So... So much for everyone who claimed the Shinju is the progenitor of all Chakra.
Gotta love Kishi. Curve balls left and right. I personally loved this chapter. Some wonderful clarification.
So... So much for everyone who claimed the Shinju is the progenitor of all Chakra.
Gotta love Kishi. Curve balls left and right. I personally loved this chapter. Some wonderful clarification.
Darhumphump wrote: just because there aren't any in mention doesn't mean they died out, how many Sarutobi clan members do you know of, or Shamura clan members?
Well yes, but considering the fact that the Senju are always referred to in past tense, and the fact that they aren't one of the four noble clans of the Leaf, implies they're gone for an unknown reason. Especially since the Senju were the strongest clan in the world, and not a single Senju clan member (Except possibly Tsunade) is alive in the Leaf today. No one even has the last name "Senju" at all. So either they died out somehow or Kishi just completely forgot about them and didn't think of a good reason for them to disappear. But they're clearly no longer around.
Legendary Super Saiya-Jin 4 wrote:
Darhumphump wrote: just because there aren't any in mention doesn't mean they died out, how many Sarutobi clan members do you know of, or Shamura clan members?
Well yes, but considering the fact that the Senju are always referred to in past tense, and the fact that they aren't one of the four noble clans of the Leaf, implies they're gone for an unknown reason. Especially since the Senju were the strongest clan in the world, and not a single Senju clan member (Except possibly Tsunade) is alive in the Leaf today. No one even has the last name "Senju" at all. So either they died out somehow or Kishi just completely forgot about them and didn't think of a good reason for them to disappear. But they're clearly no longer around.
Just like Uzumaki, a lot of Senju and Uchiha took on surnames to hide themselves from continuing an endless battle. By hiding your name you successfully hide your entire existence, until of course you do something to make yourself known.
Also you are forgetting something, Tsunade is a Senju as well as Uzumaki, although she does not use her full name she is a Senju(Grandfather - Hashirama Senju) and to a lesser extent Uzumaki(Grandmother - Mito Uzumaki).
There are many other clans that are deemed important that have less known characters in them than the Senju, that doesn't mean they're nonexistent, it means Kishi didn't want to think of 1000s of different designs and back stories and names for entire clans of people.
Crazy theory: what if, what if....... Senju Clan lives outside the village? They are "of the forest" after all, perhaps they simply are no longer shinobi, but people of nature or something.
But it was during the clashes between Hashirama and Madara that probably made the difference (though this is just opinion)... Your right that the Senju were superior to Uchiha, but I think that might have been because of the difference between the aces, Madara and Hashirama (and seeing your ace get his ass kicked would definitely drop moral).....
Also, when did the Uzumaki and other clans take on surnames to hide themselves?
And since Mito married into the Senju clan, Tsunade is a part of the Senju clan, though she is Uzumaki decent.
Names are things that Kishi didn't give us a lot of info on & we kinda got to make up our own theories.
I don't know about ace, Tobirama is hardly a slouch himself.
Elveonora wrote: I don't know about ace, Tobirama is hardly a slouch himself.
I meant after Seeing Madara lose to Hashirama. Madara being the Ace.
But for the Senju, Hashirama was definitely the ace (I mean, strongest Shinobi ever, until Jubi jinchuriki's came back ---- note that the Sage and his kids technically weren't shinobi)
Deathmailrock wrote: Actually, it wasn't exactly the Uchiha being inferior to the Senju but Madara being inferior to Hashirama.... the clans over all were about equal. If one guy got the Senju, the other side would hire the Uchiha....
It should also be noticed that Madara and his brother Izuna at some point started to go blind, so the Uchiha was being led by blind guys...
Over all, the clans themselves were probably equal, it was the leaders that made the real difference....
No that is not true because in his flashback with Sasuke questions, Hashirama says "everyone could see that the Uchiha were clearly inferior in our battles."
He would have said that only Madara and Izuna were inferior but no that theme of being inferior to the Senju ran through the whole clan.
They were just about even but clearly there is a reason why the Senju is known as the most powerful clan and there is a reason the Uchiha began to surrender to them willingly.
@ElvinWindSword
1st note I said "probably" so it's just an assumption.
2nd, if their moral was lower and their leaders were inferior, then they would lose more often and be weaker as a whole.......
I'm not saying that Uchiha in general were equal, I'm talking about if you took out the leaders and the lower moral of the clan, they might be the same.......
Am I wording this right?
What I'm trying to say is that if Madara were better than Hashirama, the situation of the clans might have been different (cause then Madara would have more power & the Uchiha would have had better moral than Senju). The difference in leadership and moral make all the difference in battles after all. Plus, we can't say that Hashirama was completely unbiased.
Uchiha and Senju were 2 strongest clans, let's leave it at that, irrelevant which was stronger. Also members change over time, so at one point, either was stronger than the other. After Hashirama and Tobirama died, technically Uchiha were stronger, since Madara was still alive :P although no longer as a part of the clan, though.