David Kibasennin wrote: I saw this fight similar to Jiraiya vs all the Pains. Jiraiya was unravelling Pain's secret AS he was fighting them, and took a beating. But by Pain's admission, if he had intel on them to begin with, he'd have won. Naruto and Sasuke were discovering all of Jigen's abilities AS they were fighting him, and were coming up with small strategies on the fly. They tried to use Susanoo and the big Kurama form because that worked against the last Ootsutsuki they faced. Had they known all of Jigen's powers prior, the fight would've gone differently, or at least they wouldn't have gone down as quickly.
My bet on that comment over Pain was that had Jiraya actually knew that Pain's original body was weak and was hidden inside the city he would go for it rather than fight the puppets, he made a good get away from Pain and summons for a couple of times, so he only needs to slip away and manage to find the real pain. Just like Naruto figured out Pain's real hideout, had he figured it out earlier, he could have gone for it, albiet those Pains would try to stop him, but the situations kind of will be switched with Pain on the edge. Plus, Pain protected the City so he wouldn't want Jiraya going around destroying buildings until he found the real Pain.
On the battle though, I can't really grasp on how fast Naruto and Sasuke are losing chakra. In Sasuke's case, I guess he did travel a few dimensions for a few rounds, but why didn't Naruto just cloaked him up? Wouldn't that have helped him in literally everything?
Jigen's way of dealing things is actually funny to be honest, brilliant but funny lol. He captured Naruto and then proceeded to leave in another dimension, thus winning the fight by default lol.
Maybe this time, in this fight, those Kages could have actually been useful, or rather Gaara and some other three top ninjas like Lee, Sakura and I don't know, Shikamaru? Probably would have turned the fight around. Yeah, I know, Sasuke didn't have the time or the Chakra, but again, why doesn't Naruto ever cloak or anyone else anymore? It could have been quite useful if he did earlier on with the kids too, protection and double the power.
Wait, I think the cloak could get absorbed? But would it not work on the same principle that Naruto's own cloak could get asborbed? Or am I missing something? Cloak or not, Naruto could have had a clone power Sasuke up rounds. It was the ameno that actually was gaining them some dust on Jigen. Everything else was smooth for him to deal with.
I guess hand signs are now used to focus more properly on chakra, as from what I could guess, Sasuke and Naruto are masters on ninjustu.
Naruto would fight the same way he fights, I don't think he ever fought while thinking about his chakra from day one. I don't know if he changed his style as an adult, but equaling with Sasuke's own chakra supply is big(and so he probably wouldn't even care about it). Like I think it's about the third largest reserve in the shinobi world third to Hashirama.
From taking the final fight between Naruto and Sasuke. Sasuke's biggest task was Naruto's chakra supply. Since basically, he was immortal with it. Both his injuries and stamina get regenerated with it and the fact that it could supply a whole army of shinobi(half Kurama) with just half of it, and still fight with more chakra than a whole shinobi village and add that with the SP gain. So, as I've said, his biggest task is to either destroy Naruto with a one hit, which is basically impossible, because he also is indestructable(and again heals from almost anything) so, his best was to damage him(since the more damage it comes, the more the healing comes, and the more chakra is spent), and make him use up his chakra. But that itself was crazy. His only options were to either absorb Naruto's chakra(he probably knows it more than last time) or make Naruto with his full strength. And try to defend himself while also delivering equal blows. Though in this case, with equal reserves, it's easier than ever.
I used the body replacement jutsu to trick you into believing I was trapped. You see the wood trunk, and realize this was a trick and you turn behind to see me attacking you, you use kunai on instinct and then realize that too was a substituion by the body replacement jutsu. You don't know where I am right now. And there's alot of suspicious rocks and trees near you, all around.
I kind of expected Naruto to turn into his Tailed Beast Mode when he went for Himawari. Would that count as flesh though? Maybe even if it did. It would have been a better way to scale things out. Like if Naruto's Tailed Beast Mode was permenantly injured, then fights would go more ninja like rather than, well how it recently goes in Shippuden.
While that Beam that stops regenerating was okay and all. Where does it take the original idea of Rasenshuriken? A countless number of small bladed wind shurikens that cut through the cells. And of all the times, Naruto could have used the clone technique, it was now(the illusion one I mean) He could have also used a shadow clone to take Boruto and the others to a safe location.
It's simple isn't it? Ay was B's brother, so it's natural that he would think like a brother rather than a ninja when he saw a blade coming at Ay. Remember when Ay's bodyguards were shocked and screamed out when Ay was supposedly blasted away by Jugo? Bodyguards who were intelligent, adults and knew alot about Raikage and ninja stuff. Yet, they were worried about Ay, when they know that it doesn't even take his base speed to dodge that. Emotions. It's called natural instincts on relations. And to be honest on B's actions, the Kunai could be anything. Kunai's can also get powered up by ninjutsu or anything other special ninja stuff, and since Minato could teleport using them. It isn't a bad guess that Minato's Kunai could be more than it looks, it was a guess not worth the risk.
