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Kabuto's image
Wouldn't it make more sense to replace it with one that actually shows his eyes? His glasses obscure them on the one that's used at the present.--Elveonora (talk) 11:59, September 22, 2014 (UTC)
Bump--Elveonora (talk) 09:28, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
Orochimaru
When fighting Sage Mode Kabuto, Sasuke mentions that Orochimaru used imperfect Sage Mode. Also, he was said by Kabuto to have learned how to use it, only not being able to use it because he didn't have the right body. Orochimaru's imperfect Sage Mode that Sasuke referred to is probably his "Great White Serpent" form, which has the same eyes that Kabuto has when he goes into Sage Mode.--Neffyarious (talk) 13:31, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- No, that form was a result of genetic experimentation, but I agree Orochimaru is a user--Elveonora (talk) 13:48, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
I also agree that he is a user since it was stated but that form was said to be his true form that he obtained from long years of experiments done on himself. Munchvtec (talk) 14:00, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
Sage Mode is a state that results from Senjutsu chakra. Orochimaru can produce and absorb Senjutsu chakra, meaning he can use Sage Mode. Just because his host bodies can't doesn't mean he shouldn't be listed, after all, he learned Senjutsu before he transferred for the first time and absorbed Senjutsu chakra from Kabuto while having his own body.--Elveonora (talk) 14:08, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
He isn't a user. Kabuto said that Orochimaru was unable to use Sage Mode. • Seelentau 愛 議 14:45, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- He said that Orochimaru couldn't find a suitable host body to withstand Sage Mode, not that he didn't learn it and couldn't use it with his own body, since he obviously could, otherwise how would he produce and absorb senjutsu chakra?--Elveonora (talk) 15:10, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- One doesn't have to be in Sage Mode to make use of senjutsu chakra (if you did, Madara taking Hashirama's chakra and not turning to stone wouldn't be at thing) one doesn't automatically enter Sage Mode by having access to senjutsu chakra. Now that being said, Orochimaru may know how to enter Sage Mode but if he couldn't ever actually do it then he can't use it.--TheUltimate3
(talk) 15:15, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- Then how does one enter Sage Mode besides molding Senjutsu chakra? Because from what we have seen, it happens just like that, no activation needed. Naruto deactivated his clones who had gathered natural energy and molded Senjutsu chakra, having their chakras return to his real body and boom! Sage Mode happens, there's no hand seal or anything. And Madara didn't turn into stone because he could control said chakra according to his own words--Elveonora (talk) 15:21, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- I agree with @TU3 in this one, Orochimaru might know everything about Sage Mode and its procedure but Kabuto clearly said that he wasn't able to use it. I could make a research about planes and how to fly them but if I have never flown one, I'm not a pilot, I don't know if that's a good example of my point. I believe that what @TU3 was trying to say is that being able to use senjutsu chakra is not equal to be in Sage Mode, like Jugo for example. So, I don't think Orochimaru is a user. LeoHatake 16:07, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- But Jugo IS using Sage Mode, that being Sage Transformation, I brought that up many times. And Orochimaru doesn't only know about Senjutsu, he can produce Senjutsu chakra and absorb it. There's no evidence at all that Sage Mode is anything else but having Senjutsu chakra flow thorough your body--Elveonora (talk) 16:35, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- I agree with @TU3 in this one, Orochimaru might know everything about Sage Mode and its procedure but Kabuto clearly said that he wasn't able to use it. I could make a research about planes and how to fly them but if I have never flown one, I'm not a pilot, I don't know if that's a good example of my point. I believe that what @TU3 was trying to say is that being able to use senjutsu chakra is not equal to be in Sage Mode, like Jugo for example. So, I don't think Orochimaru is a user. LeoHatake 16:07, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- Then how does one enter Sage Mode besides molding Senjutsu chakra? Because from what we have seen, it happens just like that, no activation needed. Naruto deactivated his clones who had gathered natural energy and molded Senjutsu chakra, having their chakras return to his real body and boom! Sage Mode happens, there's no hand seal or anything. And Madara didn't turn into stone because he could control said chakra according to his own words--Elveonora (talk) 15:21, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- One doesn't have to be in Sage Mode to make use of senjutsu chakra (if you did, Madara taking Hashirama's chakra and not turning to stone wouldn't be at thing) one doesn't automatically enter Sage Mode by having access to senjutsu chakra. Now that being said, Orochimaru may know how to enter Sage Mode but if he couldn't ever actually do it then he can't use it.--TheUltimate3
@Leo please stop trying to end the discussion short. @elve, i believe what you are saying because it's true...there is nothing that states that senjutsu is anything else. Munchvtec (talk) 16:42, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
@Leo, because it's a mistake Jugo isn't listed that I would like corrected. Sage Transformation is Sage Mode with mutating bodily fluids as extra, that's all. Not having Jugo listed is like crediting someone with Lightning Release Shadow Clone but not Shadow Clone Technique. And anyone is yet to show that Sage Mode is anything but Senjutsu chakra flowing through their bodies, because all the manga says and shows just that--Elveonora (talk) 16:46, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
Jesus Christ. The manga states that Orochimaru can not enter Sage Mode. I don't give a fuck about the reason he couldn't or what the difference between using Senjutsu chakra and Sage Mode is. He could not enter Sage Mode so he won't be listed as a user. • Seelentau 愛 議 16:50, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
Alright man calm done. Munchvtec (talk) 16:51, September 24, 2014 (UTC)
- @Munchvtec What? Is it wrong to end a discussion short? Sorry if I'm not used to the long, unnecessary, and endless debates that is placed around here. It Is better to conclude a discussion short and clear with facts, that continue and reach a discussion that only will contain theories, assumptions, speculations and resentments between users. @Elveonora, the Jugo as user is another discussion, if you want open that can, you are free to do it but here we are talking about Orochimaru. Orochimaru is not listed because Kabuto mentioned that he didn't use it, and if you make that Jugo is listed as a user, then, I will in your path, otherwise, I'm not. LeoHatake 16:59, September 24, 2014 (UTC)