<div class="quote"><i> <p>Ninja Of War wrote: @Blaze </p><p>To be honest, I'm not as interested in this debate, simply because it's been a week since your last response. I made a mistake in saying "@combat made most of the points I wanted to say", simply because it leaves the door open for you to twist statements. So, with that in mind let me address what you stated. </p> </i></div>
<p>I actually didn't want to reply after a week, but I got free time for it, and didn't have anything else to do at that time. Even I lost interest in this debate. </p><p>But how am I twisting statements? You didn't state much and you agreed to whateved @Combat said. I simply showed the flaws in it. </p>

Right back at you, you completely ignored the context, motivations and abilities of Bee at the moment of the fight with Taka. Context: Bee was cooped up in the village and wanted to leave to learn enka. Motivations: Bee did not have killing intent, he was indifferent to taka, and even attempted to leave the fight before karin sensed him.

<p>Abilities: I don't even know why I have to say this, but it is clear that Bee can make tentacle substitutions by himself. So saying he needs Sasuke to do it is not true. You're mistakened there. Bee had all the killing intent in the world, he literally tried killing Taka four times. His first attempt to escape was him understanding that Taka isn't that easy, since he couldn't kill them in his first attempts. </p><p>Then he transformed into Gyuki to end them. It was only during the moment he got caught that he saw an opening to fake his death and leave. </p><p>And when have I denied Gyuki's substitution jutsu? I have only denied the logic of how accurately he predicted the tentecle will be cut by Sasuke and how it lasted long. </p><p>And no, as I've stated many times before. If B simply did an substitution out of nowhere, Taka will notice it. It isn't out of Sasuke's mind of someone trying to escape Amaterasu, since he did it too. </p>

False, since as I mentioned above, he tried to leave the fight before that. Please provide proof that his motivation changed at that point, since you are so sure. I've provided mine.

<p>As I proved above. </p>

Except Taka, didn't capture Bee, they were fooled with a tentacle substitution, why do you continue to play that off as something impressive for taka? 

<p>I never said Taka captured B, just that was ths point of their mission. Taka survived againt a perfect Jinchuriki, unprepared as you would say, without intel and without full recovery of their strongest man. </p>

Yes, the whole point of the mission for taka was to capture Bee alive, did you forget lol? Bee is a jinchuriki. 4 on 1 against Bee and you cite that taka was unprepared? Well, that is their fault not Bee's. It is not Bee's advantage that Taka was unprepared, it was taka shooting themselves in the foot. Once again, your argument falls apart for that because Bee was also unprepared, and outnumbered. 

<p>One would assume Obito, would give hints to his own fellow Uchiha Sharingan user on how B would be immune to Genjutsu. Obito, nor Kisame were given intel, that's Akatsuki's fault, or you can fashionably call it plot. </p><p>Taka consisted of three fighters not four. B was a perfect jinchuriki, making him a perfect team of two. He had all the assets from Gyuki, Sasuke had with Taka, but more. Healing, superior to Karin's. Power, superior to both Suigetsu's and Jugo's. I don't know if you count a titanic monster as one man, but I'll count it as one </p><p>It was indeed B's advantage that Taka knew nothing about him, while the Sharingan is famous. Are you literally avoiding how the fight went? </p>

It actually goes in Bee's favor since he did all that without intel (for four members of Taka), that is impressive.

<p>He didn't need any intel on them. Everything they did was basic. He lived enough to know all that. </p>

Lol, I'll say it again, Bee tried to leave once, but was sensed by Karin. His motive was to escape and learn enka. He achieved the outcome he wanted. Lol, citing Madara and Hashirama now? (Sigh), you really trying every trick in the book. Yes Hashirama won, and Madara lost, but Madara didn't achieve the desired outcome. He wanted to beat Hashirama, but obviously failed.

