Elveonora wrote: Since when are you Japanese language/culture expert Manrandell?
i have been into Japanese culture my entire life and my Fiance is Japanese and was born and raised in japan
Mrlmm0605 wrote: It is totally impossible for Hagoromo to have a kekkei genkai not possessed by Kaguya. The laws of heredity, which Kishi tries really hard to abide by, deny even the possibility. Therefore, Kaguya had to have a Rinnegan. It can, though, be a subtly genetically different Rinnegan than that of Hagoromo, because of the recombination of genes. In a story context, all chakra abilities had to have originated from Kaguya, because al chakra originated from Kaguya. There is no middle ground. Either Kaguya has the Rinnegan, or there is no such thing as a Rinnegan. One of those is obviously false, so we have but one option.
By your logic she must have every Dojutsu
she must have Ranmaru's dojutsu
she must have Deidara's dojutsu(he created that himself)
is it so hard to believe that maybe just maybe Hagoromo was not born with the Rinnegan maybe just maybe he was born with a Sharingan and simply trained it and evolved it the same way Deidara trained his eye to be immune to genjutsu
Elveonora wrote: "All chakra abilities had to have originated from Kaguya, because all chakra originated from Kaguya" and that is true, unless Kishi gives us another plot-twist. Since Kaguya/Ten-Tails whatever is source of all chakra and seemingly Hagoromo and Hamura each inherited a different aspect of her (just like Ashura and Indra did of Hagoromo) it stands to reason that everything Hagoromo has is also what his mother has to have. Therefore since he does have the Rinnegan, so then must she as well. There's no room for "3rd party chakra upgrade" so the only way for Hagoromo to be the originator of the Rinnegan would be if the assumed father's genes had brought a mutation.
And we don't know anything about the father or even if there was any. But scientifically, there had to be one, since the Y chromosome didn't come from nowhere, unless:
And since Ashura + Indra = Hagoromo, logic has it that Hagoromo + Hamura = Kaguya. Only once and if a father appears can your theory about the Sharingan having been there first work.
If Hagoromo is just 50% of Kaguya and has the Rinnegan, then she must have had the Rinnegan and more from the get-go, being the whole.
by your logic it would be completely impossible to beat her. if all of the powers the shinobi have originated from her then that would mean there would be no way in a snowy hell they would beat her they have shown that each individual can change there own chakra nature. and alter it. develop new techniques new powers. chakra originated in her the dojutsu started in her but that doesn't mean she had the Rinnegan. all it means that the eyes he gained from her mutated when he changed his chakra nature
Ten Tailed Fox wrote: Except you forget that by your own argument, Kaguya has the "power of the Sharingan". In order for Indra, then, to have a Sharingan, the Sharingan's power must also have been in Hagoromo. Regardless of whether Indra was born via chakra or genetics, this has to be true, since Hagoromo can't pass on a power he doesn't have.
But your theory says that only the tomoe Rinnegan has the Sharingan's power, which Hagoromo didn't have, meaning that in your theory, the Sharingan either A) is a derivative of the Rinnegan (which is a theory that requires genetics), or B) the Sharingan popped out of nowhere.
Which is it?
people need to realize that if kaguya has the Rinnegan and since Indra gained Hagorom's eyes then that would stand to reason since hagoromo had the Rinnegan then so would Indra. but thats not how it works. hagoromo's power was split into two 1 eyes(sharingan) 2 body since it requires both the power of the eyes and body to have the Rinnegan that would stand to reason that the Rinnegan was a unique eye created by Hagoromo via selective mutation or selective self evolution(ie when he learned chakra control he developed his chakra learned to change his chakra nature and evolved what he was likely born with(the sharingan) since hagoromo had yin yang release in the form of creation of all things which can breath life into anything it would stand to reason that he could maybe evolve his own dojutsu also since kaguya had both the byakugan and sharingan it she would have no reason to favor 1 eye over the other and further evolve her sharingan the people who believe that its impossible for hagoromo to have developed his dojutsu to a more advanced form than kaguya because that would mean he was superior(not just that his single Rinnegan was superior to her single sharingan) to her fail to realize that so far in narutoverse it has shown that a child can inherit a unique trait from there parent and further evolve said trait and become superior look at neji. he was said to have the finest byakugan in the entire hyuga clan but nope according to ELV its impossible because he inherited that eye from his father
JOA20 wrote: Pretty much, Kaguya had the Tomoe Rinnegan and the Byakugan, Hagoromo only the Rinnegan, Hamura only the Byakugan. Indra inherited only the tomoe that weren't manifested in his father's Rinnegan and thus had only the Sharingan which could be at best evolved to Mangekyo Sharingan.
because by hagoromo's own words she had byakugan and sharingan not Rinnegan and if he indeed created(via training his eye) it which is the most likely. then he definitely would know if she had it or not
He would definitely know if his mother were a monster, rait?
Actionmanrandell, because Hagoromo knew everything about his mother, even that she was the Ten-Tails-
Well, if what obito said is true about Hagoromo creating his sons not by usual means but by using Creation of All Things, then he mostly chose to give the older brother the Sharingan and the Yin power, the model he used for his creations is both himself and Hamura
Actionmanrandell wrote: You need to learn to read. hagoromo said byakugan and sharingan not byakugan sharingan and Rinnegan get a life and stop reading to much into the term Power of. if you were to go to japan you would read that many stories have simular writing methods as in power of magic power of god etc when they say this they are not just saying the person ahs the power of magic or the person has the power of a god they are literally saying the person has magic the person is a god. and as such when kishimoto says besides the byakugan she had the power of the sharingan he is literally saying besides the byakugan she had the sharingan
If that's the case then why did Kishimoto say that Kaguya has the Byakugan and besides that has "the power of" Sharingan and not just has "the" Sharingan, or Kaguya has "the power of" Byakugan?
Georgio722 wrote:
Actionmanrandell wrote: You need to learn to read. hagoromo said byakugan and sharingan not byakugan sharingan and Rinnegan get a life and stop reading to much into the term Power of. if you were to go to japan you would read that many stories have simular writing methods as in power of magic power of god etc when they say this they are not just saying the person ahs the power of magic or the person has the power of a god they are literally saying the person has magic the person is a god. and as such when kishimoto says besides the byakugan she had the power of the sharingan he is literally saying besides the byakugan she had the sharingan
If that's the case then why did Kishimoto say that Kaguya has the Byakugan and besides that has "the power of" Sharingan and not just has "the" Sharingan, or Kaguya has "the power of" Byakugan?
This has been answered before. In Japanese culture and the way they speak/write. "the power of" means in -Plain English- that SHE HAD IT. The physical object. If they say "she had the power of God" then it would basically mean -in plain English- She was God. GET IT?
In this regard he was not "reading too much into it". It's how the Japanese speak and the meaning behind that short phrase that goes with it. We English speaking people do not attach the same meaning because we don't share the same culture and mannerisms. A lot of the original meaning gets lost in translation.