better Shunshin than himself. So much faster that Minato arrived on the battlefield set up some stuff for their plan and saved the alliance before the rest of them showed up </p>

• OK...and how is this even relevant to what i said?

<p>Because seemed to match eachother step for step and Minato couldnt successfuly speedblitz him. </p>

• Wait first of all don't tell me that you're gonna say that they're using shunsin there. Was he even trying to speedblitz him?

<p>Rinnegan comes with a statboost. </p>

• Ninjutsu only...nowhere does it state anything about speed boost.

<p>Its not suddenly He has always been stupidly fast considering he was keeping up with Minato 16 years prior. </p>

• Stupidly fast ;_; oh my god.😅😅😅 This is clearly wank.....

<p>Here's what i have so far. </p>

• Masked and Unmasked Obito before and in the war, failed to blitz a few opponents, failed to achieve any blitzing feats.
• All he did was <i>match</i> Minato's running speed...and don't get off track because the argument is not about Obito having that level of speed, we're talking about KCM Naruto,raikage dodging speed...that feat against Minato is nothing comparable to KCM Naruto's top speed.

• The rinnegan increasing his speed? bullshit, because as i said just after the fight with Konan he implanted the rinnegan so that is the same obito who didn't achieve any speed feats prior to the war, al he has is just a rinnegan,a change of clothes and a new mask....and as i mentioned also the rinne only grants ninjutsu boost as seen with kid nagato, he mastered all 5 elements in a jiffy and not anything about speed.

• Now saying he IS as fast as KCM Naruto [as i mentioned 999 times] that would mean Kakashi would have the same speed,as he kept up with them....that doesnt make sense now does it.

• Using your logic,everyone KCM Naruto fought could be just as fast as he is..because i could argue that the fight NAruto is in is happening in bullet-time...So that would mean, Itachi, Han, roushi, fuu, Killer Bee etc..they are alllllllllllllll capable of avoidinG AY.

<p>HERE IS WHAT YOU HAVE: </p>

• the fight happened in bullet-time...so obito is fast......😅😅

<p>@AsianReaper...@Jason, you keep saying "They used Shunshin and not running.You realize Shunshin is just basically running really fast? It's just accelerated movement </p>

• Ehrm yea..ik...So every time someone runs fast they're using shunshin? ok😅

<p>Obito is as fast as Minato as well, I can give you the feats as well which adds to my statement. ^^ </p>

<p>@LEgionZero </p><p>Fair enough about the jinchuriki thing. Obito attempted to blitz kabuto when kabuto approached him right before the war started. Obito considered kabuto a traitor and a threat, and thus tried to take him out. Kabuto avoided him and had time to cast the seals for edo tensei. If raikage was in the same situation as obito there, kabuto wouldn't have had such luxuries. Raikage would have been in his face, and kabuto would need oral rebirth to survive the raikage's pummeling. during the summit, raikage blitzed obito from a distance and elevation comparable to the one between obito and kabuto. Recheck chapter 490. </p><p>
As for Tobirama being faster than V2 Ayy, I don't think there is much evidence to go on. But all of tobirama's notable speed feats in the war seemed to be outspeeding ems sasuke to the battlefield, and then using FTG for literally almost everything else. Even his surprise attack on sage madara was using FTG. I personally think that while tobirama and minato are certainly really fast shinobi on foot, they got their monikers as fastest alive due to FTG. </p>

It literally says for Minato that he got his nicknames from using FTG..

<div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>@Legion, the guy who ignored my comment..wasted my time. Tobirama was the fastest Ninja of his lifetime, which means he is faster than Hashirama and Hiruzen. Even if it wasn't a race he still noted that Minato had significantly better Shunshin than himself. So much faster that Minato arrived on the battlefield set up some stuff for their plan and saved the alliance before the rest of them showed up </p>

• OK...and how is this even relevant to what i said?

</i></div>
<p>He only noted that the first attack to land wins the battle. In order to do so he would have to be moving as fast as possible. Unless you provide evidence he wasnt using shunshin then idk what to tell you. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>Because seemed to match eachother step for step and Minato couldnt successfuly speedblitz him. </p>

• Wait first of all don't tell me that you're gonna say that they're using shunsin there. Was he even trying to speedblitz him?