<p>Lol, so B wanted to escape by thrusting swords into Sasuke? Ripping his body with his lariet? Or killing all of them with a Tailed Beast Ball. Sure, B wasn't trying to kill them at all…. </p><p>Madara actually did. He wanted Hashi's cells to gain Rinnegen. And he did so and isn't Hashi and Madara from the same show or are they from a whole different universe? B at first tried to kill Taka. And Taka survived. B finally decided to escape after getting hit by Amaterasu. It's funny how you don't notice that. </p><p>
</p>

Bee had no such desires, and it's laughable that you tried to compare the two instances.

<p>Huh? Desires? I'm talking about intent, B was a killer, he started trying to kill Taka from the get go itself, while Taka tried to capture him alive. </p><p>
</p>

Hahahahaha.

Wow. When have I denied that Bee escaped lol? Now I am convinced that you don't want to have a real debate, resorting to such false accusations. Lack of intel? That argument favors Bee not Sasuke. 

<p>Logic is not on your side, and definitely not the manga. As @Combat says, I accept your concession. You have failed to provide a statement of mine that is incorrect, with a manga chapter that states the truth. </p><p>So, yes you are projecting your actions on me, and immature for doing so. </div> Lmao. You're been resorting to headcanons, false accusations, straw grasping arguments and going against the manga and logic. And you picture me as the on doing that? </p><p>Either you stand on the side of the manga or you against it, you can't be on both sides at the same time. Taka had no intel, wasn't recovered, had no killing intent. B admitted to Sasuke being the toughest guy he fought so far and reasoned it to using his Tailed Beast. You guys are going so far against the manga and logic here. </p><p>And it's interesting that you're actually being immature here and falsely calling me on it. I've stated every point you guys brought, it is you all that are avoiding it for obvious reasons. So here's what I'll say for you, I accept your concession. You are using simple nos and insults instead of actually trying counter my points. And have so far failed entirely in this debate and is using immature acts in desperate hopes of 'debating', no offence. But this isn't how you should be in a debate. Atleast try to give a counter, I regard @Combat for doing so atleast, even how long the post would be. </p>

<p>@BlazeRelease </p><p>You keep saying that Taka had no information on B. So, it's unfair for them. But you forgot that EVEN Bee didn't know ANYTHING about Amaterasu. And even then, Bee was still PERFECTLY fine at 100% health after he had escaped it. If Bee had known about it, there's no way Sasuke would've stood up to him. As soon as B notices the Blood flowing through sasuke's left eye, he would instantly dodge it with his full Bijuu speed. Another thing is, that Eight Tails is a large object. So, it was easy for Sasuke to catch him with Amaterasu. B's V1 Bijuu cloak was enough to own the whole Team Taka ( Hell, even his base form fucked all of them ). If he goes V2 Bijuu cloak, not only would he able to EASILY dodge Amaterasu ( Due to being a very small object and also fast ) but he would also be enhanced about 5 times more than his V1 Bijuu cloak due to which, he would literally low-diff the whole Team Taka. </p><p>Also, I just watched the fight on my PC ( I have the fights downloaded ). And honestly, the fight was too one sided. B literally OWNED Team Taka like nothing lmao. </p>

<div class="quote"><i> <p>BlazeRelease wrote: </p><p>
And it's interesting that you're actually being immature here and falsely calling me on it. I've stated every point you guys brought, it is you all that are avoiding it for obvious reasons. So here's what I'll say for you, I accept your concession. You are using simple nos and insults instead of actually trying counter my points. And have so far failed entirely in this debate and is using immature acts in desperate hopes of 'debating', no offence. But this isn't how you should be in a debate. Atleast try to give a counter, I regard @Combat for doing so atleast, even how long the post would be. </p> </i></div>
<p>Lol, I call you out on being immature, and low and behold you say I'm immature. Congratulations, you played yourself. </p><p>You argument on Bee having "killing intent" fails because Bee tried to leave the fight before Sasuke used Amaterasu. Taka actually had some info on Bee, they knew he was a jinchuriki and they knew he was from kumo. That's at least some intel, I'm not sure Bee even knew about the sharingan. So your "lack of intel" argument also fails. </p><p>Finally your, "tentacle substitution" argument fails, because Bee can perform it by himself, when you stated he could not. </p><p>Now, in your last post you are confusing things that @Combat stated, from what I have stated. Stop doing that to try and seem like you have any semblance of an argument. I have address your points to me in full, yet you say I didn't "counter" them. It's funny because my "counters" are actually manga feats, where yours are " If Taka knew this then this would happen", in other words speculation and assumptions. </p><p>Feats > assumptions. </p><p>Note: I could pick holes in your previous post(s), since there are many, but I think it would be better to reduce this "debate" back to these three root issues. If these can be resolved then there would be no reason to go on tangents and exaggerations, as this is way off topic. If you can state your points clearly, short and without any of these false accusations, then I would gladly take you seriously. </p><p>Let's not continue in this fashion, since I could not understand you from the first post of yours that I responded to. </p>

