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  • No plot Armor Power ups which means Naruto in the Pain's Assault arc right after learning Sage mode and Sasuke when he fought Danzo, I think everything after that were unearned bs power ups. I know I'm biased since Kisame is my favorite but Ill give this to Itachi and Kisame. Itachi would fight Sasuke since the Sharingan is way too op and Naruto would fight Kisame. Naruto will get close to Kisame and Samehada will start absorbing chakra then Naruto would try his Wind Release: Rasenshuriken to defeat Kisame and Kisame will counter with Water Release: Great Shark Bullet Technique which gets bigger and more powerful the stronger the enemy's attack is so after absorbing Naruto's attack it would be devastating taking out everything in sight. Itachi would have to keep Sasuke occupied since I don't think Kisame is good against genjutsu but once Naruto is out Kisame and Itachi would take out Sasuke pretty quick and remember that there's no plot armor here so as soon as Naruto falls down Kisame would cut off his head so he doesn't come back out of nowhere. Again, I know I'm biased but the reality is that the only one who could have taken out Kisame is Guy because Daytime Tiger is not a Chakra based attack, any other attack would have been absorbed by Water Release: Great Shark Bullet and Kisame would have won.

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    • If Kisame absorbs Naruto's chakra while he is in Sage Mode, he and Samehada are done. They get turned into stone just like Pain did.

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    • Samehada is the one absorbing Chakra, not Kisame and it would only turn to stone if it absorbs TOO MUCH chakra unless they've received some kind of training in Sage mode (and who's to say Kisame's Sharks don't know Sage mode, he already looks like a shark anyway), also, with Water Release: Great Shark Bullet its the jutsu itself absorbing Chakra and getting stronger, not Kisame and I'm pretty sure you cant turn water into stone.

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    • Pain was absorning Senjutsu chakra fine, it was when Naruto starting gathering immense amounts all of a sudden that the fat path started to turn to a frog, then stone.

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    • FlatZone wrote: Pain was absorning Senjutsu chakra fine, it was when Naruto starting gathering immense amounts all of a sudden that the fat path started to turn to a frog, then stone.

      "Immense amounts" is subjective, it was obvious Naruto was absorbing enough to activate Sage Mode but that's it.

      @The Shark Sage Kisame doesn't know Sage Mode. We don't deal with hypothetical abilities characters might have. Either they showed they have it as a feat, or it's written in their databook profiles. Kisame has neither.

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    • Obviously Naruto’s ninjutsu attacks contain small amouts of sage chakra compared to his overall body, so there is no wonder that Pain didn’t turn into a stone from a rasenshuriken.

      On the other hand, Samehada was able to absorb 6 tails worth of chakra from Bee, which is more than Naruto’s overall chakra. Imagine that amount in Sage chakra... there is no way samehada or Kisama ( if he absorbs it) can handle it.

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    • @Shark Sage regarding your OP as well, how is NTCM or Kurama mode a bs plot power up? Naruto had to fight Kurama for his power, then he had to earn Kurama's respect and trust for Kurama mode. I mean, it's your discussion so it's fine to restrict it to Sage Mode, but it's weird that you consider his power up bs considering he fought hard for NTCM and had to prove himself over the course of the series for Kurama mode.

      Weirder still that you consider Sasuke's MS an earned power up when Sasuke literally only had to learn the truth about Itachi to unlock it. He literally got MS because Obito talked to him.

      Anyways, how is Kisame going to deal with Frog Kumite? He can't predict or dodge any of it, there's nothing stopping from him getting pummeled into the ground. Not only that, Sage Mode grants sensing that allows prediction comparable to the Sharingan. Naruto used it to outmaneuver the Third Raikage, who's way faster than Kisame. What's Kisame going to do?