</i></div>
<p>Yes. Because by Minato's own admission he would have to land his attack first to win. The manga literally says "battle of speed" why wouldnt he be using shunshin?? </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>Rinnegan comes with a statboost. </p>

• Ninjutsu only...nowhere does it state anything about speed boost.

</i></div>
<p>Madara wasnt able to speedblitz even the shukkaku but his Limbo clone hit all of them so fast they hit the ground at once. Admittedly this one is kind of a stretch. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>Masked and Unmasked Obito before and in the war, failed to blitz a few opponents, failed to achieve any blitzing feats. </p> </i></div>
<p>No duh he isnt speedblitzing opponants like Minato and KCM Naruto because he is at their level of speed. This is why he doesnt get speesblitzed by them. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>All he did was match Minato's running speed...and don't get off track because the argument is not about Obito having that level of speed, we're talking about KCM Naruto,raikage dodging speed...that feat against Minato is nothing comparable to KCM Naruto's top speed. </p> </i></div>
<p>Except Minato and KCM Naruto have comparable levels of speed -.- </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>The rinnegan increasing his speed? bullshit, because as i said just after the fight with Konan he implanted the rinnegan so that is the same obito who didn't achieve any speed feats prior to the war, al he has is just a rinnegan,a change of clothes and a new mask....and as i mentioned also the rinne only grants ninjutsu boost as seen with kid nagato, he mastered all 5 elements in a jiffy and not anything about speed. </p> </i></div>
<p>The 6 Paths chakra from the Rinnegan would give Obito a stat boost. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>Now saying he IS as fast as KCM Naruto [as i mentioned 999 times] that would mean Kakashi would have the same speed,as he kept up with them....that doesnt make sense now does it. </p> </i></div>
<p>Kakashi didnt keep up with them. In fact he never engaged in CQC with Obito before his mask came off. He used Kamui and a raikiri kunai, which he used because he couldnt get to Naruto in time AND that was slow enough for Obito to counter. He is fast enough to see whats going on and take some action at a distance but he isnt fast enough to jump into the fray. </p><p>After Obito's mask came off he speedblitzed and punked Kakashi. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>Using your logic,everyone KCM Naruto fought could be just as fast as he is..because i could argue that the fight NAruto is in is happening in bullet-time...So that would mean, Itachi, Han, roushi, fuu, Killer Bee etc..they are alllllllllllllll capable of avoidinG AY. </p> </i></div>
<p>The junchuriki didnt tag Naruto using speed. He tried to block one of their attacks and it threw him off balance. They outnumbered and outbruted him(ch 566 p9-10). After Kakashi and Guy showed up and evened the odds Naruto was perfectly fine. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>Jason of the Mangekyou wrote: </p><p>Its not suddenly He has always been stupidly fast considering he was keeping up with Minato 16 years prior. </p>

• Stupidly fast ;_; oh my god.😅😅😅 This is clearly wank.....

</i></div>
<p>"Clearly wank" even though we saw it in the manga. </p><p>Your entire argument is based on characters not going all out, which is ridiculous because their lives are in danger, their homes are in danger, their loved ones are in danger, and the world is in danger. </p><p>Next you are gonna say A didnt use his full speed against Madara because we could see him and no one stated he used Shunshin. </p><p>But please due tell me how you can confirm anyone was holding back. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>CombatIQmatters wrote: @LEgionZero </p><p>Fair enough about the jinchuriki thing. Obito attempted to blitz kabuto when kabuto approached him right before the war started. Obito considered kabuto a traitor and a threat, and thus tried to take him out. Kabuto avoided him and had time to cast the seals for edo tensei. If raikage was in the same situation as obito there, kabuto wouldn't have had such luxuries. Raikage would have been in his face, and kabuto would need oral rebirth to survive the raikage's pummeling. during the summit, raikage blitzed obito from a distance and elevation comparable to the one between obito and kabuto. Recheck chapter 490. </p> </i></div>
<p>Nothing in 490 implies he couldnt take him out if he didnt want to his only alternative would have been to have undying Kage+ level Edo chase him forever. </p> <div class="quote"><i> <p>CombatIQmatters wrote: </p><p>As for Tobirama being faster than V2 Ayy, I don't think there is much evidence to go on. But all of tobirama's notable speed feats in the war seemed to be outspeeding ems sasuke to the battlefield, and then using FTG for literally almost everything else. Even his surprise attack on sage madara was using FTG. I personally think that while tobirama and minato are certainly really fast shinobi on foot, they got their monikers as fastest alive due to FTG. </p> </i></div>
<p>I looked into it briefly but there is no way to scale them. I was hoping to scale from Madara but Madara never actually tried against A and didnt move around much. </p>