<p>you all forgot about the ramen man! ramen man could flick Hashirama and it would disintegrate Hashirama. one punch from ramen man would kill the sage of six paths! and at full power no one could kill him!!! </p>

<p>No but "mInaTo iS tOo fAsT" and with his FTG not even ramen man can defeat the mighty unstoppable invincible Minato! xD </p>

<p>Good point @FlatZone. </p><p>Yeah, Minato is the best lol. </p><p>Note: For someone who hates on Minato all the time, you certainly like bringing him up a lot. Are you gonna make another thread about him anytime soon? </p><p>@Itachisempi </p><p>Teuchi's power is too much for anyone to handle, so he resorts to making ramen instead. </p>

<p>I don't hate Minato, I enjoy a good laugh at his die hard fans who wank him to oblivion lol </p>

<p>@Blazerelease </p><p>I seriously want you to stop claiming I'm using headcanon. why? because I literally cited you two chapters 542-543. So get your headcanon accusations out of here. You literally haven't read the chapters nor have you addressed them or my other arguments, otherwise you wouldn't continue to be spewing your headcanon. Ayy and Bee are literally stated and shown to be a tag team during the shinobi world war in those chapters. Go and count how many times they say "A and B tag team". Then look at how killer bee says the only reason he has a chance against the Yellow flash is because his big bro Ayy is there. You also conveniently ignored the fact that bee had TO SAVE AYY FROM MINATO. Ayy fought minato many times because bee was there to bail him out of the FTG level 2. The manga clearly showed Minato= A+B, Minato >A, Minato > B, period. At the end of chapter 543, they even tell you that Ayy and Bee stopped being a tag team because Ayy didn't want bee to ever leave the village again, which is the whole reason killer bee wanted a vacation. killer bee never fought outside of the village again until after he faked his death against sasuke, which leads to my next point. If in your next reply I see that you failed to reread those two chapters and address the argument, I happily accept your concession. </p><p>I see you using headcanon. Like ignoring the fact that Bee clearly wanted free time from the village and Raikage. He took it so seriously that he even refused to go full bijuu mode against Kisame. No one here is falling for your false claims that killer bee retreated because of sasuke. He literally owned sasuke, period. he retreated to take a vacation, that was literally stated and shown in the canon, beginning in chapter 419. </p><p>Lol no, did you rewatch the fight? Killer bee didn't have intel on suigetsu's special constitution, which caused killer bee's arm to get stuck in sugietsu's body, which allowed sasuke to chidori them both. So your intel excuse doesn't work. It goes both ways. Both sides had little to no intel on each other. Killer bee knowing about the sharingan is no different than sasuke knowing about killer bee's v1 cloak from his previous experiences fighting naruto. Killer bee wasn't even phased by jugo's punch, or sasuke's chidori, neither attack did lasting damage. Killer bee casually shunshined away after shaking off the electrocution. Taka was fodder to bee, even when they went for the kill. </p><p>And lol no, killer bee is faster and smarter than you give him credit for. We know he can move through his tentacles quickly to avoid danger, we saw him do it to madara, so he also did it to sasuke, period. the substitute lasted long because it was a well designed substitute. no one thought to actually injure the fake bee beforehand because they were convinced it was the real thing. only after hours of slowly absorbing all its chakra were they able to naturally undo the substitute and show that it was a tentacle. </p><p>As for sasuke's injuries, if it makes you feel better, sasuke still gets stomped even at full health, so there goes that argument. </p><p>Lol, I'm fully aware that kishimoto is a self proclaimed sasuke fanboy. Which is why to reduce bias, he has to thrown in some fights where sasuke gets utterly stomped, so that was the purpose of the killer bee fight. The sasuke fanboys were getting too cocky after sasuke's supposed "victory" over itachi. </p><p>