      But overall, while I think Naruto could hold his own with and conceivably beat Kisame, I think Itachi would beat Sasuke first. Sasuke with MS was honestly not that smart of a fighter. He had his moments (like Genjutsu on Danzo's arm), but for the most part he just spammed his MS abilities. He spammed his abilities for like 2 major battles before he was closing in on blindness. Itachi is smarter, has more experience with MS, and it's implied that Itachi could have killed Sasuke in their last fight. I'm pretty sure he could do it here.

      And I think Kisame and Itachi together overwhelm Naruto

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    • Obito implies that even while sick and dying Itachi could have killed Sasuke if he wanted to, he also says that if not for Itachi not knowing his secret(kamui's workings), Itachi would have killed Obito too. Kisame also admits Itachi is stronger than he is. So with no plot protection and taking away feelings and emotions for each other Itachi will kill Sasuke, then move onto help Kisame kill Naruto and with Itachi and Kisame working together they will succeed.

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    • Now hold on a minute, if think we are underestimating Sasuke here. CM Sasuke still put up a good fight against Itachi, by Itachi's on acknowledgement. MS Sasuke is stronger than CM2 Sasuke, especially his more experienced version like the one who fought Danzo.

      Sasuke's amaterasu is superior to Itachi's. Sasuke already broke out of tsukuyomi before he even had MS. Sasuke's susanoo is inferior to Itachi's, but he is not shabby at all, especially with the long range arrows attacks.

      If Naruto somehow deals with Kisame earlier and joins the battle, Itachi has no chance against both of them. Even in 1 vs 1, i think he beats Sasuke with high difficulty.

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    • Itachi has SoT and Yata Mirror along with Tsukuyomi who who Naruto won't be able to make it out as it only lasts a second in real time. Sasuke was only putting up a good fight against someone who was sick and dying along with being nearly blind... who also did not want to kill Sasuke, but wanted Sasuke to kill him. MS Sasuke needed to be healed by Karin and Jugo when fighting against B, the Kage, and Danzo. With no Jugo and no Karin to help him he will be defeated for sure. Kisame also defeated Killer B who was whooping MS Sasuke's ass and let Sasuke think he won at the end so B could escape Kumo. Sage Mode Naruto will be the main guy on his team but in the end I don't see Naruto's team winning this battle that has no plot protection and no emotional baggage and blocks going on.

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    • Isn't Itachi in the same state as he was when he fought Sasuke? "Sick and half blind"?

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    • I think a lot of people are underestimating Kisame in this fight, he can use Water Prison Shark Dance Technique which can trap everyone in water and Water Release: Great Shark Bullet Technique which are the two strongest water jutsu we have seen in the Narutoverse and as was stated before he was able to defeat B, I don't think Naruto (or Sasuke) has any way to stop Water Release: Great Shark Bullet Technique since everything Naruto uses is based on chakra which would only make the Jutsu stronger. Guy had to open 7 gates to defeat a weakened Samehada-less Kisame

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    • It is correct that Water Release: Great Shark Bullet Technique is a major threat to Sasuke and Naruto as they use ninjutsu and chakra constructs as their main style so that right there will be a major problem for them alone, Naruto's senjutsu is the only thing I question.. will it make the shark bullet a senjutsu enhanced shark bullet? therefor becoming even more powerful? Kisame and Itachi working together seems a bit OP in this scenario honestly.. they were definitely an OP team to begin with.

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    • Great Shark Bullet is made to absorb regular chakra. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be able to absorb Sage chakra, since it's inherently different in properties, like how Senjutsu was unaffected by nullification of Ninjutsu.

      @The Shark Sage you didn't answer my question, what would Kisame do against Frog Kumite?