<p>@Legion </p><p>My bad , I meant chap 489. Obito attempted to blitz base kabuto and surprisingly failed. First he jumps on top of the skeletal structure thing, kabuto jumps back. Then kabuto moves to the right and moves towards ground, and obito follows. They were both jumping, and as we said before that hopping speed can be correlated to jumping speed because all running is using the force of legs (amped by chakra) to propel your body weight. Kabuto had the time to cast the hand seal for edo tensei too. We have seen that when there is a huge speed difference, you can stop your opponent from casting hand seals, such as mifune vs Hanzo. KCM naruto speeds should easily be able to achieve such a feat against the likes of base kabuto. But obito couldn't get the job done. I'm not saying he couldn't beat kabuto, but he didn't have a speed advantage over him </p><p>Usually in situations like this, if there is a huge speed difference the author would make it clear through the character. But kabuto didn't have any trouble speedwise. IF obito was kcm level speed, he would have rofl blitzed kabuto and forced him to use oral rebirth to escape the warping. Kabuto would use this feint to slither away as fast he could and cast edo tensei, and be like TOBI chill i just want an alliance, and make some comment about the speed. And the rest of the scene would have played out the same way. </p><p>Therefore, I actually now believe that obito only became kcm shunshin speeds after rinnegan, and he was about two tiers below it before. kcm naruto=rinnegan tobi> v2 raikage>ms tobi=base minato. so actually, the version of Tobi matters when it comes to speed feats. This makes alot more sense imo. </p><p>
@Jason I think the chapter 595 feat of obito's legs moving faster than naruto's proves he is kcm level. He is noticably faster. But not a huge advantage. But I don't think one MS, one generic ms tobi has those speeds. So I don't think he can rofl blitz the pains but he still faster than them comfortably. </p>

<div class="quote"><i> <p>CombatIQmatters wrote: @Legion </p><p>My bad , I meant chap 489. Obito attempted to blitz base kabuto and surprisingly failed. First he jumps on top of the skeletal structure thing, kabuto jumps back. Then kabuto moves to the right and moves towards ground, and obito follows. They were both jumping, and as we said before that hopping speed can be correlated to jumping speed because all running is using the force of legs (amped by chakra) to propel your body weight. Kabuto had the time to cast the hand seal for edo tensei too. We have seen that when there is a huge speed difference, you can stop your opponent from casting hand seals, such as mifune vs Hanzo. KCM naruto speeds should easily be able to achieve such a feat against the likes of base kabuto. But obito couldn't get the job done. I'm not saying he couldn't beat kabuto, but he didn't have a speed advantage over him </p><p>Usually in situations like this, if there is a huge speed difference the author would make it clear through the character. But kabuto didn't have any trouble speedwise. IF obito was kcm level speed, he would have rofl blitzed kabuto and forced him to use oral rebirth to escape the warping. Kabuto would use this feint to slither away as fast he could and cast edo tensei, and be like TOBI chill i just want an alliance, and make some comment about the speed. And the rest of the scene would have played out the same way. </p> </i></div>
<p>Obito traveled a lot further than Kabuto in that panel. </p>

<p>Gonna say this again. One of the six paths has chakra absorption. Without intel, obito could get his chakra absorbed but if Obito plays his cards right, he might win. Other than that, I'm leaning to the 6 Paths of Pain due to them being 6 people and one of them being able to revive any dead members,and one that can absorb chakra. Obito has kamui,but it might not work and although he has taijutsu experience,it might not work. And he can't use ninjutsu, because it will be absorbed. If he manages to kill those 2 members that I stated, Obito might have a chance. </p>