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  • How did Hagoromo have the time to use Creation of All Things to separate the nine Bijuu from the Juubi before sealing the Juubi's physical body, the Demonic Statue of the Outer Path into the moon with his brother?

    Hagoromo and Hamura were in a fight with Kaguya/Juubi just prior to the sealing, if I remember correctly.

    They only won by sealing Kaguya/Juubi, which means Hagoromo couldn't have had the time to use Creation of All Things to separate the nine Bijuu from the Juubi and then seal the Juubi's physical body, the Demonic Statue of the Outer Path into the moon with his brother.

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    • Hagoromo and Hamura won when they sealed the Juubi into Hagoromo himself. From there, Hagoromo eventually separated the 9 Bijuu out from the Gedo, which originally remained in his own body and allowed him to survive extraction. Then on his deathbed, he sealed the Gedo into the moon.

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    • Squinty97 wrote: Hagoromo and Hamura won when they sealed the Juubi into Hagoromo himself. From there, Hagoromo eventually separated the 9 Bijuu out from the Gedo, which originally remained in his own body and allowed him to survive extraction. Then on his deathbed, he sealed the Gedo into the moon.

      So Hagoromo and Hamura never sealed anything into the moon together?

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    • The problem is, there are different versions of the events. What @Squinty97 mentioned is one of them, if we go by the version told by Madara, Obito and Kurama. According to another one, mentioned by Hagoromo and Black Zetsu, Ootsutsuki brothers sealed the Demonic Statue, the husk of Ten-Tails, into Chibaku Tensei while sealing its chakra into Hagoromo. In other words, it means that Hagoromo created the tailed beasts purely out of Ten-Tails' chakra within himself.

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    • Ravenlot 27 wrote: The problem is, there are different versions of the events. What @Squinty97 mentioned is one of them, if we go by the version told by Madara, Obito and Kurama. According to another one, mentioned by Hagoromo and Black Zetsu, Ootsutsuki brothers sealed the Demonic Statue, the husk of Ten-Tails, into Chibaku Tensei while sealing its chakra into Hagoromo. In other words, it means that Hagoromo created the tailed beasts purely out of Ten-Tails' chakra within himself.

      Yeah, that's actually why I was confused. Not sure which version is true.

      But like I mentioned above, the version by Hagoromo and Black Zetsu has a problem.

      Hagoromo and Hamura couldn't have had the time to seal the Demonic Statue, the husk of Ten Tails, into Chibaku Tensei while sealing its chakra into Hagoromo as they were in a fight and the fight only ended with the sealing. Doesn't make sense at all if you think about it.

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    • If you think about it, it still makes sense. When Naruto and Sasuke sealed Kaguya with SP-CT, she transformed into Ten-Tails, then its chakra, the tailed beasts, left it, and only the Statue remained to be sealed. If we go by the same logic with Hagoromo and Hamura, the chakra must've been separated from the husk as well, the only thing, the beasts were yet to be shaped from this chakra.

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    • Ravenlot 27 wrote: If you think about it, it still makes sense. When Naruto and Sasuke sealed Kaguya with SP-CT, she transformed into Ten-Tails, then its chakra, the tailed beasts, left it, and only the Statue remained to be sealed. If we go by the same logic with Hagoromo and Hamura, the chakra must've been separated from the husk as well, the only thing, the beasts were yet to be shaped from this chakra.

      Oh yeah I forgot about that. This makes sense. It could have happened that way. Now the only problem left is which version of events to accept.

      I think the version by Madara, Obito and Kurama is more likely because it seemed like Hagoromo survived the extraction of the bijuu chakra for a period of time after the nine Bijuu were created. Like what Squinty97 mentioned above.

      The Gedo in his body allowing him to survive that extraction seems the most logical explanation imo. Unless he survived because he's an Otsutsuki or something like that.

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    • I'm also not sure what version is more correct since the events with Ootsutsuki on Earth have been continiously retconned to this point. The main plothole of Madara/Obito/Kurama version is the fact that Hamura doesn't get mentioned at all, while the plothole of other version is Hagoromo's survival after the beasts' extraction.

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    • If we combine both versions, it somewhat makes sense:
      
      • Hagoromo and Hamura perform SP:CT on Kaguya (Jubi)
      • she turns into Gedo Mazo as her chakra gets extracted in the process
      • said chakra is sealed into Hagoromo
      • sometime later, Hagoromo extracts said chakra from himself, separates it into 9 parts and gives life to each with creation of all things
      • Hagoromo summons Gedo Mazo from the Moon, seals it into himself to stay alive
      • Hagoromo then sends Gedo Mazo back to the Moon when he decides that it's his time to die

      Shrug

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    • Obito and Madara's version is irrelevent. They werent there and Madara was shown to be fed false information by Black Zetsu. Im also pretty sure Madara/Black Zetsu told Obito the stories he knew.

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    • The problem is, Kurama himself references the fact that Hagoromo was on Gedo Mazo life support.

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    • Wait, where the divine tree go in all this?

      Kaguya fused with it when she bacame the ten tails

      So could it have helped Hagoromo with surviving the extraction?

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    • The tree was the body

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    • LegionZero wrote: The tree was the body

      Not quite. Kaguya + God Tree = Ten-Tails, and from the moment they fused, there's no tree as a separate entity. Yes, Kaguya managed to regain her human form during Naruto/Sasuke battle, but we can say that she effectively absorbed all the tree into herself.

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    • Ravenlot 27 wrote:

      LegionZero wrote: The tree was the body

      Not quite. Kaguya + God Tree = Ten-Tails, and from the moment they fused, there's no tree as a separate entity. Yes, Kaguya managed to regain her human form during Naruto/Sasuke battle, but we can say that she effectively absorbed all the tree into herself.

      So would the tree + Kaguya body = gedo mazo?

      I mean the bijuu are put into it and the ten tails is created, then Obito expels the tree after and Madara is able to absorb it, but when the tree is expelled the gedo mazo who is also expelled from obito has the same form

      So would be a good assumpion to think that before the ten tails revival the tree was fused with the gedo mazo and formed a different creature, or ws it like sealed inside like the bijuu were?

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    • Ravenlot 27 wrote:

      LegionZero wrote: The tree was the body

      Not quite. Kaguya + God Tree = Ten-Tails, and from the moment they fused, there's no tree as a separate entity. Yes, Kaguya managed to regain her human form during Naruto/Sasuke battle, but we can say that she effectively absorbed all the tree into herself.

      The tree can be separated. You are pretty much spot on about the rest of it

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    • Elveonora wrote:

      If we combine both versions, it somewhat makes sense:
      
      • Hagoromo and Hamura perform SP:CT on Kaguya (Jubi)
      • she turns into Gedo Mazo as her chakra gets extracted in the process
      • said chakra is sealed into Hagoromo
      • sometime later, Hagoromo extracts said chakra from himself, separates it into 9 parts and gives life to each with creation of all things
      • Hagoromo summons Gedo Mazo from the Moon, seals it into himself to stay alive
      • Hagoromo then sends Gedo Mazo back to the Moon when he decides that it's his time to die

      Shrug

      Eh this seems like the most simple explanation which reconciles the two versions. Just going to run with this.

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