More headcanon I see. So we ignore the fact that Ayy was able to fight perfectly fine even after his arm was engulfed in amaterasu? IT's clear as day that the amaterasu couldn't burn through the armor. The reason Ayy cut off his arm is because even he can't maintain the raiton armor forever, and there are other practical issues with walking around with your arm covered in black flames. So that's why he removed it. We don't see what happens to the amaterasu on gaara's sand because it was off-paneled. Wow, more headcanon. the v1 and v2 chakra cloaks aren't flesh, they are actually chakra. The chakra has special physical properties that boost speed, power, and durability, and it seems to be detachable, as naruto detached the part of his cloak affected by amaterasu. V2 and V1 cloak> amaterasu, period. </p><p>And you took more of my post out of context. I clearly stated that the version of sasuke that BEE fought would also be stomped by Ayy. sasuke could not use susano'o at the time. So if Ayy fought that version of sasuke, liger bomb soloes. lariat soloes. And lol, you want to talk physics now? The way in which kage summit sasuke countered liger bomb doesn't even make sense. All he did was place susano'o between himself and the ground, and all that means is that the raikage slams sasuke into susano'o instead of the ground. Guess what? susano'o is still a hard surface. you can even see on panel that his head was slammed into his susano'o rib cage, and yet sasuke suffered no damage. That's what we call plot. Even ignoring that, Raikage would still stomp MS sasuke even with susano'o because sasuke can't maintain it continously, he must take breaks due to the pain and stamina issues. the second he does Ayy blitzes and lariats his head off, period. Ayy was in a bloodlusted and extremely reckless state of mind during the kage summit. hitting amaterasu when he didn't need to was a stupid decision, but it didn't matter because he knew he could take sasuke out. Ayy also isnt as stupid as you claimed. He would only let his legs touch amaterasu during the kick, not his arm. after sasuke is dead, ayy cuts his left arm off and his legs and his medic heals him. Ayy has rediculous pain tolerance and endurance, he would live. Ayy would no longer be a functioning shinobi, but sasuke wouldn't be a shinobi at all anymore, sasuke would be in the afterlife. </p><p>
and lol no, you are simply downplaying killer bee's speed, and ignoring timing and sustenance. Sasuke at the time had significant backlash from each Ms technique he used, to the point he had to hold his head in pain. As sasuke slowly turned around thinking bee was down for good, killer bee had already gotten up and began charging. Killer bee moved so fast that jugo and karin couldn't even warn sasuke. Sasuke literally stated that killer bee has loads of speed and power, and that he was only managing the speed because killer bee moves in a straight line and he has a sharingan. This time around, sasuke was suffering from MS backlash, so he had zero chance of reacting to killer bee's speed. </p><p>
And I'm just gonna disregard any claims that gyuki was out of stamina, as not only is that illogical, it was never stated. Gyuki said BEE was low on strength, nothing about gyuki itself being low. Gyuki is literally a bijuu with rediculous reserves. Killer bee wasn't even completely bloodlusted against taka. if he was, he would have used bijuu dama barrage, which fires several bijuu dama in quick sucession. in the war arc, the guy he even tanked his own bijuu dama, and fought in bijuu mode for a significant amount of time before needing rest. </p><p>Whether or not Adult sasuke beats killer bee is irrelevant to this discussion. Adult sasuke wins, to my distaste, for obvious reasons. but saying Ms teenage sasuke beats killer bee is just disrespecting killer bee in my opinion. </p>

This topic has gone on for a month.

<p>Im so proud^ </p>