And about Pain saying Jiraya could have beaten him if he knew his secrets and stuff. Maybe. Maybe Jiraya could have beaten Pain there and then. If he knew his secrets. But not anywhere else. Since, The Rain Village was Nagato's own village, he can't obviously use wide scale attacks like Shinra Tensei and CT. And by secrets, if Jiraya knew that there was a body weakened to even walk, being the real one to control them. Then he would simply go for that body. He would probably summon all the toads he could and make them demolish the area, while he uses Sage Mode to figure out the real Pain. And it would only take a few giant toads to demolish the building he is in. And Pain wouldn't be able to use CT or any other large scale attacks because that would also damage his own body. Atleast that's what I think.
In my opinion, Jiraya and Minato takes this.
I don't know if this is late. But if we're taking every feat shown. Then Gaara or any other kage simply capturing Sasuke won't do anything, since he can just switch places like he did with the chain and Momo. The best they have is aiming for one quick blow. Which is not gonna be easy. With just one sharingan, he fought with Kinshi(Sharingan needs two of it's pair to work in it's completely efficency and not to mention the EMS's fluency in movement.
And it's actually doubtful about if Gaara actually caught Momo on a serious note. Considering he was just playing with the kages, he literally laughed when he got caught, which in the first place, he avoider pretty well, it was only when he closed into Gaara, basically, increasing Gaara's own range that he caught or rather got him. Just saying.
Well, to be honest, there are other types of genjutsu that can easily be figured out as one, but still be unable to be countered with. Like Jiraya's and the Sound Ninja's genjutsu, which captyres the person, and even though they know they're in it, they are stuck. And just like that, there is the Sharingan Genjutsu which kind of treats the opponents into mental pain that is felt physically or something, like the Tsukuyomi and the genjutsu Sasuke did with C and Sakura. And then, there is the controlling one. Which kind of works with target being unconscious of whatever he or she is doing, like with Kurama, Manda, and many other examples.
Oh, yeah forget about that thing. Man... Does every villain now have absorption? It was only fun when Pain used it. When the others do it, it just becomes op or unnecessary. And then we have a guy, who has absorption abilities, yet barely uses them.
Now that I think of it, I wonder if genjutsu would work? I mean her eyes aren't normal right? Maybe they're genjutsu proof or something. If they're smart enough, they could disguise as the leader with the transformation jutsu coming from what Kawaki details about him. And trick her into revealing everything in an impression that he came to save her or something like that.
Though why isn't Naruto using his shadow clones, I mean after he is exposed? And why does he really want to pretend and risk matters like this when he can just capture her right there? Interrogation with all the skilled ninjas and genjutsu would make the work easy, plus if none of that works. The Sharingan could be used. And since he knows she's an important, they can keep her as bait, just to make sure Kara doesn't do anything or let them into a trap. Sigh, I wonder what would have happened if she thought the same way as Haku and tried to attack Boruto and the others to get Naruto shield them risking his own stamina/state.
And, did the Kara members live under a rock? Naruto literally is the strongest ninja in the world, with an army of Shadow clones, a titanic fox made of chakra, and regeneration, stamina and durability that go so far, plus with all the legends, they still have no idea how powerful he is, let alone try to fight him?
That would be a good twist. Since Kashin and Sasuke never been in one place together. But still, I feel Kashin seems to have relations with Kara and Ao longer than Sasuke became good, or maybe he Kashin joined Kara about that time or Sasuke just genjutsud them or something like that.
I have no idea why he would do so though, he could easily gather info from a genjutsu, so there is no point in causing harm. And we do know that Kashin had his inner monolouge where he remembers Konoha and stuff. So, unless the Uchiha take their secret undercover/spy/fake identity that seriously, I would say no. Though I for one have a guess that Kashin probably is acting as a spy just like Itachi did.
Atif khursheed wrote: They are just dragging the series . Its not even half the fun of naruto series No demon Zabuza equivalent fight. No guy like Danzo the worst bad guy in the village . No Copy ninja fights. No Orochimaru's wrong doings. No Itachi's Stories. I am watching every episode hoping it will get better but they are just making an excitement curve like sin(up down ....)
To be fair, the Naruto series didn't exactly keep those factors up for too long too. The Zabuza Fight was one of the first serious fights in the series among hundreds yet, there's no fight that can be called like it, though the other fights were also great.
Danzo was a good villain kind of guy, that fit well into the politics and corruption of the village, yet he was introduced in the second series, even though his actions already began before the first one and that he could have been a good character to start with in the first series. Like a guy that important not being known by any and had so much influence in the village, maybe they should have had him first. But yes, the Boruto series doesn't showcase anyone like him, but you know, who knows we may just get another elder just like him who was part in many of the issues in the series, just popping up in the second or mid end of the series.