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    • Sage chakra is just chakra blended with natural energy, Pain was able to absorb Sage chakra just like any chakra but it turned to stone which means Kisame's jutsu should be able to absorb Naruto's chakra just fine without the consequences because its the Jutsu absorbing it not Kisame himself so Naruto's sage chakra will never enter Kisame's body and a water shark Can't turn to stone. I agree that Frog Kata can be troublesome but its only a problem in CQC so after getting hit a couple of times I'm pretty sure Kisame will keep his distance and his long range Arsenal is much better than Naruto's. There's a reason frog kata is C-Rank, That technique is highly dependent on the user's Taijutsu skills and even if they enter CQC Naruto wont be able to take out Kisame in one hit like he did Pain, There's also Samehada so entering CQC with kisame would be a double edge sword, yes, Samehada will probably turn to stone but not before taking enough Chakra to weaken Naruto. If Kisame goes all out from the beginning he would probably use Water Prison Shark Dance Technique (S-rank) and keep chasing Naruto until he drowns anyway. Now that I'm thinking about it I think Itachi and Kisame's team may be too op so its unfair, I should have said Sasuke and Naruto right before the plot armor Six path power up.

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    • Pain could absorb Sage chakra, but he's actively taking in the power. Shark Bullet is a pre-made technique that is made to take in chakra only. That's why I doubt it can take in Sage chakra, since it has different properties than regular chakra.

      And while Pain could absorb Sage chakra himself, the Rinnegan is what allowed him to. Idk if we should compare a feat of the Rinnegan's to Shark Bullet.

      Rasenshuriken is a huge threat to Kisame in terms of long range. If it hits him, he can say goodbye to his ability to use chakra.

      Naruto can use Multi Shadow Clone to get out of Shark Dance Prison

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    • You are assuming that the Rinnegan allowed him to synchronize the Senjutsu chakra safely, when that isn't true. Madara had no eyeballs at all, and did the same thing albeit he had help from the Hashi face on his chest. It takes skill with chakra control and usage to do it and Pain had almost enough to keep going until Naruto starting absorbing large amounts of natural energy and Pain couldn't handle that volume so the fat path turned to stone. Not to mention Pain already absorbed Jiraiya's Giant Sage Powered Rasengan before.. it just comes down to Naruto taking in as much natural energy as he can and fat path couldn't control it all fast enough.

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    • @Flatzone I'm not assuming the Rinnegan allowed him to synchronize Senjutsu safely. I'm saying the Rinnegan is a powerful and almost all-encompassing tool. I'm saying the Rinnegan, by nature of being born so close to the beginning of Ninjutsu, and by nature of being directly descendant from the original embodiment of nature energy, should be able to absorb Senjutsu.

      And it in fact can. The user, however, needs to be able to handle the chakra, which is why Pain ended up the way that he did.

      Madara had that hashi boob, so it's different.

      Pain absorbed the giant Senjutsu Rasengan and that's fine, it makes sense for the Rinnegan to ba eble to do that.

      It doesn't make sense for a pre-made technique that was used by a non senjutsu user to have the properties to absorb Sage chakra at all.

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    • As I said before, Sage Chakra is just normal chakra mixed with Natural energy, any technique made to absorb chakra should be able to absorb Sage chakra, nowhere have I read or seen that sage chakra in immune to absorption, however, If you absorb too much Sage chakra without some kind of Sage training you will turn to stone.

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    • The Shark Sage wrote: As I said before, Sage Chakra is just normal chakra mixed with Natural energy, any technique made to absorb chakra should be able to absorb Sage chakra, nowhere have I read or seen that sage chakra in immune to absorption, however, If you absorb too much Sage chakra without some kind of Sage training you will turn to stone.

      Again, Obito was unable to nullify Senjutsu attacks, so Senjutsu is inherently different from regular Ninjutsu.

      Sage chakra isn't immune to absorbtion obviously, but something has to be able to absorb it. The Rinnegan can for obvious reasons, but why would a random water tech by a non Sage user be able to?

      And in any case, let's say Kisame uses Shark Bullet and let's say it can absorb Senjutsu (which still doesn't make sense to me). Sasuke can see the mechanics of a technique with the Sharingan and simply say not to throw jutsu at it and only dodge.

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