The last time a ninja copied a technique was when Sasuke fought that Absorbing guy. Then it all became about the vast powers of a ninja and the Sharingan and stuff. Like why need 1000 jutsus when you can make a Titanic chakra armour around you. Though there was Sarada vs that Mist Swords girl. They could have shown alot of cool stuff with that copying technique. I actually anticipated Sasuke to be like Kakashi, like him copying new technique while he fought powerful opponents. Like Itachi's, Diedera, B, A, Orochimaru(which he actually should have known a couple or forbidden techniques he never, in which regard, he's alot like Kakashi) and many others. I actually think it would have been much cool of him to copy B's sword style and use it agains the Samurai's at the Summit, like when they pile up against him. And when A comes in, he gets even more angry of seeing his brother's style being copied by the person he thinks who killed him. Just saying, alot of potentiel....
Instead of Orochimaru being bad again, or another Itachi type of guy, I want someone in the village, who is a popular character to be a traitor who betrays for power(Not leave, but actually destroy/kill/steal/or leak out info/or help attack his own friends for the promise of power) Ao, kind of is and is not that type. He was just out of nowhere, from being alive to being a cyborg/robot to being the villain/traitor/or just another spy.
Vladosaurus wrote: I’m not going to claim that Gaara beats Itachi or anything, but let me remind you that Gaara countered amaterasu with his sand and also countered Susanoo with his sand. Gaara used the sand to pull Madara out of his Susanoo, which would work on Itachi as well.So Gaara has counter for 2/3 of Itachi’s abilities. Tsukuyomi is up to debate.
Though, do we know actually what happened? Like, Gaara's sands were still on fire, so I guess he let out the grains of the ones that were on Amaterasu into the air, a little like Naruto using his Chakra cloak. What would happen if the Amaterasu was shooted in the style Itachi used with Sasuke, or what would happen if Sasuke tried to manipulate the fire on Gaara's sand?
The susanoo feat though, was accomplished by the help of Ohnoki I think. And Madara standing on the sand was also a thing.
Mr. Grave wrote: @CombatIQmatters
I agree Gaara loses this particular match up, but a prime version of Gaara (that is post-war adult Gaara) with moderate knowledge on his opponent is more than a handful for someone like Itachi, especially if the battle takes place in a goddamn desert. To fighters like Tobirama, Kisame and Gaara, environment is a big part, so if you pit any of them in favorable conditions, chances are they'll win unless they're dealing with a slippery fighter or a demi God.
I take that different strategies would be taken in different situations, especially with someone like Itachim. Like the fact that Gaara won't be instantly taken by Itachi's genjutsu just like every other character he fought is a thing and the fact that Gaara really has a weird tendency to look into people's eyes makes it kind of a hilarious match up.
@Combat. Stuff happens like that. And if you actually check my post, I said I'm not gonna return posting, that I may return to read the comments out of curiousity after three or four months, in which case, the discussion would be over and I wouldn't be able to say anything. I never did resort to fangirl/fanboy arguements nor am I gonna point at anyone on it. I just want to have a peaceful mind while I try to write something. Sorry if I annoyed you both or something else. I won't be replying again here. So, sorry and peace.
@Ninja. Sure, sure whatever floats your boat, just stop with this.
@Ninja. You're seriously gonna continue with this stuff? I have already stated everything I had at that time, and you guys didn't agree to that, so I respected that and decided to leave, instead of just whining about it. What use would I get to keep on stating the same points to like four different guys, each with a bigger note than the other. If you're actually not over with that stuff, I'll apologize for it. I can't do anything other than that. And so, I'll be ending my break and continuing to my work. Wish you well. Peace.
To be honest, I would say one needs the physical speed and strength Lee and Sasuke possesed while fighting Gaara to actually have a chance. And for the matter of Boruto's speed. It's always been a question mark. He is known to be fast, but so was Sasuke before he met Lee. So we don't know how fast he actually is, but in my opinion, if he was any close in speed to Lee or Sasuke than he would have been able to overwhelm opponents like that Cannibal guy, but it seems he just posseses a 'fast speed' but one thay actually isn't compared or measured for us to get an idea of, Mitsuki and Metal Lee also are the same with this. Why could the show not explain their speed levels and combat strengths instead of using filler episodes after another especially the ones that could have been used for example like Shino remarking about theie grades and stuff before their graduation or even during the chunnin exams....
No, pointless as in it has no use for both sides. I realize why people have been against the idea of versus debates and such. It is just well, wasteful and just starts up hate, like take this very situation for example, you're pointing me about a discussion one month ago that I kindly quit upon. As I've said, there's not much reason for the discussion, and I been in part of other discussions too, just after that one, did you seriously just notice me by now? I don't want to go on about this, so I ask you to forget whatever happened lol.
Ninja Of War wrote: You mentioned you had to leave the wiki to focus on your book. So you do have time to have for discussions, just not ones that challenge your opinion.
I find that you're taking things way too personally than it is. I remember quite exactly saying that I don't want to waste my time on pointless debates that will just end up in a fight. And I'm taking a break, here and there, not for pointless debates or anything else, but just to take small parts in discussion.
I think it's one of the little details changed from the Original. Instead of being immensely Titanic in size, they are smaller in Shippuden, enough small for a shinobi to have any chance. The Tailed Beasts and the Summons(They had their size change too) got smaller than usual. This is the reason, I think.